Jim Charter wrote:
> Yeah I guess.  But that's the reason?  Since it's called a credit card 
> account I can't keep a positive balance as a buffer?

That would defeat the point of it.  As a "credit" card, it's a line of 
credit to you.  That is, a loan for you to access.  What you're trying 
to do is make payments on money you haven't borrowed yet.

Sounds to me like you'd be just fine with a debit card.  Rather than 
drawing against a line of credit (and thus increasing your debt every 
time you use it), a debit card draws against the balance in a checking 
account (reducing your capital instead).

...Chambers

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Jim Charter wrote:
> Darren New wrote:
> 
>>
>> More specifically, see what your grace period is and what your monthly 
>> billing date is. Sign up for on-line bill paying at your bank. 
>> Complain at them if it isn't free, or at least if it costs more than a 
>> stamp.
> 
> 
> Yes I have to understand this grace period concept better.  I was under 
> the impression that at say midnight of the day of the due date which is 
> I think the 15th of the month, if I happened to have an amount owed 
> showing, then I would be charged interest.

I believe it's a law in the US that you have at least one billing cycle 
before interest is charged.  That is, if your bill comes every 30 days, 
then they can't charge interest on something until 30 days after you've 
charged it, no matter when your bill comes.

That's why so many people don't care about the interest rate on their 
credit card: they pay off the balance every cycle, so they never get 
charged any interest :)

...Chambers

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And lo on Thu, 07 Aug 2008 17:50:18 +0100, Jim Henderson  
<nos### [at] nospamcom> did spake, saying:

> On Thu, 07 Aug 2008 14:28:52 +0100, Phil Cook wrote:
>
>>>>  Same thing with the majority of utility bills - the invoice comes
>>>> through  and the payment drawn a few days later. In some case they'll
>>>> charge you an  'admin' fee for not doing it this way.
>>>>
>>> Yeah, I might try and get organized enough to try something like that.
>>> At least for bills.  I didn't know you could do it for credit card.
>>
>> Well you can in the UK
>
> You can with some cards in the US as well.  We do autopay for nearly
> everything (but we also look at the bills closely, too)

Well yeah, I don't understand people who don't bother.

> Got hung up *once* with this because the payment I put in ended up being
> less than the minimum (had to get the brakes done on the car - and we
> used the wrong card) and I got a call from their collections department
> the *day* after the bill was due.  We got them to reverse the late fee
> and reinstate the 0% transfer balance, but it was really surprising they
> turned it over to collections so quickly.  Discover Financial apparently
> is struggling.

Well the setup on my credit card is that the full amount is taken  
automatically unless I change it, but I could set it up to take the  
minimum only; again unless I change it. The only account I then have to  
monitor money-wise is my bank-account.

> (Of course you wouldn't know anything about them in the UK, since
> virtually nobody accepts them over there)

Who now? :-) It's Visa and Mastercard here (for credit cards), unless it's  
somewhere fancy that'll accept Amex. Heh read a piece from Amex justifying  
their higher-then-others transaction charges, people with Amex spend more  
so you make more profit then the el-cheapo cards; to put it another way  
rich people use Amex so let them do so at your store. To put it yet  
another way if you see a store accepting Amex expect all the prices to be  
double :-P

-- 
Phil Cook

--
I once tried to be apathetic, but I just couldn't be bothered
http://flipc.blogspot.com

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And lo on Fri, 08 Aug 2008 00:37:02 +0100, Jim Charter <jrc### [at] msncom>  
did spake, saying:

> Phil Cook wrote:
>
>>  that sort of maturity?
>
> Yep.

Well that's okay then ;-)

>>  That's the bizarreness so you buy something on CC for $40 then when  
>> it  comes to pay you send them $50 so you have positive $10? The only  
>> way I  see this as a good thing is if the credit card pays interest on  
>> the  amount, which I know some do, but in that instance they wouldn't  
>> be  refunding it to you so why do it?
>>
>
> More like: keep +$400 in the account.

But you're not getting any interest on this money, as Darren said if  
you're going to do this you might as well have a debit card which  
shouldn't have any fees at all and pays you interest for a positive  
balance.

> I'll admit that maybe it's bizarre but what am I *so* guilty of?  Maybe  
> of being a bit neurotic, maybe of just thinking in a different way? It  
> keeps the money more tangible to me. The monthly due-date lockstep just  
> trips me up that's all.

You're guilty of being bizzarre, which if it were a crime would mean I  
(and the vast majority) would be locked up with you.

-- 
Phil Cook

--
I once tried to be apathetic, but I just couldn't be bothered
http://flipc.blogspot.com

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Phil Cook wrote:

>> Phil Cook wrote:

> 
> But you're not getting any interest on this money, as Darren said if  
> you're going to do this you might as well have a debit card which  
> shouldn't have any fees at all and pays you interest for a positive  
> balance.
> 

Something to check into also.  I was under the impression they charged a 
fee per use.  I do use it on occasion.  Never really confirmed if a fee 
was charged.

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Phil Cook wrote:

> 
> You're guilty of being bizzarre, which if it were a crime would mean I  
> (and the vast majority) would be locked up with you.
> 

As you get older you get comfortable with it I guess.  Another 'buffer' 
situation for me involves the need to take a 'till' with me when I am 
driving the taxi.  When I first started I got caught unable to make 
change a couple of times.  This situation I found embarrassing even 
humiliating.  So I began to hoard 10's, 5's, and singles.  Now I have a 
'buffer' well in excess of 150 $10's, 200 $5's, and 500 singles, 
jacketed and hoarded away in a box.  I am finally comfortable and pay 
less attention to the problem and no longer aggressively hoard. For 
instance now at the end of a shift I will deposit my receipts across all 
denominations instead of just the $20's.  But the funny thing is, 
certain techniques and disciplines I developed during my hoarding phase 
became so integrated with my daily life that I continue them anyway.  In 
fact I now have to consciously 'prune' my hoard down from time to time.

