 |
|
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On Sun, 05 Jul 2015 22:23:00 +0100, Stephen wrote:
> On 7/5/2015 9:35 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> On Sun, 05 Jul 2015 09:29:59 +0100, Stephen wrote:
>>
>>> You should get rid of home schooling. That is a bad thing IMO.
>>> Discuss. ;-)
>>
>> We home schooled our son for the last 5 years or so of his school
>> career.
>>
>> So, no, I disagree. :)
>>
>> He passed his GED with top marks, went to uni, was on the deans' list
>> most of the time he was there, and graduated with honours - from the
>> University of Utah with a degree in Anthropology.
>>
>> The Christian fundamentalists who homeschool give homeschooling a bad
>> rap in the US.
>
> They certainly do. From what I've read. There is no requirement for the
> children to be assessed, by many states. That is dereliction of duty, in
> my book.
I agree. There is a huge push against assessing children in the US in
general, not just in the case of homeschooling, either. You want some
entertaining reading, read up on the pushback against "Common Core"
standards.
>> There are people who do it properly - and in our case,
>
> I won't ask who rattled your cage. Me obviously. :-)
;)
> And just as obviously there need to be exceptions depending on
> circumstances. After all, there are some remote isolated communities in
> all of that land. But Weirdos and religious throwbacks should not have
> the right to brainwash more generations of children. And that goes for
> Europe and the UK too.
For me, the issue is more involved than that. I think children should
have the right to be free from religious indoctrination - if they choose
a religion after weighing evidence, fine (assuming they're old enough to
be capable of making that decision). The social pressure is incredible,
though, to conform by being religious - but of course, you have to have
the *right* religious beliefs, too.
> the
>> reason we did it was because we ultimately had little choice but to
>> step up and home school him.
>>
>>
> It sounds like you made the right choice. It is not something I would
> like to take the responsibility for. Too much like hard work. :-)
It was a lot of work all around. His science education was mostly
through volunteering at an aviary - he's a very hands-on kid - so biology
is the science he's strongest with.
But he's a very fast kinesthetic learner. :)
Jim
--
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and
besides, the pig likes it." - George Bernard Shaw
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On 7/5/2015 11:05 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Sun, 05 Jul 2015 22:23:00 +0100, Stephen wrote:
>
>>
>> They certainly do. From what I've read. There is no requirement for the
>> children to be assessed, by many states. That is dereliction of duty, in
>> my book.
>
> I agree. There is a huge push against assessing children in the US in
> general, not just in the case of homeschooling, either. You want some
> entertaining reading, read up on the pushback against "Common Core"
> standards.
>
My wife thanks you. That will keep her occupied for hours. I thank you. :-)
>
> For me, the issue is more involved than that. I think children should
> have the right to be free from religious indoctrination
100% with you on that.
- if they choose
> a religion after weighing evidence, fine (assuming they're old enough to
> be capable of making that decision). The social pressure is incredible,
> though, to conform by being religious
I remember it when I was a child. That has gone now in the UK. :-)
When I was in Nigeria. I got e-mails telling me that I was going to
Hell. Because I was not a believer. I was glad to not be part of her
community.
- but of course, you have to have
> the *right* religious beliefs, too.
>
Yes. There was a little bit of that. Where I grew up.
>
> But he's a very fast kinesthetic learner. :)
>
I've not heard that phrase. It could be describing me. :-)
--
Regards
Stephen
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On Mon, 06 Jul 2015 18:35:08 +0100, Stephen wrote:
> On 7/5/2015 11:05 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> On Sun, 05 Jul 2015 22:23:00 +0100, Stephen wrote:
>>
>>
>
>>> They certainly do. From what I've read. There is no requirement for
>>> the children to be assessed, by many states. That is dereliction of
>>> duty, in my book.
>>
>> I agree. There is a huge push against assessing children in the US in
>> general, not just in the case of homeschooling, either. You want some
>> entertaining reading, read up on the pushback against "Common Core"
>> standards.
>>
>>
> My wife thanks you. That will keep her occupied for hours. I thank you.
