Greetings Pov People,

 The title of this message comes from an off had comment I made
yesterday in .general. I mentioned if I ever figured out a way
to get an image map like a stained glass window to interact with
media I would patent the process. Wouldn't you know it I achieved
that goal this evening. It needs refinement but the process works
as can be seen in the very preliminary example.

  You should be able to see a light atmospheric haze and the image
you see is actually projected from off the screen to the right
across to the opposite wall and steps area. As this took close to
8 hrs. to render I am unlikely to pursue this particular image any
further. It was mostly a proof of concept image and I am more than
willing to share my work to date with anyone interested in how the
process works.


  You will see at about one third the way down the image a streak
or difference in appearance. This was caused by me from stopping
the render at that point. I opened the file in the photon patch
and choose the continue rendering function to compare the behaviour
between the two versions. Nathan has added a true parallel ray
function to the cylinder light source which is what I was using
behind the image map. It is obvious that it has a very different
effect on the way it interacts with scattering media. I stopped it
rather quickly after seeing how it looked and finished the render
in the official build of Pov 3.1. For the amount of time spent
rendering it was not worth it to start over to remove it plus I
want Nathan to see the difference as well.

-- 
Ken Tyler

mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net

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Attachments:
Download 'mediamap.jpg' (14 KB)

Preview of image 'mediamap.jpg'

Source, please! :)

In fact, feel free to email me! heh

GrimDude
vos### [at] arkansasnet

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GrimDude wrote:
> 
> Source, please! :)
> 
> In fact, feel free to email me! heh
> 
> GrimDude
> vos### [at] arkansasnet

  Do you want the image used for the window as well ?

I have to clean up the file but look for it today sometime. If you want
the window image speak up soon of you will get the code only. I don't
know how well I can document the process as I was faking it most of the
time. I will add what I can to clear up major points that are needed to
make it work but offer no gaurantees beyond that.

-- 
Ken Tyler

mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net

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Yes, please include the image as well. Thanks for sharing.  ;-]

KB-

Ken wrote:

> GrimDude wrote:
> >
> > Source, please! :)
> >
> > In fact, feel free to email me! heh
> >
> > GrimDude
> > vos### [at] arkansasnet
>
>   Do you want the image used for the window as well ?
>
> I have to clean up the file but look for it today sometime. If you want
> the window image speak up soon of you will get the code only. I don't
> know how well I can document the process as I was faking it most of the
> time. I will add what I can to clear up major points that are needed to
> make it work but offer no gaurantees beyond that.
>
> --
> Ken Tyler
>
> mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net

Post a reply to this message

Difference is right. A shift in the light even. At first I thought I was
looking at a window then realized with help of those steps it wasn't.
Otherwise I could have said "What a pale, washed out window there" :)
Really though, there is no colorful intensity, what went wrong? Wait a
minute, you aren't using 'transmit' too are you, instead of just
'filter' alone?


Ken wrote:
> 
> Greetings Pov People,
> 
>  The title of this message comes from an off had comment I made
> yesterday in .general. I mentioned if I ever figured out a way
> to get an image map like a stained glass window to interact with
> media I would patent the process. Wouldn't you know it I achieved
> that goal this evening. It needs refinement but the process works
> as can be seen in the very preliminary example.
> 
>   You should be able to see a light atmospheric haze and the image
> you see is actually projected from off the screen to the right
> across to the opposite wall and steps area. As this took close to
> 8 hrs. to render I am unlikely to pursue this particular image any
> further. It was mostly a proof of concept image and I am more than
> willing to share my work to date with anyone interested in how the
> process works.
> 
>   You will see at about one third the way down the image a streak
> or difference in appearance. This was caused by me from stopping
> the render at that point. I opened the file in the photon patch
> and choose the continue rendering function to compare the behaviour
> between the two versions. Nathan has added a true parallel ray
> function to the cylinder light source which is what I was using
> behind the image map. It is obvious that it has a very different
> effect on the way it interacts with scattering media. I stopped it
> rather quickly after seeing how it looked and finished the render
> in the official build of Pov 3.1. For the amount of time spent
> rendering it was not worth it to start over to remove it plus I
> want Nathan to see the difference as well.
> 
> --
> Ken Tyler
> 
> mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net
> 
>   ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  [Image]

-- 
 omniVERSE: beyond the universe
  http://members.aol.com/inversez/homepage.htm
 mailto:inv### [at] aolcom?Subject=PoV-News

Post a reply to this message

Bob Hughes wrote:
> 
> Difference is right. A shift in the light even. At first I thought I was
> looking at a window then realized with help of those steps it wasn't.
> Otherwise I could have said "What a pale, washed out window there" :)
> Really though, there is no colorful intensity, what went wrong? Wait a
> minute, you aren't using 'transmit' too are you, instead of just
> 'filter' alone?

