ABX wrote:

> Good. So I finally contributed Capriccio. I'm happy about that :-)

Welcome to the club :)

> BTW: After looking into your code I know more what you do - do you know instead
> using layared texture you can use repeating warp? This should be fastest
> solution.

Thanks again! I'm not so familiar with 'warp'. Now I have to learn it in details :)

Gena.

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Christoph Hormann wrote:

> Nice posts.

Thanks!

> I did not yet study the code but i suppose it won't be that
> easy to make their cylindrical shape a bit less uniform.

This is intersection between isosurface and heightfield (based
on function). I tried to make difference between isosurfaces
but I couldn't avoid holes in the result object even changing
max_gradient and accuracy.
I can add spline to the posts. But that will just curve it. Anyway
feel free to change it.

> Ib's work on the building is impressive as well.  The texture should
> probably be somewhat patina-like - somethinbg quite difficult to achieve
> without being too slow.

Yep. I think image map won't be so slow here :) I would also prefer to use
procedural texture here but I know how difficult is to make such kind of
texture.

> I'm not sure about the change of the light position.  The left side
> buildings are different from the original now but of course we have to
> find a compromise because the lighting in the painting is not consistent.

I also think that those buildings are too bright now and I'm going to
change their saturation in the future.
As for light source position, I tried to make cathedral and boat in the
center more illuminated.

Gena.

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Gena wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
> This is intersection between isosurface and heightfield (based
> on function). I tried to make difference between isosurfaces
> but I couldn't avoid holes in the result object even changing
> max_gradient and accuracy.

See the documentation for 'max_trace' and 'all_intersections'.  Of course
you can also intersect in the isosurface function and just use one
isosurface.

I think they look a bit like they have bark on the outer surface, a rough
and weathered but mainly plain wood surface would probably be better.  I
will see if i can work on that.

Christoph

-- 
POV-Ray tutorials, include files, Sim-POV,
HCR-Edit and more: http://www.tu-bs.de/~y0013390/
Last updated 28 Feb. 2003 _____./\/^>_*_<^\/\.______

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Peter Popov wrote:

> I think the figures in the boats are not up to the same level of
> detail as the other parts of the picture, even as compared to the
> figures on the stairs. No offense to the contributor, just some
> constructive criticism :)

I think evrybody agrees that human figures are always one of the
most difficult part of any image, especially when you model it
yourself from the scratch. Jim created already exceptional models
for this image. Maybe it would be also a good idea to share
Wings3D source files (if Jim don't mind of course) so that anybody
who feels that he/she can improve it could change it and show us
the result.

Regarding level of details, maybe playing with image/bump maps
will help here. Also in a high resolution image will be visible a lack
of hair in some figures. Again maybe image/bump maps could
help here or any other technique.

Anyway, I think before making the final rendering we will make
fine tuning of many objects :)

Gena.

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Gena wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
> Regarding level of details, maybe playing with image/bump maps
> will help here. Also in a high resolution image will be visible a lack
> of hair in some figures. Again maybe image/bump maps could
> help here or any other technique.

I agree on that.  In the larger renders i did i can hardly find mesh
artefacts so the geometric detail is fairly good.  Of course some parts
like the hands are not perfect but this is not a big problem IMO and maybe
it can even be improved.  The textures are an important thing to work on. 
It would also be good if the boats could get some uv-coordinates so they
can be covered with a wood texture without looking carved from a large
block of wood.

Christoph

-- 
POV-Ray tutorials, include files, Sim-POV,
HCR-Edit and more: http://www.tu-bs.de/~y0013390/
Last updated 28 Feb. 2003 _____./\/^>_*_<^\/\.______

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Gena Obukhov wrote:

> New version with some details.
> Added wooden posts and changed light source position.


Nice posts. Don't we need some more steps at the lower edge of the image?

/Ib

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Peter Popov wrote:

> 
> I think the figures in the boats are not up to the same level of
> detail as the other parts of the picture, even as compared to the
> figures on the stairs. No offense to the contributor, 

No offense taken.  Early on I feared that it might come to this, 
especially when we started talking about rendering in poster size.
It wasn't what I'd bargained for when I took on resposibility for the 
figures.  I thought originally that a fairly brief handling would suffice.
What I would like to do is slide up to the Metropolitan and take a look 
at how figures are usually handled in this genre.  I don't know if they 
have a Marlow but they do have a nice group of Canaletto's.  Maybe I can 
see some details of clothing more clearly.
I probably should have done this already, but every time I go up there I 
get drawn in by the primitive collections.  Was just up there on Friday 
soaking up the Art of Ancient Cities exhibit along with the African 
Masks, as usual :)  Anyway, the comment about the level of detail in the 
figures is a valid one.  Just give me a little time to think about how 
best to solve it.  If I don't think I can, I will gladly hand off any 
sources and responsibilities to others.

-Jim

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Jim Charter wrote:

> at how figures are usually handled in this genre.  I don't know if they
> have a Marlow but they do have a nice group of Canaletto's.

BTW, I found that Marlow's painting in the book about Canaletto :)

Gena.

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Gena wrote:
> Jim Charter wrote:
> 
> 
>>at how figures are usually handled in this genre.  I don't know if they
>>have a Marlow but they do have a nice group of Canaletto's.
> 
> 
> BTW, I found that Marlow's painting in the book about Canaletto :)
> 
> Gena.
> 
Well I ahve to laugh at myself again.  It turns out there was only one 
Canaletto and the group I thought were by him were actually by Guardi. 
Never-the-less I made a couple of dozen sketches from figure groups in 
the Canaletto ( View of St Mark's ) and came to a humble appreciation of 
the balance he strikes between explicit and suggested detail.  This 
balance is weighted much more toward the explicit in raytracing I think. 
  Anyway I will take a stab at improving my figures.  It is going to 
lead to heavier meshes and higher res bitmaps though.

-Jim

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Jim Charter wrote:

>   Anyway I will take a stab at improving my figures.

Maybe it makes sense to start from image/bump maps (?)
Also try to add slightly different colors to the clothes to make
it more colorful. My teacher of painting always told me that
there is no white snow :)


> It is going to lead to heavier meshes and higher res bitmaps though.

I suspect we will need very powerful machine for the final
rendering :)

Gena.

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