Nice scene.

Remember, in ancient times they had these huge wheel cranes on some locations at
the harbor. Inside the wheel were humans, and the movement of that huge wheel
was used to move the crane's top, or to lift and lower the fright from the
crane's top. Those cranes could rotate, too. And most harbors had also some
large fires burning at the entrance towers, to make it possible for the ships to
find it by night.

There were three books published in the USA, showing some of my works in the
field of maritime archaeology. The author is Stephen M. Miller.

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On 20-2-2013 18:25, clipka wrote:
> 5m wide = max. 1.5m width per ship.

Yeah... it is a bit of a squeeze, I admit. But for the pirogue-class 
that's all right ;-)

Seriously, I may have to reconsider the layout. Sloppy architect.

>
> I doubt that such small ships would be moored directly sideways to a
> solid stone quay. After all, what heavy or bulky load could they
> possibly carry? And how would they get out of the ships at low tide?

Not much tide in the Mediterranean. Small ships, even pirogues crowd in 
to the daily markets with fish and fruit, I imagine.

There probably is some kind of buffer (hides) either on the quay or the 
ships to protect from the stone. Also need something to moor to.

>
> More likely you'd have narrow wooden walkways for such small vessels,
> floating on pontoons; and you'd moor multiple vessels side by side to
> those.

Yep. And as this is visibly going to be a multi-purpose harbour, all 
kind of possibilities need to be kept open indeed.

Note: While using historical elements, these scenes are not intended as 
scientifically accurate views. We stay in the realm of the imagination ;-)

Thomas

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Wow!  Both of your images show the tremendous amount of detailed work you've put
into this scene.

The view from on-board the boat is a keeper; I do like the image's composition,
with the railing in the foreground.

I would suggest some 'dirtying down' of some of the stone surfaces: on the main
court, and on the vertical walls near the water (those would probably have years
of green grime dripping down, from the moisture.) Does the court get much human
or animal traffic? Or is it supposed to be 'clean and austere' and off-limits to
the populace, like China's Forbidden City used to be?

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On 21-2-2013 1:28, Sven Littkowski wrote:
> Nice scene.

Thanks.

>
> Remember, in ancient times they had these huge wheel cranes on some locations at
> the harbor. Inside the wheel were humans, and the movement of that huge wheel
> was used to move the crane's top, or to lift and lower the fright from the
> crane's top. Those cranes could rotate, too. And most harbors had also some
> large fires burning at the entrance towers, to make it possible for the ships to
> find it by night.

The cranes are an option indeed, but they will probably not be present 
in this harbour (possibly in the one on the sea side, which will be the 
military harbour as far as I know presently).

>
> There were three books published in the USA, showing some of my works in the
> field of maritime archaeology. The author is Stephen M. Miller.
>

Hmm...

Thomas

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On 21-2-2013 9:24, Kenneth wrote:
> Wow!  Both of your images show the tremendous amount of detailed work you've put
> into this scene.

Thanks! And still only in wip mode ;-)

>
> The view from on-board the boat is a keeper; I do like the image's composition,
> with the railing in the foreground.
>
> I would suggest some 'dirtying down' of some of the stone surfaces: on the main
> court, and on the vertical walls near the water (those would probably have years
> of green grime dripping down, from the moisture.)

Well, there already is some but that could certainly be made more 
obvious. I have to consider, if I can find time of course ;-)

However, being in a Mediterranean/North African climate means less slime 
  (except at water's edge) than what we are used to up North.

Does the court get much human
> or animal traffic? Or is it supposed to be 'clean and austere' and off-limits to
> the populace, like China's Forbidden City used to be?

Oh no, everything is open and free and often used for other purposes 
than those for which they were created in the first place. The court is 
a market during early day hours when the temperature is not too high and 
often also at night (different purposes...).

Thomas

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Thomas de Groot <tho### [at] degrootorg> wrote:
> On 20-2-2013 9:35, Thomas de Groot wrote:
> > Believe it or not, there is ample room for two ships side by side in
> > most if not all of the docks! Perspective is playing a bad trick here.
> >
>
> So I am proved a liar ;-)
>
> Somehow I have not paid attention to some proportions and sizes and
> shall have to reconsider.
>
> I remember that my original intention was to have docks for all kind of
> vessels, large but also small. This might need proper attention...
>
> Thomas

hey, that sea demands a bit more ripples :)

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On 25-2-2013 5:34, nemesis wrote:
>
> hey, that sea demands a bit more ripples :)
>

Oh dear! Was I expecting that ?  ;-)

Waves are not really the problem, when time comes to implement them, but 
what I find difficult is the way they will behave on the coastline 
(except for a foam line like in the Terra project of Jaime) and when 
coming into the estuary, how they will be damped. This is truly beyond 
my capacities at present...

I am concentrating on the town (and its population if time permits). The 
rest of the world is there to give an idea of what it will/ should look 
like.

But you are right. Sooner or later I shall have to confront this problem.

Thomas

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Am 25.02.2013 09:20, schrieb Thomas de Groot:
> On 25-2-2013 5:34, nemesis wrote:
>>
>> hey, that sea demands a bit more ripples :)
>>
>
> Oh dear! Was I expecting that ?  ;-)
>
> Waves are not really the problem, when time comes to implement them, but
> what I find difficult is the way they will behave on the coastline
> (except for a foam line like in the Terra project of Jaime) and when
> coming into the estuary, how they will be damped. This is truly beyond
> my capacities at present...

Why not use a wave tank simulator? POV-Ray can do that :-)

news://news.povray.org:119/4a812162@news.povray.org

I think I still have the SDL code somewhere on my computer.

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clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 25.02.2013 09:20, schrieb Thomas de Groot:
> > On 25-2-2013 5:34, nemesis wrote:
> >>
> >> hey, that sea demands a bit more ripples :)
> >>
> >
> > Oh dear! Was I expecting that ?  ;-)
> >
> > Waves are not really the problem, when time comes to implement them, but
> > what I find difficult is the way they will behave on the coastline
> > (except for a foam line like in the Terra project of Jaime) and when
> > coming into the estuary, how they will be damped. This is truly beyond
> > my capacities at present...
>
> Why not use a wave tank simulator? POV-Ray can do that :-)
>
> news://news.povray.org:119/4a812162@news.povray.org
>
> I think I still have the SDL code somewhere on my computer.

woa, I was just talking about some more pronounced normals :)

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On 25-2-2013 10:24, clipka wrote:
> Why not use a wave tank simulator? POV-Ray can do that :-)
>
> news://news.povray.org:119/4a812162@news.povray.org
>
> I think I still have the SDL code somewhere on my computer.
>

Yes, but... the code in that thread is your Game of Life? Not really 
waves meseems... ;-)

Is there wave tank simulator code somewhere?

Thomas

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