Hi Bob,

  Actually I lost a lot of the color I was getting when I increased the
intervals for the final image. At 5 intervals the colors were noticable
but the reduction of particle size associated with the high interval
rate lost some of it's ability to carry the light color with it. I used
a setting of 45 for this image to reduce the horrible blotchyness you
get at lower numbers. It may also have to due with my choosen media
reaction color setting in the media statement to some extent.

  The transmit function is not a good choice for this operation. You
want to filter the color of the light having the image map add it's
color to the light passing through it. Transmit passes the original
color of the light and not the color of the material it passes through.
Yes I relied upon filter and not transmit for the projected image and
color dependancy.

  Certainly there are areas for improvement and as I mentioned in my
original post this was a proof of concept image and not a work of
art. I think I proved the concept with this test and the rest is
mearly an exersize in optimizing the parameters to use and finding
the appropriate backgound to highlight the effect.

  In retrospect I wish I had placed the projection window close to a
corner and then had the opposing wall that made the other half of the
corner the surface that recieved the projected image. I am almost
positive the distance the light must travel has an impact on how well
the media interacts with the light source.

  Having said that it occurs to me that I may not have used a high
enough intensity level for the cylinder light used to carry the image
maps color through the medium. I had is set to rgb 5 which as I think
about it is somewhat on the low side for this process application.
Higher values would most likely have increased the color density seen
in my example and is certainly warrents further exploration.


Comments ?


-- 
Ken Tyler

mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net

Post a reply to this message

Now this is interesting. 
Thankyou.


Ken wrote:
> 
> Greetings Pov People,
> 
>  The title of this message comes from an off had comment I made
> yesterday in .general. I mentioned if I ever figured out a way
> to get an image map like a stained glass window to interact with
> media I would patent the process. Wouldn't you know it I achieved
> that goal this evening. It needs refinement but the process works
> as can be seen in the very preliminary example.
> 
>   You should be able to see a light atmospheric haze and the image
> you see is actually projected from off the screen to the right
> across to the opposite wall and steps area. As this took close to
> 8 hrs. to render I am unlikely to pursue this particular image any
> further. It was mostly a proof of concept image and I am more than
> willing to share my work to date with anyone interested in how the
> process works.
> 
>   You will see at about one third the way down the image a streak
> or difference in appearance. This was caused by me from stopping
> the render at that point. I opened the file in the photon patch
> and choose the continue rendering function to compare the behaviour
> between the two versions. Nathan has added a true parallel ray
> function to the cylinder light source which is what I was using
> behind the image map. It is obvious that it has a very different
> effect on the way it interacts with scattering media. I stopped it
> rather quickly after seeing how it looked and finished the render
> in the official build of Pov 3.1. For the amount of time spent
> rendering it was not worth it to start over to remove it plus I
> want Nathan to see the difference as well.
> 
> --
> Ken Tyler
> 
> mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net
> 
>   --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>  [Image]

-- 
//Spider
        [ spi### [at] bahnhofse ]-[ http://www.bahnhof.se/~spider/ ]
What I can do and what I could do, I just don't know anymore
                "Marian"
        By: "Sisters Of Mercy"

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Bob Hughes wrote:
> 
> Difference is right. A shift in the light even. At first I thought I was
> looking at a window then realized with help of those steps it wasn't.
> Otherwise I could have said "What a pale, washed out window there" :)
> Really though, there is no colorful intensity, what went wrong? Wait a
> minute, you aren't using 'transmit' too are you, instead of just
> 'filter' alone?

P.S. Jpeg compression are Bad Bad Bad. Tga is much more Gooder !

