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From: Severi Salminen
Subject: Why does Pov-RAY 3.5/3.6 slow down gradually?
Date: 12 Mar 2004 11:18:05
Message: <4051e2bd$1@news.povray.org>
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When render a totally empty scene at 160x120 (no AA) with settings "-f
+kff1600" I notice that the rendering slows down gradually all the time.
This is a Windows version and happens with both 3.5 and 3.6 beta 1. It
can be easily seen by looking at the "Rendering frame X of 1600" line at
the bottom: it just slows down. Is it just me or does this happen to
everyone? What might cause this and is there any fix?
This is a little annoying when doing long animation runs as it would be
actually faster to render it in parts: stopping and starting regularly.
Severi S.
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> When render a totally empty scene at 160x120 (no AA) with settings "-f
> +kff1600" I notice that the rendering slows down gradually all the time.
> This is a Windows version and happens with both 3.5 and 3.6 beta 1. It
> can be easily seen by looking at the "Rendering frame X of 1600" line at
> the bottom: it just slows down. Is it just me or does this happen to
> everyone? What might cause this and is there any fix?
I've noticed that too. It also does it on large images, even if the complexity
is constant throughout. If your scene renders quickly it can easily double the
time taken to render each frame.
I have no idea what the cause is, but it's *very* annoying!
--
Tek
www.evilsuperbrain.com
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From: Severi Salminen
Subject: Re: Why does Pov-RAY 3.5/3.6 slow down gradually?
Date: 13 Mar 2004 06:12:56
Message: <4052ecb8$1@news.povray.org>
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"Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbrain com> wrote in message
news:4052b182$1@news.povray.org...
> > When render a totally empty scene at 160x120 (no AA) with settings "-f
> > +kff1600" I notice that the rendering slows down gradually all the time.
> > This is a Windows version and happens with both 3.5 and 3.6 beta 1. It
> > can be easily seen by looking at the "Rendering frame X of 1600" line at
> > the bottom: it just slows down. Is it just me or does this happen to
> > everyone? What might cause this and is there any fix?
>
> I've noticed that too. It also does it on large images, even if the
complexity
> is constant throughout. If your scene renders quickly it can easily double
the
> time taken to render each frame.
>
> I have no idea what the cause is, but it's *very* annoying!
Yes, I mentioned the 160x120 because the "phenomenon" is easier to see that
way but apparently the render size doesn't matter. Could someone check the
situation with other platforms like Unix or Mac? Or is this only a Windows
specific problem (I'm using Win2000)? And if the rendering can be done from
command line with Windows version, could someone check that also - just to
narrow it even a little. I'm now far away from my computer so I can't test
it at least this weekend. It could be possibly a _very_ efficient way to
improve animation rendering times if the problem gets solved.
Severi S.
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From: Thorsten Froehlich
Subject: Re: Why does Pov-RAY 3.5/3.6 slow down gradually?
Date: 13 Mar 2004 07:18:51
Message: <4052fc2b$1@news.povray.org>
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In article <4052b182$1@news.povray.org> , "Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbraincom>
wrote:
> I've noticed that too. It also does it on large images, even if the complexity
> is constant throughout. If your scene renders quickly it can easily double the
> time taken to render each frame.
>
> I have no idea what the cause is, but it's *very* annoying!
It should not double. Most likely what you see is just memory fragmentation
(the message window does take memory!), and if you have too little memory
this will result in increased swapping.
Thorsten
____________________________________________________
Thorsten Froehlich, Duisburg, Germany
e-mail: tho### [at] trfde
Visit POV-Ray on the web: http://mac.povray.org
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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Why does Pov-RAY 3.5/3.6 slow down gradually?
Date: 13 Mar 2004 17:08:18
Message: <40538652@news.povray.org>
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I have 2GB of 400MHz Corsair RAM, that is *not* the problem! :)
It only doubled when I had a very fast scene, it was as if there was some
constant overhead that progressively increased until it took as long as the
scene itself.
--
Tek
www.evilsuperbrain.com
"Thorsten Froehlich" <tho### [at] trfde> wrote in message
news:4052fc2b$1@news.povray.org...
> In article <4052b182$1@news.povray.org> , "Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbraincom>
> wrote:
>
> > I've noticed that too. It also does it on large images, even if the
complexity
> > is constant throughout. If your scene renders quickly it can easily double
the
> > time taken to render each frame.
> >
> > I have no idea what the cause is, but it's *very* annoying!
>
> It should not double. Most likely what you see is just memory fragmentation
> (the message window does take memory!), and if you have too little memory
> this will result in increased swapping.
>
> Thorsten
>
> ____________________________________________________
> Thorsten Froehlich, Duisburg, Germany
> e-mail: tho### [at] trfde
>
> Visit POV-Ray on the web: http://mac.povray.org
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From: Severi Salminen
Subject: Re: Why does Pov-RAY 3.5/3.6 slow down gradually?
Date: 14 Mar 2004 05:20:46
Message: <405431fe$1@news.povray.org>
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"Thorsten Froehlich" <tho### [at] trfde> wrote in message
news:4052fc2b$1@news.povray.org...
> > I have no idea what the cause is, but it's *very* annoying!
>
> It should not double. Most likely what you see is just memory
fragmentation
> (the message window does take memory!), and if you have too little memory
> this will result in increased swapping.
I have also seen the time almost double and definitely it "should not" :).
