When attaching a light to an object, moray extrapolates the position and
then places the light with the others in the front of the script.  Does
the latest build of moray STILL do this??  It's annoying when you want
to animate something and the transformations get complex because of
CSG's parenting all the down to "great grandchildren."

I want the light to be *included* in the object declaration JUST as I
have placed it in the modeller- I want it actually attached!  grrrrr....

Sorry if I sound angry but I spent about two hours last night trying to
figure out what the h$%^ was going on in an animation involving 750
objects (300 of them in one csg thingy that I don't even want to
contemplate anymore).

At any rate- hand attaching it isn't a problem except that the file is
thousands of lines long and I need to generate hundreds of these things
and yes, *I'M LAZY!*.

So... Lutz, how about it?  What does the latest windows build do and/or
can you make this an option or a fix?

-- 
Stuff for POLYRAY, some raytraced images, and
DTA can be found at:
http://www.europa.ccom/~dearmad

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Dearmad wrote:

>

*SNIP*

>
>
> At any rate- hand attaching it isn't a problem except that the file is
> thousands of lines long and I need to generate hundreds of these things
> and yes, *I'M LAZY!*.
>

Lazy? Lazy? Just the thought of doing this stuff makes the sweat break out
on my brow.

> So... Lutz, how about it?  What does the latest windows build do and/or
> can you make this an option or a fix?
>
> --
> Stuff for POLYRAY, some raytraced images, and
> DTA can be found at:
> http://www.europa.ccom/~dearmad



--
Only I can prevent narcissism!

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Alex Magidow schrieb in Nachricht <36E342FE.D8753097@mninter.net>...
>Dearmad wrote:
[...]
>> At any rate- hand attaching it isn't a problem except that the file is
>> thousands of lines long and I need to generate hundreds of these things
>> and yes, *I'M LAZY!*.


>Lazy? Lazy? Just the thought of doing this stuff makes the sweat break out
>on my brow.

And modellers were made to make this kind of stuff unnnecessary, otherwise
we could just as well hand code everything, not using Moray at all <g>.

--
Rudy Velthuis

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Rudy Velthuis wrote:
> 
> Alex Magidow schrieb in Nachricht <36E342FE.D8753097@mninter.net>...
> >Dearmad wrote:
> [...]
> >> At any rate- hand attaching it isn't a problem except that the file is
> >> thousands of lines long and I need to generate hundreds of these things
> >> and yes, *I'M LAZY!*.
> 
> >Lazy? Lazy? Just the thought of doing this stuff makes the sweat break out
> >on my brow.
> 
> And modellers were made to make this kind of stuff unnnecessary, otherwise
> we could just as well hand code everything, not using Moray at all <g>.
> 
> --
> Rudy Velthuis

  You mean to tell me that Moray is a modelling program and not just a
friendly guy that helps everybody with their scenes ? I think I missed
that connection somewhere along the line. I always thought that hand
coding was the only option available. Gee !



-- 
Ken Tyler

mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net

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Ken schrieb in Nachricht <36E3D079.BA21A4BE@pacbell.net>...
>Rudy Velthuis wrote:
>>
>> Alex Magidow schrieb in Nachricht <36E342FE.D8753097@mninter.net>...
>> >Dearmad wrote:
>> [...]
>> >> At any rate- hand attaching it isn't a problem except that the file is
>> >> thousands of lines long and I need to generate hundreds of these
things
>> >> and yes, *I'M LAZY!*.
>>
>> >Lazy? Lazy? Just the thought of doing this stuff makes the sweat break
out
>> >on my brow.
>>
>> And modellers were made to make this kind of stuff unnnecessary,
otherwise
>> we could just as well hand code everything, not using Moray at all <g>.
>>
>> --
>> Rudy Velthuis
>
>  You mean to tell me that Moray is a modelling program and not just a
>friendly guy that helps everybody with their scenes ? I think I missed
>that connection somewhere along the line. I always thought that hand
>coding was the only option available. Gee !


Dunno exactly how to answer this.

What I was trying to say, you don't have to be *lazy* to expect a modeller
to output exactly what you (tried) to input. I think a modeller like Moray
should really keep the light sources in the group, if you can group them
anyway. What's the use of grouping otherwise? So it should either not allow
to group them in, or really keep them there.

But then perhaps I just didn't understand your answer. :-)

BTW Moray is also a kind of fish, afaik.

