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On 4/28/2012 4:12, Patrick Elliott wrote:
> Yeah, have an external USB drive, which I got due to running out of space on
> the other two drives. Its just one of those things.. 1) its the same sort of
> media, to similarly volatile,
All backups are volatile to one extent or another.
> 2) unless it stays connected, and automatic backups happen, its not a
certain solution,
Well, yes, you have to run the backups. Hard to blame the technology on
that. Otherwise, get a second computer and do network backups to it on a
schedule or something.
3) if you do keep in connected,
> to do that, then some of the stuff that can kill the main drive *will* also
> kill the backup (like power surges).
Sure. Why would you keep your backups connected instead of in a fireproof safe?
> Practical to me means that at least 2 out of the 3 problem above are removed
> from the list of risks (with the, "it dies if the machine does", being one
> of the two in any case).
I think you have an implicit #4 there, which is "it's cheap". Because all
those problems are pretty easy to solve with a bit of money thrown at the
problem.
> There are a lot of poor backup solutions, and many of them come with idiot
> problems, like the OS whining about not letting you copy certain files, to
> back them up, which make full restoration a problem, even without the other
> issues above.
Sure. But say you have Win7. You buy a USB drive, and plug it in. The
autoplay pops up, and says "Hey, you want to use this as a backup drive?"
You say yes. It spins around for an hour. It says "OK, all done." You put it
in the safe.
It also offers to make a bootable CD to use in case of disaster to restore
what it just made. Make one of those, and put it in the safe also.
Next week, or whenever you get a new program installed, or whenever you copy
a bunch of vacation photos off your camera, or whatever, plug the drive in.
It says "Hey, you want to freshen your backup?" You say "Yes." It spins
aorund for 15 minutes, and then you unplug the drive and put it back in the
safe.
If you can't trust yourself to make backups when you've just done a whole
bunch of work on your machine, then the data just isn't worth it to you. I'd
like a car that doesn't run out of gas if I don't bother to stop at the gas
station too, but that's not available either.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
"Oh no! We're out of code juice!"
"Don't panic. There's beans and filters
in the cabinet."
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On 4/28/2012 4:19, Patrick Elliott wrote:
> I doubt Windows 7's new backup thing is that stupid, but since I never got a
> version of it to work on prior machines (bloody XP version thought
> "floppies" where the way to do things, and didn't know what to do with the
> CD drive, never mind a DVD drive...), I am not going to assume that it will
> work perfectly. lol
Actually, Vista got way better, and Win7 nailed it. XP didn't really have
the file system technology to support backups well. Win7 does. It's seamless.
That said, if anyone is still stuck on Vista or XP, ask me for my scripts.
It *is* possible to use free software to make complete backups of both those
machines, both full and incremental.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
"Oh no! We're out of code juice!"
"Don't panic. There's beans and filters
in the cabinet."
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On 4/28/2012 9:45, Darren New wrote:
> On 4/28/2012 4:05, Patrick Elliott wrote:
>> Got a fair number of games that flat won't run without those keys, and not
>> all of them are recoverable from the sites they originally got registered
>> to. All of which makes things a massive pain in the ass.
>
> Fair enough. I'd count that as installation materials, which you'd need to
> have to reinstall. Of course, the worst are when you get such a key, and it
> dials out to their server to verify it, and their server is toast after a
> few years. I've had a couple like that.
Or, incidentally, if you get one of those, dump the entire registry as a
text file and back *that* up. At least then in the event of disaster you can
find what you're looking for. (In regedit, save it as an NT4 registry, and
it'll be readable text, IIRC.)
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
"Oh no! We're out of code juice!"
"Don't panic. There's beans and filters
in the cabinet."
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On 28-4-2012 18:58, Darren New wrote:
> On 4/28/2012 9:45, Darren New wrote:
>> On 4/28/2012 4:05, Patrick Elliott wrote:
>>> Got a fair number of games that flat won't run without those keys,
>>> and not
>>> all of them are recoverable from the sites they originally got
>>> registered
>>> to. All of which makes things a massive pain in the ass.
>>
>> Fair enough. I'd count that as installation materials, which you'd
>> need to
>> have to reinstall. Of course, the worst are when you get such a key,
>> and it
>> dials out to their server to verify it, and their server is toast after a
>> few years. I've had a couple like that.
>
> Or, incidentally, if you get one of those, dump the entire registry as a
> text file and back *that* up. At least then in the event of disaster you
> can find what you're looking for. (In regedit, save it as an NT4
> registry, and it'll be readable text, IIRC.)
>
IIRC because programs under windows dump a lot of unnecessary data in
the registry, restoring from a backup will take more than a day (if it
ever completes, we have never waited more than a weekend)
According to my brother there are backups of the registry in System
Volume Information directory, IIRC also under a different name than the
actual registry files, just to make life easier.
I can not access that dir, I don't have permission (or my own machine at
home that is). You need to boot from a live-cd or connect the c-drive as
a secondary drive to another machine to have access.
--
tip: do not run in an unknown place when it is too dark to see the
floor, unless you prefer to not use uppercase.
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On 4/28/2012 9:50 AM, Darren New wrote:
>> Practical to me means that at least 2 out of the 3 problem above are
>> removed
>> from the list of risks (with the, "it dies if the machine does", being
>> one
>> of the two in any case).
>
> I think you have an implicit #4 there, which is "it's cheap". Because
> all those problems are pretty easy to solve with a bit of money thrown
> at the problem.
