IRTC is apparently unable to host animations because of the limitations of the
software language/ system is was designed under.

TC-RTC has not, IIRC, ever had either John vanSickle's "Rusty" character or
Markus' "Anthrosphinx" character. TC-RTC has had a couple of single and
zero-entry rounds for animation. And the latest round is "open," which sort of
means it's over.  So yes, I'm talking about starting over.

What would it take, John and Markus, (maybe even Matt) to get you to produce
another animation?  Could we come up with a contract, say that we all agree to
work on an animation under X criteria, and uploaded to Youtube by a certain
date? (If a hundred other pov'vers were making animations, I'd be delighted and
ignore those two guys, but somehow I think that the disappearance of regular
IRTC animators is key. )



Here's my proposed CONTRACT ON RAYTRACING, which is of course open to
negotiation.


i)   45 days [1]
ii)  20 sec to 2 mins [2]
iii) Same ol' raytracing requirements as IRTC, TC_RTC. [3]
iv)  Upload to Youtube/ Vimeo with a certain tag  [4]
v)   A randomly chosen topic from a list of umpteen that are acceptable to the
contracting parties beforehand. [5]
vi)  Voting open-ended, possibly not necessary [6]


[1] Say your nephew came over and was delighted with your animation ability, and
asked you to show him how it worked. And you made a walk cycle for him on the
spot. That's the kind of fun I'm trying to capture.  If on the other hand,
someone asked you to submit work that would be judged alongside that of M.F.A.
students who each has 120 days to polish an entry, I'm guessing you'd have a lot
more anguish. If you knew the quality of EVERYONE'S work was bounded by having a
short time, you might be more relaxed and just have fun.


[2]  Some time limit. Maybe on the short end to encourage folks to make it
simpler.


[3]  Whatever


[4]  Unless someone's readily got their own system ready to roll at drop of a
hat. In one discussion a few years ago, someone said no youtube because that
involves too many compression artifacts. Let's just do something fun.


[5]  My preference is topics which evoke a fun, short character-based story,
either a scifi or 19th century sea adventure novel rather than generic
demonstrations of raytracing.

Jules Verne
http://www.gutenberg.org/browse/authors/v#a60

Joseph Conrad
http://www.gutenberg.org/browse/authors/c#a125

H.G. Wells
http://www.gutenberg.org/browse/authors/w#a30


[6]  If one of the contracting parties has a strong opinion here, I'll defer to
them.

--------------------------
FWIW, my real email address is at gmail, with the userid I used to register
here.

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On 14/06/2010 5:23 PM, gregjohn wrote:
> IRTC is apparently unable to host animations because of the limitations of the
> software language/ system is was designed under.
>
> TC-RTC has not, IIRC, ever had either John vanSickle's "Rusty" character or
> Markus' "Anthrosphinx" character. TC-RTC has had a couple of single and
> zero-entry rounds for animation. And the latest round is "open," which sort of
> means it's over.  So yes, I'm talking about starting over.

The TC-RTC is only an open topic because I could not get the animation 

able to find the time to contact the developer. (Thomas de Groot is 
looking after the stills side)

it to continue but that is dependent on people entering. So the more 
people that are interested the better. We are thinking of doing a 
rewrite of the site so any suggestions are welcome.


-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 14.06.2010 18:23, gregjohn wrote:
> IRTC is apparently unable to host animations because of the limitations of the
> software language/ system is was designed under.
>
> TC-RTC has not, IIRC, ever had either John vanSickle's "Rusty" character or
> Markus' "Anthrosphinx" character. TC-RTC has had a couple of single and
> zero-entry rounds for animation. And the latest round is "open," which sort of
> means it's over.  So yes, I'm talking about starting over.

Oh come on, I've had one ready for the TC-RTC opening:
http://tc-rtc.co.uk/displayallimages/animation/18/2007-May.html

It just didn't get voted on, so it's kinda in the 
back-catalog where you've got to know where to look for it :)

(I think I was the only one who tried the voting, so I ended 
up kicking my own entry (can't vote on it) off the list. D'oh ;)

> What would it take, John and Markus, (maybe even Matt) to get you to produce
> another animation?  Could we come up with a contract, say that we all agree to
> work on an animation under X criteria, and uploaded to Youtube by a certain
> date? (If a hundred other pov'vers were making animations, I'd be delighted and
> ignore those two guys, but somehow I think that the disappearance of regular
> IRTC animators is key. )


What would it take? Time and energy. Time isn't actually 
that bad, it's more of a energy/motivation thing. I feel I'm 
getting too old to pull 3D edit all-nighters AND show up to 
work the next morning... I'm still intrigued by the TC-RTC 
topics, and usually write down a screenplay, but when it 
comes to sitting down and actually turning it into 3D ... 
seeing what people with time and dedication at hand can come 
up with (vaguely looking at all those students of CG art and 
animation with their diploma works available on YouTube), I 
know that my output will never be polished enough or look 
anything like my imagination, so I end up with a ton of "why 
bother" crushing all intent to go beyond scripting and 
scribbling... :(

Though I *do* appreciate being mentioned here, after all 
that time (three years... sigh.) ... who knows, might as 
well try and bring the old girls back this time. :)

I'm not promising anything, mind you...