And it is very hard to believe that the message window is the reason (I have
a humble 512MB and 300MB was free). It can probably take memory, but
hundreds of megabytes is quite unlikely for a (say) 100 frame animation. I
tried to turn text output to minimum with "-GA" but it had no effect (IIRC).
BTW, (some of ) the overhead can probably also be seen by comparing the
total render time visible in lower right corner in GUI and the one reported
after the render in message window: there is also a huge difference. IIRC...
Severi
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From: Severi Salminen
Subject: Re: Why does Pov-RAY 3.5/3.6 slow down gradually?
Date: 14 Mar 2004 16:27:45
Message: <4054ce51$1@news.povray.org>
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>>> I have no idea what the cause is, but it's *very* annoying!
>>
>> It should not double. Most likely what you see is just memory
>> fragmentation (the message window does take memory!), and if you
>> have too little memory this will result in increased swapping.
>
> I tried to turn text output to minimum with "-GA" but it had no
> effect (IIRC).
And I didn't recall correctly :) Specifying "-ga" does get rid of the
slowdown so the message window is the reason for all this. It is
probably not about memory usage (at least not about swapping) but some
overhead that just grows and grows.
*Testing...*
Ok, the reason is the statistics stream. By turning it off, the speed
keeps constant. Maybe it is simply feeding too much stuff for my (or
any) AMD XP2600+ to keep up or something. I think this is something that
should be addressed at least in the docs (if there is no direct way to
"fix" it) as the impact on rendering times is quite considerable.
The odd thing is that it happens also when rendering something that
takes a lot more time/frame (then there should be enough time to output
the statistics). Even then the slowdown is happening.
Good thing is that I know how to get rid of it...
Severi
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Wow! Thanks for finding that! I think I'll just switch it off permanently.
--
Tek
www.evilsuperbrain.com
"Severi Salminen" <sev### [at] NOT_THISsibafi> wrote in message
news:4054ce51$1@news.povray.org...
> >>> I have no idea what the cause is, but it's *very* annoying!
> >>
> >> It should not double. Most likely what you see is just memory
> >> fragmentation (the message window does take memory!), and if you
> >> have too little memory this will result in increased swapping.
> >
> > I tried to turn text output to minimum with "-GA" but it had no
> > effect (IIRC).
>
> And I didn't recall correctly :) Specifying "-ga" does get rid of the
> slowdown so the message window is the reason for all this. It is
> probably not about memory usage (at least not about swapping) but some
> overhead that just grows and grows.
>
> *Testing...*
>
> Ok, the reason is the statistics stream. By turning it off, the speed
> keeps constant. Maybe it is simply feeding too much stuff for my (or
> any) AMD XP2600+ to keep up or something. I think this is something that
> should be addressed at least in the docs (if there is no direct way to
> "fix" it) as the impact on rendering times is quite considerable.
>
> The odd thing is that it happens also when rendering something that
> takes a lot more time/frame (then there should be enough time to output
> the statistics). Even then the slowdown is happening.
>
> Good thing is that I know how to get rid of it...
>
> Severi
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Okay... dumb question: Why is it that -ga has no effect in 3.6 beta 1? It works
perfectly in 3.5 and speeds up anything I'm rendering.
--
Tek
www.evilsuperbrain.com
"Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbraincom> wrote in message
news:4054d490$1@news.povray.org...
> Wow! Thanks for finding that! I think I'll just switch it off permanently.
>
> --
> Tek
> www.evilsuperbrain.com
>
> "Severi Salminen" <sev### [at] NOT_THISsibafi> wrote in message
> news:4054ce51$1@news.povray.org...
> > >>> I have no idea what the cause is, but it's *very* annoying!
> > >>
> > >> It should not double. Most likely what you see is just memory
> > >> fragmentation (the message window does take memory!), and if you
> > >> have too little memory this will result in increased swapping.
> > >
> > > I tried to turn text output to minimum with "-GA" but it had no
> > > effect (IIRC).
> >
> > And I didn't recall correctly :) Specifying "-ga" does get rid of the
> > slowdown so the message window is the reason for all this. It is
> > probably not about memory usage (at least not about swapping) but some
> > overhead that just grows and grows.
> >
> > *Testing...*
> >
> > Ok, the reason is the statistics stream. By turning it off, the speed
> > keeps constant. Maybe it is simply feeding too much stuff for my (or
> > any) AMD XP2600+ to keep up or something. I think this is something that
> > should be addressed at least in the docs (if there is no direct way to
> > "fix" it) as the impact on rendering times is quite considerable.
> >
> > The odd thing is that it happens also when rendering something that
> > takes a lot more time/frame (then there should be enough time to output
> > the statistics). Even then the slowdown is happening.
> >
> > Good thing is that I know how to get rid of it...
> >
> > Severi
>
>
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From: Severi Salminen
Subject: Re: Why does Pov-RAY 3.5/3.6 slow down gradually?
Date: 14 Mar 2004 17:38:30
Message: <4054dee6@news.povray.org>
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Tek wrote:
> Okay... dumb question: Why is it that -ga has no effect in 3.6 beta 1? It works
> perfectly in 3.5 and speeds up anything I'm rendering.
Indeed, thanks for noticing it! I _did_ recall correctly afterall: with
beta1 the -ga does nothing and the slowdown thus occurs. Probably the
streams will be fixed in final release. I wonder if the slowdown
bug/feature could be addressed at the same time. One way could be to
allow all the intermediate statistics (after every frame) to be turned
off for animations so that only the final stats will show.
Severi S.
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