P.P.S. Media rendering times are Bad Bad Bad. Boo ! Hiss !

-- 
Ken Tyler

mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net

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I had some limited success with a similar project some time ago. But back
then I still had a 486. Guess why I quit (and didn't patent it).
As for the image, a colored mosaic window - like yours - will probably be
the most common use for this effect. It also tends to be the worst kind of
an image to project through media - lot of sarp color variation requiring
high sampling rates...

Margus

Ken wrote in message <370### [at] pacbellnet>...
>Greetings Pov People,
>
> The title of this message comes from an off had comment I made
>yesterday in .general. I mentioned if I ever figured out a way
>to get an image map like a stained glass window to interact with
>media I would patent the process. Wouldn't you know it I achieved
>that goal this evening. It needs refinement but the process works
>as can be seen in the very preliminary example.
>
>  You should be able to see a light atmospheric haze and the image
>you see is actually projected from off the screen to the right
>across to the opposite wall and steps area. As this took close to
>8 hrs. to render I am unlikely to pursue this particular image any
>further. It was mostly a proof of concept image and I am more than
>willing to share my work to date with anyone interested in how the
>process works.
>
>
>  You will see at about one third the way down the image a streak
>or difference in appearance. This was caused by me from stopping
>the render at that point. I opened the file in the photon patch
>and choose the continue rendering function to compare the behaviour
>between the two versions. Nathan has added a true parallel ray
>function to the cylinder light source which is what I was using
>behind the image map. It is obvious that it has a very different
>effect on the way it interacts with scattering media. I stopped it
>rather quickly after seeing how it looked and finished the render
>in the official build of Pov 3.1. For the amount of time spent
>rendering it was not worth it to start over to remove it plus I
>want Nathan to see the difference as well.
>
>--
>Ken Tyler
>
>mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net

Post a reply to this message

With those darned cylinder lights what matters most is the tightness
value. If too low they are only bright centrally, however this doesn't
appear to be a problem here since the image is fully engulfed in light
and I don't see a central high intensity. Bet you already knew about
cylinder lights though.
That intervals versus color saturation is an interesting notion. I
noticed that the less intervals was the more full color (red 1 for
instance) there is instead of whiter and whiter when increased. Although
there is a mixture of both I've seen. Speckled mess usually too. I would
think it may have more to do with your overlapping colored rays of
light.
Was there 'absorption' in there?
'media' still befuddles me much :)


Ken wrote:
> 
>   Actually I lost a lot of the color I was getting when I increased the
> intervals for the final image. At 5 intervals the colors were noticable
> but the reduction of particle size associated with the high interval
> rate lost some of it's ability to carry the light color with it. I used
> a setting of 45 for this image to reduce the horrible blotchyness you
> get at lower numbers. It may also have to due with my choosen media
> reaction color setting in the media statement to some extent.
> 
>   The transmit function is not a good choice for this operation. You
> want to filter the color of the light having the image map add it's
> color to the light passing through it. Transmit passes the original
> color of the light and not the color of the material it passes through.
> Yes I relied upon filter and not transmit for the projected image and
> color dependancy.
> 
>   Certainly there are areas for improvement and as I mentioned in my
> original post this was a proof of concept image and not a work of
> art. I think I proved the concept with this test and the rest is
> mearly an exersize in optimizing the parameters to use and finding
> the appropriate backgound to highlight the effect.
> 
>   In retrospect I wish I had placed the projection window close to a
> corner and then had the opposing wall that made the other half of the
> corner the surface that recieved the projected image. I am almost
> positive the distance the light must travel has an impact on how well
> the media interacts with the light source.
> 
>   Having said that it occurs to me that I may not have used a high
> enough intensity level for the cylinder light used to carry the image
> maps color through the medium. I had is set to rgb 5 which as I think
> about it is somewhat on the low side for this process application.
> Higher values would most likely have increased the color density seen
> in my example and is certainly warrents further exploration.
> 
> Comments ?
> 
> --
> Ken Tyler
> 
> mailto://tylereng@pacbell.net

-- 
 omniVERSE: beyond the universe
  http://members.aol.com/inversez/homepage.htm
 mailto:inv### [at] aolcom?Subject=PoV-News

Post a reply to this message