> :-)
LOL
>> For me, the issue is more involved than that. I think children should
>> have the right to be free from religious indoctrination
>
> 100% with you on that.
I can't say I'm surprised. :)
> - if they choose
>> a religion after weighing evidence, fine (assuming they're old enough
>> to be capable of making that decision). The social pressure is
>> incredible,
>> though, to conform by being religious
>
> I remember it when I was a child. That has gone now in the UK. :-)
> When I was in Nigeria. I got e-mails telling me that I was going to
> Hell. Because I was not a believer. I was glad to not be part of her
> community.
Yeah, there are places on the planet that I won't be visiting.
> - but of course, you have to have
>> the *right* religious beliefs, too.
>>
> Yes. There was a little bit of that. Where I grew up.
I wish I could say I was surprised by that, but I'm not.
>> But he's a very fast kinesthetic learner. :)
>>
>>
> I've not heard that phrase. It could be describing me. :-)
It's a fancy word that means "hands-on" - it's how I also learn the
best. Give me a book, I might learn it. Let me work in the lab, though,
and I'll have it very quickly.
Some people are visual learners (Ken is that as well - obviously with his
near photographic memory), some are auditory learners, some are
kinesthetic - but most people benefit from a combination of approaches.
Designing training materials is easier when you understand how the
audience learns, or how to adapt your delivery to the needs of the
student.
One of the myriad of things outside any area of study I had in school
that I've picked up over the years. :)
Jim
--
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and
besides, the pig likes it." - George Bernard Shaw
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On 7/7/2015 5:45 AM, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Mon, 06 Jul 2015 18:35:08 +0100, Stephen wrote:
>
>>
>> I remember it when I was a child. That has gone now in the UK. :-)
>> When I was in Nigeria. I got e-mails telling me that I was going to
>> Hell. Because I was not a believer. I was glad to not be part of her
>> community.
>
> Yeah, there are places on the planet that I won't be visiting.
>
I was desperate for work. But I would sell my granny* not to go back. :-)
I keep getting opportunities in the Middle East. Needless to say that is
a no go situation.
>> - but of course, you have to have
>>> the *right* religious beliefs, too.
>>>
>> Yes. There was a little bit of that. Where I grew up.
>
> I wish I could say I was surprised by that, but I'm not.
>
The difference is, atheists and other religions were non combatants.
>>> But he's a very fast kinesthetic learner. :)
>>>
>>>
>> I've not heard that phrase. It could be describing me. :-)
>
> It's a fancy word that means "hands-on" - it's how I also learn the
> best. Give me a book, I might learn it. Let me work in the lab, though,
> and I'll have it very quickly.
>
> Some people are visual learners (Ken is that as well - obviously with his
> near photographic memory), some are auditory learners, some are
> kinesthetic - but most people benefit from a combination of approaches.
> Designing training materials is easier when you understand how the
> audience learns, or how to adapt your delivery to the needs of the
> student.
>
I read the Wiki article again and auditory learner describes me to a Tee.
> One of the myriad of things outside any area of study I had in school
> that I've picked up over the years. :)
>
Mostly school boards are well minded. But there are more things in
Heaven and Earth than are dreamt of in their philosophies.
*
I have just had a sudden thought. I've worked at the three points of the
slave triangle; Glasgow, West Africa and Jamaica. I am not too sure that
I am comfortable about that. :-(
--
Regards
Stephen
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On Tue, 07 Jul 2015 07:22:50 +0100, Stephen wrote:
>>> I remember it when I was a child. That has gone now in the UK. :-)
>>> When I was in Nigeria. I got e-mails telling me that I was going to
>>> Hell. Because I was not a believer. I was glad to not be part of her
>>> community.
>>
>> Yeah, there are places on the planet that I won't be visiting.
>>
> I was desperate for work. But I would sell my granny* not to go back.
> :-)
> I keep getting opportunities in the Middle East. Needless to say that is
> a no go situation.
I've got a couple friends who spent some time doing business in that part
of the world - it can be pretty hairy. I know one who has multiple
passports just so various governments don't see the stamps from places
they don't want to see on a passport.
