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From: Gilles Tran
Subject: Zazzle site is open
Date: 9 Mar 2003 17:35:56
Message: <3e6bc1cc@news.povray.org>
Slightly off-topic but since lots of Povers have images there (approx 250) I
guess that it's of general interest.
The zazzle site http://www.zazzle.com is now out of beta phase after several
years of beta activities.
Here are some of the new features I'm aware of, particularly :
- "colossal" size for posters (roughly 2 * 1 m) (they sent me a "colossal"
poster some time ago and it's really impressive)
- t-shirts
- postcards
- contributors can now delete items from their gallery
- address book for those who want to use the service to send products to
different people
- new numbering scheme for items. The old one is still functional through
redirection (i.e. it's not mandatory to rename links to your own zazzle
material)
- the misleading "best-seller" list (which was actually a "most-viewed"
list) is gone, replaced by the ability to sort images according to user
ranking (of little use until enough people rank images of course).
There have been no official announcement from zazzle (and no pretty home
page), so I guess they're still smoothing out some residual bugs (I wanted
to post this this morning but the site went down for a few hours).

G

--
**********************
http://www.oyonale.com
**********************
- Graphic experiments
- POV-Ray and Poser computer images
- Posters


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From: Renderdog
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 9 Mar 2003 18:35:08
Message: <web.3e6bcf47c070d06c1d4add5a0@news.povray.org>
Gilles Tran wrote:
>Slightly off-topic but since lots of Povers have images there (approx 250) I
>guess that it's of general interest.
>The zazzle site http://www.zazzle.com is now out of beta phase after several
>years of beta activities.

>- the misleading "best-seller" list (which was actually a "most-viewed"
>list) is gone, replaced by the ability to sort images according to user
>ranking (of little use until enough people rank images of course).

I noticed zazzle was new yesterday and the first thing I did was rate "The
wet bird" a 10. I intend to order a large print but I wonder about the
resolution of Zazzle prints. 100dpi is a little low.

Also, I notice the wet bird image is shown with a white border (and some
text). Is this area counted in the image print size? I'm not big on text so
I'd probably order a print on canvas and crop out the white border with a
frame.

Has anyone bought a print on matte canvas? I prefer matte since glossy
surfaces cause too much reflection. While some images lend themselves to a
glossy look, and glossy prints generally have a higher dynamic range, you
can really see the image clearly with a matte finish.

And to keep all this on topic, I plan to purchase it through the
www.povray.org link to help support POV-Ray's server!

-Mark


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From: Gilles Tran
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 10 Mar 2003 04:50:40
Message: <3e6c5ff0@news.povray.org>

web.3e6bcf47c070d06c1d4add5a0@news.povray.org...
> I noticed zazzle was new yesterday and the first thing I did was rate "The
> wet bird" a 10. I intend to order a large print but I wonder about the
> resolution of Zazzle prints. 100dpi is a little low.

Thanks ! How's the Venice pic doing, btw ?

About the resolution, I know that it's low, but from what I've seen it's OK
as posters are meant to be watched from a certain distance. Note that the
Wet bird was enlarged x 1.5 so it's more fuzzy that it should be, not that
it's abnormal for a image featuring rain. I'd like to render it bigger than
2400*3200 but it was done with Megapov and the fast focal blur feature
freaks out on large image sizes. The image maps are too low-def anyway, so
to create a very high definition version of this image I will have to do
some additional 2d work and find a way to recreate the focal blur that looks
good and doesn't take ages (even in post-process and lots of RAM it's not
easy to do with 90Mb files).

> Also, I notice the wet bird image is shown with a white border (and some
> text). Is this area counted in the image print size? I'm not big on text
so
> I'd probably order a print on canvas and crop out the white border with a
> frame.
The margin is included. One reason I didn't put text on the picture but left
it on the margin was exactly that, to let people crop out the border if they
didn't like it. In any case, with more freedom in uploading/deleting images,
I may end up uploaing up different versions in the future.

G.


--

**********************
http://www.oyonale.com
**********************
- Graphic experiments
- POV-Ray and Poser computer images
- Posters


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From: ABX
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 10 Mar 2003 05:31:22
Message: <49qo6vcr539omr0p6s65uj8bt56dpk4b5i@4ax.com>
On Sun, 9 Mar 2003 23:35:45 +0100, "Gilles Tran" <git### [at] wanadoofr> wrote:
> The zazzle site http://www.zazzle.com is now out of beta phase after several
> years of beta activities.

No mugs ? No plates ? Any news about that items ?

ABX


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From: Gilles Tran
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 10 Mar 2003 07:18:55
Message: <3e6c82af$1@news.povray.org>

49qo6vcr539omr0p6s65uj8bt56dpk4b5i@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 9 Mar 2003 23:35:45 +0100, "Gilles Tran" <git### [at] wanadoofr>
wrote:
>
> No mugs ? No plates ? Any news about that items ?

From the "coming soon" page :
"Zazzle will be continually adding new products over the next few months. As
new functionality is added to our proprietary design programs, contributors
will be able to optimize their designs for future products and customers
will be able to buy top quality new items including coffee mugs, beer
steins, mouse pads, tote bags, etc. And, later, Zazzle will be expanding the
power and reach of our community to entirely new markets."

G.