-Markus

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On 15/06/2010 10:22 AM, Markus Altendorff wrote:

> Oh come on, I've had one ready for the TC-RTC opening:
> http://tc-rtc.co.uk/displayallimages/animation/18/2007-May.html
>
> It just didn't get voted on, so it's kinda in the back-catalog where
> you've got to know where to look for it :)
>
> (I think I was the only one who tried the voting, so I ended up kicking
> my own entry (can't vote on it) off the list. D'oh ;)
>


allowed voting time. Shame that the automatic bonus for voting on all 
other entries was not working as you would have been at the top of the 
scoreboard.

>
> What would it take? Time and energy. Time isn't actually that bad, it's
> more of a energy/motivation thing. I feel I'm getting too old to pull 3D
> edit all-nighters AND show up to work the next morning... I'm still
> intrigued by the TC-RTC topics, and usually write down a screenplay, but
> when it comes to sitting down and actually turning it into 3D ... seeing
> what people with time and dedication at hand can come up with (vaguely
> looking at all those students of CG art and animation with their diploma
> works available on YouTube), I know that my output will never be
> polished enough or look anything like my imagination, so I end up with a
> ton of "why bother" crushing all intent to go beyond scripting and
> scribbling... :(
>

I agree, the effort is enormous when working full time. My last 


> Though I *do* appreciate being mentioned here, after all that time
> (three years... sigh.) ... who knows, might as well try and bring the
> old girls back this time. :)
>
> I'm not promising anything, mind you...
>

The animation section of TC-RTC has been way too quiet and it would be 
good if we could get it restarted again.

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

So Markus and Stephen,
These animations wipe out us old men, eh? So let's do animations which don't
wipe us out.  And my hypothesis in this regard has always been that a shorter
time to complete forces a simpler project, and limits the duration of agony for
a poorly designed one.  But I'll toss that idea out for whatever contest design,
youtube or TC-RTC would make the old IRTC Animators produce material again.
Markus, was your promise to *consider* producing, for an "open" TC-RTC round?


FWIW, I don't let myself lose sleep on these, but the 'puter. I set up the total
length, and first have a character doing a walk cycle throughout that total
length.  Then each day I compile an anim of the past night's render, make a few
tweaks, and re-render overnight.




Markus Altendorff <maa### [at] anthrosphinxde> wrote:
> Though I *do* appreciate being mentioned here, after all
> that time (three years... sigh.) ... who knows, might as
> well try and bring the old girls back this time. :)
>
> I'm not promising anything, mind you...
>
> -Markus

Post a reply to this message

On 15/06/2010 5:53 PM, gregjohn wrote:
>
> So Markus and Stephen,
> These animations wipe out us old men, eh? So let's do animations which don't
> wipe us out.

That's a good idea.

> And my hypothesis in this regard has always been that a shorter
> time to complete forces a simpler project, and limits the duration of agony for
> a poorly designed one.

I thought the opposite before but thinking about it, you're right.

> But I'll toss that idea out for whatever contest design,
> youtube or TC-RTC would make the old IRTC Animators produce material again.

We can have what ever we want for the TC-RTC and I like the idea of 
uploading a 10 Meg animation and posting a link to youtube as well.

> Markus, was your promise to *consider* producing, for an "open" TC-RTC round?
>
>
> FWIW, I don't let myself lose sleep on these, but the 'puter. I set up the total
> length, and first have a character doing a walk cycle throughout that total
> length.  Then each day I compile an anim of the past night's render, make a few
> tweaks, and re-render overnight.
>

Overnight rendering is de rigueur. :-)

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

On 16.06.2010 08:37, Stephen wrote:
> On 15/06/2010 5:53 PM, gregjohn wrote:
>>
>> So Markus and Stephen,
>> These animations wipe out us old men, eh? So let's do animations which
>> don't
>> wipe us out.
>
> That's a good idea.

Aw c'mon, if I bother to fire up the 3D, then I want to tell 
some kind of story, dangnabbit ;)

>> And my hypothesis in this regard has always been that a shorter
>> time to complete forces a simpler project, and limits the duration of
>> agony for
>> a poorly designed one.
>
> I thought the opposite before but thinking about it, you're right.

I beg to differ, but I'm easily persuaded :)

>> But I'll toss that idea out for whatever contest design,
>> youtube or TC-RTC would make the old IRTC Animators produce material
>> again.
>
> We can have what ever we want for the TC-RTC and I like the idea of
> uploading a 10 Meg animation and posting a link to youtube as well.