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Hi Dearmad, you recently wrote in moray.win:

> I want the light to be *included* in the object declaration JUST as I
> have placed it in the modeller- I want it actually attached!  grrrrr....
The current build still extracts the lights to the beginning of the
script. The reason is partly historic (the raytracer I started writing
Moray for needed them seperate from the objects) and partly because
POV-Ray doesn't handle spotlight in non-uniform scaled groups
correctly and it was too much of a headache to account for this with
the wireframe. I realize that not many people will run into this
problem, so I will see if I can leave the lights in the CSG in the
next release (hopefully this year).

- Lutz
  email : lut### [at] stmuccom
  Web   : http://www.stmuc.com/moray

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Hey, sorry, I was just expressing respect for a very nice member of the POV-Ray
community. I, personally, upon running into a problem of similar complexity,
given up pretty quickly, and not persevered quite as much as Dearmad did. I give
him my complete respect, and I also give Moray my complete respect.

Rudy Velthuis wrote:

> BTW Moray is also a kind of fish, afaik.

 Actually, an eel...or a social no-no....

--
Only I can prevent narcissism!

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You know... I can never start a thread when I want to... and now... :o)

Seriously, Lutz puts out a dman fine program- it's just that he's the
unwitting victim of me using MORAY as a keyframe generator for my
Tweener program, which needs to parse the scripted output (as I have no
access to the .MDL format) and so I NEED, I say I *NEED* to have
CONSISTENCY (sp) in the data so my Tweener program knows where to grab
digits from and how to place them in the heirarchy.  I just noticed that
a light wasn't tracking correctly in a little scene I made and then I
realized *why*.  I have yet to attach anything to the *camera* heaven
forbid and won't bother doing that! ;o)

I've been able to program around a LOT of the little oddities MORAY does
when it outputs scriptfiles but this one was too much for me to think of
a way to let my program figure out where to replace the light so it
tracked correctly in a particularly nasty CSG set that goes about 7
levels deep (due to joint needing to bend a certain way).

-er-  my only little point here is that my "Lazy" paragraph was more a
bow or a nod to Lutz' hard work.  From my perspective as an amateur
programmer I can only imagine the details Lutz must go through for moray
and I wanted him to realize that I wasn't coming across as a whiney
user- I've reg'ed v2.02 DOS and am "upgrading" to v2.5 in a bit, so I'm
behind the times with MORAY anyway!  :o)

-Peter

Alex Magidow wrote:
> 
> Hey, sorry, I was just expressing respect for a very nice member of the POV-Ray
> community. I, personally, upon running into a problem of similar complexity,
> given up pretty quickly, and not persevered quite as much as Dearmad did. I give
> him my complete respect, and I also give Moray my complete respect.
> 
> Rudy Velthuis wrote:
> 
> > BTW Moray is also a kind of fish, afaik.
> 
>  Actually, an eel...or a social no-no....
> 
> --
> Only I can prevent narcissism!

-- 
Stuff for POLYRAY, some raytraced images, and
DTA can be found at:
http://www.europa.ccom/~dearmad

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Lutz Kretzschmar wrote:
> 
> Hi Dearmad, you recently wrote in moray.win:
> 
> > I want the light to be *included* in the object declaration JUST as I
> > have placed it in the modeller- I want it actually attached!  grrrrr....
> The current build still extracts the lights to the beginning of the
> script. The reason is partly historic (the raytracer I started writing
> Moray for needed them seperate from the objects) and partly because
> POV-Ray doesn't handle spotlight in non-uniform scaled groups
> correctly and it was too much of a headache to account for this with
> the wireframe. I realize that not many people will run into this
> problem, so I will see if I can leave the lights in the CSG in the
> next release (hopefully this year).

hehe... and after that version has been out for a year or so I'll get
around to using it... I'm just about ready to upgrade my v2.02 to 2.5
here soon... ;o)

thanks a ton for all the other stuff you're doin'.

> 
> - Lutz
>   email : lut### [at] stmuccom
>   Web   : http://www.stmuc.com/moray

-- 
Stuff for POLYRAY, some raytraced images, and
DTA can be found at:
http://www.europa.ccom/~dearmad

Post a reply to this message

Hi Dearmad, you recently wrote in moray.win:

Thanks for the kind words. Much appreciated.

> I've been able to program around a LOT of the little oddities MORAY does
> when it outputs scriptfiles but this one was too much for me to think of
> a way to let my program figure out where to replace the light so it
> tracked correctly in a particularly nasty CSG set that goes about 7
> levels deep (due to joint needing to bend a certain way).
Yes, and there is no way round it, because the information just where
that light is located in the object hierarchy is not exported. 

Now if you were using the plugin interface added in Moray V3.1 you'd
be able to completely integrate Tweener into Moray......<g>

- Lutz
  email : lut### [at] stmuccom
  Web   : http://www.stmuc.com/moray

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