--

**********************
http://www.oyonale.com
**********************
- Graphic experiments
- POV-Ray and Poser computer images
- Posters


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From: William F  Pokorny
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 10 Mar 2003 09:40:05
Message: <3E6CA3C5.E124F539@attglobal.net>
I ordered Gilles' "The prisoners" on a large matte canvas some time ago. As you
suggest the image is flat - less dynamic - when compared to the image on screen.
I take some of this as simply the difference between print and screen
technology, but certainly the matte finish also plays a part. The image you are
printing should certainly influence your choices.   

As for resolution I am not sure on canvass you can print at resolutions much
beyond 100dpi. It is really canvass and even if your printer is running at
>100dpi it will be throwing ink at the woven  surface of the canvass and I doubt you'd
see much more than an effective 100dpi. 

One feature I think is sorely missing from Zazzle is the ability to preview the
image as a print while on line. While it might take some invention, I think it
possible to present an on screen image which to a significant degree reflects
the image as it will look printed. I suppose one brute force method would be for
Zazzle to digitally photograph prints of different types as they print and ship
them to customers - of course under some standardized indoor lighting. Perhaps
POV-Ray could play a part in generating these as printed images? As things are
today we have to make an educated guess about how the image will look printed
and I am afraid sometimes people will be disappointed... 

By the way, I think this is on topic. Many of us have an interest in obtaining
prints of POV-Ray images.   
Bill P.    
   
Renderdog wrote:
> 
> I noticed zazzle was new yesterday and the first thing I did was rate "The
> wet bird" a 10. I intend to order a large print but I wonder about the
> resolution of Zazzle prints. 100dpi is a little low.
> 
> Has anyone bought a print on matte canvas? I prefer matte since glossy
> surfaces cause too much reflection. While some images lend themselves to a
> glossy look, and glossy prints generally have a higher dynamic range, you
> can really see the image clearly with a matte finish.
>


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From: Renderdog
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 10 Mar 2003 13:55:03
Message: <web.3e6cdee4c070d06c4464ede80@news.povray.org>
William F. Pokorny wrote:
>I ordered Gilles' "The prisoners" on a large matte canvas some time ago. As you
>suggest the image is flat - less dynamic - when compared to the image on screen.
>I take some of this as simply the difference between print and screen
>technology, but certainly the matte finish also plays a part. The image you are
>printing should certainly influence your choices.
>
>As for resolution I am not sure on canvass you can print at resolutions much
>beyond 100dpi. It is really canvass and even if your printer is running at
> >100dpi it will be throwing ink at the woven  surface of the canvass
> and I doubt you'd see much more than an effective 100dpi.

I've experimented with printing on canvas and some glossy canvas can show
higher resolutions. Zazzle's prices are very good, so I'll order a large
matte canvas of the wet bird and see what I get. As you say, the image
itself makes a difference; luckily the wet bird will probably lend
itself well to a lower resolution matte print.

One of the reasons I purchased an Epson 2200 printer was so I could play
around with different media such as canvas, so that when I have an image
printed I'll have an idea of what it will/can look like. Test prints let
me make adjustments to my renders with the final media in mind. I've not
yet made a choice on canvas; I may well choose the higher gloss/resolution
canvas for future prints.

Another media I've been experimenting with is transparency over a backlit
panel. I'm hoping this will duplicate the onscreen look with the added
bonus of print resolution. www.photoglow.com has some very reasonable
prices if you want to look into that.

Thanks Gilles and William for your responses, I'll report back on the
Zazzle's print quality when I get it. And to answer Gilles' question about
the Venice scene, it's moving slow now that bike racing season is here,
and my next object, a gondola, is intimidating. I'm sure it will go well
after I dive in, and I'll enjoy drawing it, but drawing a curvy object
like a gondola using CSG's and isosurfaces will take some work.

-Mark


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From: Greg M  Johnson
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 11 Mar 2003 10:26:00
Message: <3e6e0008$1@news.povray.org>
I have an image with two ratings!

Q: Do you think that a border-within-the-bitmap-itself  is critical to
making a design look finished?


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From: Renderdog
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 11 Mar 2003 15:55:04
Message: <web.3e6e4c47c070d06c7ba9929f0@news.povray.org>
Greg M. Johnson wrote:
>I have an image with two ratings!
>
>Q: Do you think that a border-within-the-bitmap-itself  is critical to
>making a design look finished?

I searched Zazzle for an image under your name and came up blank. Can you
provide a link or name?

I think in many cases a border looks nice, but for this purpose I'd prefer
no border. A matte or frame will provide a border for the print. A
bitmapped border is wasting valuable print space, in my opinion. I also
prefer discretely hidden signatures in the artwork.

art.com provides a "see it framed" utility on their website that lets you
see the image matted and framed. It can even show double mattes. Perhaps
Zazzle will get something like that eventually.


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From: Gilles Tran
Subject: Re: Zazzle site is open
Date: 11 Mar 2003 18:19:01
Message: <3e6e6ee5@news.povray.org>

web.3e6e4c47c070d06c7ba9929f0@news.povray.org...
> art.com provides a "see it framed" utility on their website that lets you
> see the image matted and framed. It can even show double mattes. Perhaps
> Zazzle will get something like that eventually.

In fact it does provide it and it can create text and borders for you. The
problem was that when I tried it (this was 18 months ago, so it may have
changed), positionning text was extremely imprecise and took too much trial
and error to get right. I ended up doing bitmapped borders instead, but I'd
rather have the buyer be able to choose between several framing options (no
border, white border, black border etc.).

G.


--
**********************
http://www.oyonale.com
**********************
- Graphic experiments
- POV-Ray and Poser computer images
- Posters


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