So far, my Youtubes have been "oh lookit here, the new 
Cinema4D can do bouncing cubes" ... not sure if throwing 
recreated tutorial output around is the right thing to get 
back into TC-RTCing ;)

>> Markus, was your promise to *consider* producing, for an "open" TC-RTC
>> round?

There's still time until August 31, I gather? See, my bat 
lady's wing mesh setup is pretty much in tatters at the 
moment, but I don't want to get back to a "legacy" 
configuration... :S

>> FWIW, I don't let myself lose sleep on these, but the 'puter. I set up
>> the total
>> length, and first have a character doing a walk cycle throughout that
>> total
>> length. Then each day I compile an anim of the past night's render,
>> make a few
>> tweaks, and re-render overnight.
>>
>
> Overnight rendering is de rigueur. :-)

Clustering isn't too shabby either :)

(though I must admit, since I switched from "idling 
workstation 2006" to "thin desktop 2009" for the daily 
computing stuff, my power bill has dropped by 1/3 ... and 
that tiny box is still good enough to complete a couple 
hundred frames overnight. Science! Progress! Isn't it 
wonderful?) ;)

-M

Post a reply to this message

On 16/06/2010 9:08 PM, Markus Altendorff wrote:

> Aw c'mon, if I bother to fire up the 3D, then I want to tell some kind
> of story, dangnabbit ;)
>

Your animations *do* tell a story. I on the other hand prefer doing 
cyclic animations where the story is inferred.

>>> And my hypothesis in this regard has always been that a shorter
>>> time to complete forces a simpler project, and limits the duration of
>>> agony for
>>> a poorly designed one.
>>
>> I thought the opposite before but thinking about it, you're right.
>
> I beg to differ, but I'm easily persuaded :)
>


out for me for the moment.

>>> But I'll toss that idea out for whatever contest design,
>>> youtube or TC-RTC would make the old IRTC Animators produce material
>>> again.
>>
>> We can have what ever we want for the TC-RTC and I like the idea of
>> uploading a 10 Meg animation and posting a link to youtube as well.
>
> So far, my Youtubes have been "oh lookit here, the new Cinema4D can do
> bouncing cubes" ... not sure if throwing recreated tutorial output
> around is the right thing to get back into TC-RTCing ;)
>

I meant it more along the lines of defeating the 10 Meg limit for 
uploaded files. But maybe YouTube is not the best place.

>>> Markus, was your promise to *consider* producing, for an "open" TC-RTC
>>> round?
>
> There's still time until August 31, I gather?

The animation side of the site seems to be broken ATM and the server is 
going to offline for a physical move this weekend. After that has been 

again. Since it has been very quiet we can start afresh if no-one is 
working on anything, maybe talk about new rules etc. There is some talk 
about redesigning the site as work experience for a graduating student.

> See, my bat lady's wing
> mesh setup is pretty much in tatters at the moment, but I don't want to
> get back to a "legacy" configuration... :S
>

Ouch!

>> Overnight rendering is de rigueur. :-)
>
> Clustering isn't too shabby either :)
>

Nice.

> (though I must admit, since I switched from "idling workstation 2006" to
> "thin desktop 2009" for the daily computing stuff, my power bill has
> dropped by 1/3 ... and that tiny box is still good enough to complete a
> couple hundred frames overnight. Science! Progress! Isn't it wonderful?) ;)

Truly :-D

-- 

Best Regards,
	Stephen

Post a reply to this message

gregjohn wrote:
> IRTC is apparently unable to host animations because of the limitations of the
> software language/ system is was designed under.
> 
> TC-RTC has not, IIRC, ever had either John vanSickle's "Rusty" character or
> Markus' "Anthrosphinx" character. TC-RTC has had a couple of single and
> zero-entry rounds for animation. And the latest round is "open," which sort of
> means it's over.  So yes, I'm talking about starting over.

The round based on the title "The Black Robe" had a Rusty entry.

> What would it take, John and Markus, (maybe even Matt) to get you to produce
> another animation?

How many sacks of gold are you offering?

I think it may be easier to set up the IRTC so that the animations are 
stored on YouTube.  Unless there are legal issues, it should not present 
any difficulty.

Regards,
John

Post a reply to this message

On 6/17/2010 6:39 AM, John VanSickle wrote:

> I think it may be easier to set up the IRTC so that the animations are
> stored on YouTube. Unless there are legal issues, it should not present
> any difficulty.

Hmm. That was my first thought, "Why not host the entries on YouTube, or 
Vimeo?"

I also wondered if there was some sort of legal issue with doing it that 
way. Youtube seems to allow better quality than it used to, so it's 
definitely a viable option.

-- 
~Mike

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