>
This has been on of those, I supposed "quarters" would be the proper
term, where it seems like everything I touch breaks, so.. throwing money
at the problem hasn't been high on my list of things I want to be doing. lol
>> There are a lot of poor backup solutions, and many of them come with
>> idiot
>> problems, like the OS whining about not letting you copy certain
>> files, to
>> back them up, which make full restoration a problem, even without the
>> other
>> issues above.
>
> Sure. But say you have Win7. You buy a USB drive, and plug it in. The
> autoplay pops up, and says "Hey, you want to use this as a backup
> drive?" You say yes. It spins around for an hour. It says "OK, all
> done." You put it in the safe.
>
> It also offers to make a bootable CD to use in case of disaster to
> restore what it just made. Make one of those, and put it in the safe also.
>
Hmm. Will have to remember that, once I get all the crap onto this one,
and the "backup" drive empty.
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On 4/28/2012 11:38, andrel wrote:
> IIRC because programs under windows dump a lot of unnecessary data in the
> registry, restoring from a backup will take more than a day (if it ever
> completes, we have never waited more than a weekend)
How in the world would it take more than a day? You're just copying a file.
Windows7 for example seems to restore files at pretty much disk-transfer
speed. I can do an image backup of my 40G system partition in about 15 or 20
minutes, tops, and restore just as easily.
> According to my brother there are backups of the registry in System Volume
> Information directory, IIRC also under a different name than the actual
> registry files, just to make life easier.
The only backup I know of is in C:\Windows\System32\config\RegBack
> I can not access that dir, I don't have permission (or my own machine at
> home that is). You need to boot from a live-cd or connect the c-drive as a
> secondary drive to another machine to have access.
Again, depends on the OS. But yes, I think you're probably right on that
one. It's really more a directory managed by the file system than a
protected directory.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
"Oh no! We're out of code juice!"
"Don't panic. There's beans and filters
in the cabinet."
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On 4/28/2012 13:52, Patrick Elliott wrote:
> Hmm. Will have to remember that, once I get all the crap onto this one, and
> the "backup" drive empty.
FWIW, if you make two partitions, one for bootable stuff and one for data,
it's much more efficient. Put Steam apps and vacation pics and stuff like
that on a non-bootable drive, or you wind up making 2 copies of all that,
the backup copy and the zip-file copy. (Indeed, exclude stuff you can
trivially replace, like the steam apps.)
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
"Oh no! We're out of code juice!"
"Don't panic. There's beans and filters
in the cabinet."
Post a reply to this message
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On 28-4-2012 23:12, Darren New wrote:
> On 4/28/2012 11:38, andrel wrote:
>> IIRC because programs under windows dump a lot of unnecessary data in the
>> registry, restoring from a backup will take more than a day (if it ever
>> completes, we have never waited more than a weekend)
>
> How in the world would it take more than a day?
Because you have to import it again :(
> You're just copying a file.
No, you are underestimating the geniuses in redmond.
The registry->text and text->registry conversions are slightly
unoptimized. It is probably OK on a fresh new machine, but in our
experience not so on a really well used one. The ones most likely to crash.
> Windows7 for example seems to restore files at pretty much
> disk-transfer speed. I can do an image backup of my 40G system partition
> in about 15 or 20 minutes, tops, and restore just as easily.
>> According to my brother there are backups of the registry in System
>> Volume
>> Information directory, IIRC also under a different name than the actual
>> registry files, just to make life easier.
>
> The only backup I know of is in C:\Windows\System32\config\RegBack
Funny, isn't it? There is apparently another one in another directory
under another name, that nobody told you about. One that is still there
after a reinstall. Pure Genius.
>> I can not access that dir, I don't have permission (or my own machine at
>> home that is). You need to boot from a live-cd or connect the c-drive
>> as a
>> secondary drive to another machine to have access.
>
> Again, depends on the OS. But yes, I think you're probably right on that
> one. It's really more a directory managed by the file system than a
> protected directory.
>
--
tip: do not run in an unknown place when it is too dark to see the
floor, unless you prefer to not use uppercase.
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On 4/28/2012 16:04, andrel wrote:
> No, you are underestimating the geniuses in redmond.
> The registry->text and text->registry conversions are slightly unoptimized.
Ah. I see. Why would you do it that way? Why not back up the registry, and
restore the registry, as a file? Or restore only the parts you need? Or at
least not store it as plain text?
I assumed if you were worried about the "junk" in the registry that you were
talking about backing up and restoring the entire registry.
>> The only backup I know of is in C:\Windows\System32\config\RegBack
>
> Funny, isn't it? There is apparently another one in another directory under
> another name, that nobody told you about. One that is still there after a
> reinstall. Pure Genius.
I didn't say there wasn't. I was giving the path to the backup copy of the
registry to others in the group who seem to have a hard time using the
included tools to make a backup of the registry. :-)
Altho, again, I'm not sure why, if you did a full reinstall, you would want
the old registry to be restored.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
"Oh no! We're out of code juice!"
"Don't panic. There's beans and filters
in the cabinet."
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On 28/04/2012 10:15 PM, Darren New wrote:
> On 4/28/2012 13:52, Patrick Elliott wrote:
>> Hmm. Will have to remember that, once I get all the crap onto this
>> one, and
>> the "backup" drive empty.
>
> FWIW, if you make two partitions, one for bootable stuff and one for
> data, it's much more efficient. Put Steam apps and vacation pics and
> stuff like that on a non-bootable drive, or you wind up making 2 copies
> of all that, the backup copy and the zip-file copy. (Indeed, exclude
> stuff you can trivially replace, like the steam apps.)
>
>
Not only that, if you have to reinstall Windows. Your data disc will not
be reformatted.
--
Regards
Stephen
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