Another friend spent time working for UNHCR - going into war zones to set
up networks for the organization; when I first met her, she talked about
having coworkers who were killed doing that job. Nasty business - she's
no longer in it.
>>> - but of course, you have to have
>>>> the *right* religious beliefs, too.
>>>>
>>> Yes. There was a little bit of that. Where I grew up.
>>
>> I wish I could say I was surprised by that, but I'm not.
>>
>>
> The difference is, atheists and other religions were non combatants.
That makes a difference, yes.
>>>> But he's a very fast kinesthetic learner. :)
>>>>
>>>>
>>> I've not heard that phrase. It could be describing me. :-)
>>
>> It's a fancy word that means "hands-on" - it's how I also learn the
>> best. Give me a book, I might learn it. Let me work in the lab,
>> though,
>> and I'll have it very quickly.
>>
>> Some people are visual learners (Ken is that as well - obviously with
>> his near photographic memory), some are auditory learners, some are
>> kinesthetic - but most people benefit from a combination of approaches.
>> Designing training materials is easier when you understand how the
>> audience learns, or how to adapt your delivery to the needs of the
>> student.
>>
>>
> I read the Wiki article again and auditory learner describes me to a
> Tee.
:)
>> One of the myriad of things outside any area of study I had in school
>> that I've picked up over the years. :)
>>
> Mostly school boards are well minded. But there are more things in
> Heaven and Earth than are dreamt of in their philosophies.
Yep. The thing for me is that they tend not to make decisions out of
malice - and that helps. It doesn't excuse wrong-headed decisions, but
it does help one understand them, and that can provide some common ground
for a discussion.
> *
> I have just had a sudden thought. I've worked at the three points of the
> slave triangle; Glasgow, West Africa and Jamaica. I am not too sure that
> I am comfortable about that. :-(
Hrm....
Jim
--
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and
besides, the pig likes it." - George Bernard Shaw
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On 7/6/2015 11:22 PM, Stephen wrote:
>> One of the myriad of things outside any area of study I had in school
>> that I've picked up over the years. :)
>>
> Mostly school boards are well minded. But there are more things in
> Heaven and Earth than are dreamt of in their philosophies.
>
>
Well minded? Elected, not required to have teaching credentials, picked
based on local ideology and politics, often, in recent years, also
heavily dependent on the theory that schools are like factories, or
other sorts of business, rather than a service (not that being a service
would save them from having corners cut, and shoddy product exchanged in
favor of what is best for the customer). So.. you have people with no
skill, no knowledge, possibly/probably ideologically driven, and, if you
are lucky, the combination will be something other than, "religious,
ignorant, science denying, micromanaging, plutocrats, who think that the
schools, like health care, the EPA, social security, and anything else
'public' is a waste of money", and that, "Private institutions would
automatically do better."
Yeah.. I am a real believer in the idea that the "school boards" are the
ones who are "well minded" in this equation...
As to the bad name for home schooling.. To argue that its a legitimate
solution is a bit like arguing, from the privileged status of someone
living in Florida, that one shouldn't bother buying a coat in Alaska.
Its only a valid solution for the small percentage of people who have
the time, the resources, or the skill, necessary to do it correctly. If
any one of these is lacking, its a failure. And, the most dangerous one
to be "missing" is "resources", because if one does not know enough,
themselves, to a) find, b) vet, and c) acquire said resources, those
available, and most directly accessible, via "home schooling" sources
are nearly universally from the "Christian Fundamentalist" category, or
equally questionable sources, filled with misinformation, and delusional
nonsense.
I would "love" to be able to say that home schooling was a viable option
for anyone except those with the rare combination of traits to both
provide it, and do so without being duped by those peddling bad
information. But, since there is no official, well controlled, reliable,
and recognized "source" for materials, nor is it even possible for
everyone that might benefit from it to receive such education, the net
result is that **most** of those receiving such are doing so with
invalid materials, chosen by those who either do not know they are
useless, or, worse, chose it intentionally, because they believe it to
be accurate. I.e., one the whole, it has the reputation it does for
entirely good reasons, regardless of the much rarer exceptions.
--
Commander Vimes: "You take a bunch of people who don't seem any
different from you and me, but when you add them all together you get
this sort of huge raving maniac with national borders and an anthem."
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Excuse me for top posting.
> Well minded?
A polite lie. It doesn't do to be overly critical, old chap. :-)
Ever since Jeannie C. Riley gave us the low down on Harper Valley PTA. I
have had my suspicions of the American Education system. :-)
It must be galling to see the takeover of such important institutions by
fundamentalists. I wonder when they will start behaving like the...
(Guess who, I mean. They are in the news a lot recently.)
On 7/8/2015 4:56 AM, Patrick Elliott wrote:
> On 7/6/2015 11:22 PM, Stephen wrote:
>>> One of the myriad of things outside any area of study I had in school
>>> that I've picked up over the years. :)
>>>
>> Mostly school boards are well minded. But there are more things in
>> Heaven and Earth than are dreamt of in their philosophies.
>>
>>
>
> Well minded? Elected, not required to have teaching credentials, picked
> based on local ideology and politics, often, in recent years, also
> heavily dependent on the theory that schools are like factories, or
> other sorts of business, rather than a service (not that being a service
> would save them from having corners cut, and shoddy product exchanged in
> favor of what is best for the customer). So.. you have people with no
> skill, no knowledge, possibly/probably ideologically driven, and, if you
> are lucky, the combination will be something other than, "religious,
> ignorant, science denying, micromanaging, plutocrats, who think that the
> schools, like health care, the EPA, social security, and anything else
> 'public' is a waste of money", and that, "Private institutions would
> automatically do better."
>
> Yeah.. I am a real believer in the idea that the "school boards" are the
> ones who are "well minded" in this equation...
>
> As to the bad name for home schooling.. To argue that its a legitimate
> solution is a bit like arguing, from the privileged status of someone
> living in Florida, that one shouldn't bother buying a coat in Alaska.
> Its only a valid solution for the small percentage of people who have
> the time, the resources, or the skill, necessary to do it correctly. If
> any one of these is lacking, its a failure. And, the most dangerous one
> to be "missing" is "resources", because if one does not know enough,
> themselves, to a) find, b) vet, and c) acquire said resources, those
> available, and most directly accessible, via "home schooling" sources
> are nearly universally from the "Christian Fundamentalist" category, or
> equally questionable sources, filled with misinformation, and delusional
> nonsense.
>
> I would "love" to be able to say that home schooling was a viable option
> for anyone except those with the rare combination of traits to both
> provide it, and do so without being duped by those peddling bad
> information. But, since there is no official, well controlled, reliable,
> and recognized "source" for materials, nor is it even possible for
> everyone that might benefit from it to receive such education, the net
> result is that **most** of those receiving such are doing so with
> invalid materials, chosen by those who either do not know they are
> useless, or, worse, chose it intentionally, because they believe it to
> be accurate. I.e., one the whole, it has the reputation it does for
> entirely good reasons, regardless of the much rarer exceptions.
>
--
Regards
Stephen
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On 7/7/2015 5:39 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
> Hrm....
>
On the bright side. Clue starts again, Monday.
--
Regards
Stephen
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On Thu, 09 Jul 2015 17:48:42 +0100, Stephen wrote:
> On 7/7/2015 5:39 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>
>> Hrm....
>>
>>
>
> On the bright side. Clue starts again, Monday.
Awesome, I had been looking, but the officially unofficial site hasn't
had dates on it the last few times we checked.
Jim
--
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and
besides, the pig likes it." - George Bernard Shaw
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On 7/9/2015 6:03 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Thu, 09 Jul 2015 17:48:42 +0100, Stephen wrote:
>
>> On 7/7/2015 5:39 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>>
>>> Hrm....
>>>
>>>
>>
>> On the bright side. Clue starts again, Monday.
>
> Awesome, I had been looking, but the officially unofficial site hasn't
> had dates on it the last few times we checked.
>
I heard it on the radio, today.
--
Regards
Stephen
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
|
|