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And lo on Fri, 08 Aug 2008 11:33:15 +0100, Jim Charter <jrc### [at] msncom>  
did spake, saying:

> Phil Cook wrote:
>
>>> Phil Cook wrote:
>
>>  But you're not getting any interest on this money, as Darren said if   
>> you're going to do this you might as well have a debit card which   
>> shouldn't have any fees at all and pays you interest for a positive   
>> balance.
>>
>
> Something to check into also.  I was under the impression they charged a  
> fee per use.  I do use it on occasion.  Never really confirmed if a fee  
> was charged.

The only time we in the UK tend to get charges is if we use our debit  
cards abroad, saying that though some banks are advertising the fact that  
they don't do this

>>  You're guilty of being bizzarre, which if it were a crime would mean  
>> I  (and the vast majority) would be locked up with you.
>
> As you get older you get comfortable with it I guess.  Another 'buffer'  
> situation for me involves the need to take a 'till' with me when I am  
> driving the taxi.  When I first started I got caught unable to make  
> change a couple of times.  This situation I found embarrassing even  
> humiliating.  So I began to hoard 10's, 5's, and singles.  Now I have a  
> 'buffer' well in excess of 150 $10's, 200 $5's, and 500 singles,  
> jacketed and hoarded away in a box.  I am finally comfortable and pay  
> less attention to the problem and no longer aggressively hoard. For  
> instance now at the end of a shift I will deposit my receipts across all  
> denominations instead of just the $20's.  But the funny thing is,  
> certain techniques and disciplines I developed during my hoarding phase  
> became so integrated with my daily life that I continue them anyway.  In  
> fact I now have to consciously 'prune' my hoard down from time to time.

Just the way we work; we do something out of neccesity, repeat it, and  
then find it turns to habit and we keep doing it long after the cause has  
passed. I suppose it's the potential in the neural pathways, just easier  
to follow the groove.

-- 
Phil Cook

--
I once tried to be apathetic, but I just couldn't be bothered
http://flipc.blogspot.com

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On Fri, 08 Aug 2008 00:12:48 +0100, St. wrote:

>      Heh, they did in our school: Beans on toast or cheese straws.
> 
>      ("Home Economics" was our cooking lessons which they don't have
>      now).

They did when I was in middle school as well (well, it wasn't called 
"middle school" when I went through it).  We had sewing and cooking 
classes.

Jim

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On Fri, 08 Aug 2008 09:16:30 +0100, Phil Cook wrote:

>> You can with some cards in the US as well.  We do autopay for nearly
>> everything (but we also look at the bills closely, too)
> 
> Well yeah, I don't understand people who don't bother.

I think it's a matter of trust - I can understand that.  It's also (for 
us) a matter of checking the bills out carefully before autopay goes 
through.  Some things, though, like the mortgage payment, we know the 
amount that it should be so if it varies that raises a red flag for us.  
(And it hasn't varied).

>> Got hung up *once* with this because the payment I put in ended up
>> being less than the minimum (had to get the brakes done on the car -
>> and we used the wrong card) and I got a call from their collections
>> department the *day* after the bill was due.  We got them to reverse
>> the late fee and reinstate the 0% transfer balance, but it was really
>> surprising they turned it over to collections so quickly.  Discover
>> Financial apparently is struggling.
> 
> Well the setup on my credit card is that the full amount is taken
> automatically unless I change it, but I could set it up to take the
> minimum only; again unless I change it. The only account I then have to
> monitor money-wise is my bank-account.

Yeah, if we were to do that, we'd bounce payments at the moment.  My 
parents worked things like you do, though - pay it off every month.  
AFAIK, my mom still does that.

>> (Of course you wouldn't know anything about them in the UK, since
>> virtually nobody accepts them over there)
> 
> Who now? :-) It's Visa and Mastercard here (for credit cards), unless
> it's somewhere fancy that'll accept Amex. Heh read a piece from Amex
> justifying their higher-then-others transaction charges, people with
> Amex spend more so you make more profit then the el-cheapo cards; to put
> it another way rich people use Amex so let them do so at your store. To
> put it yet another way if you see a store accepting Amex expect all the
> prices to be double :-P

Yeah, like I said. :-)

We did get an Amex card - I use it to the tune of a whopping $11.99 per 
month for a credit monitoring service (which is handy as well, because 
that tells me if anything hokey goes on in my accounts).  But the reason 
we got it was so we could establish some form of credit that would be 
accepted when we move to the UK.  Our Visa/Mastercard cards are usable 
over there, sure, but from the research my wife did, if we want to open a 
bank account, it's easier if we have an Amex account to show good payment 
history.  I don't recall all the details on why this worked better, 
though.

Jim

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Jim Henderson wrote:
> So, for example, on one of my Discover cards (don't ask - long story), 
> I've got a 0% transfer rate, but I have to use the card twice a month to 
> keep the 0% rate on what was transferred.  But I get hit at something 
> like 14% on those two usages, and those two usages continue to accrue 
> interest until the 0% amount is paid off.

I'd recommend you check with a local Credit Union about getting a new 
card; those terms are horrible.

Alternatively, if you live in WA, OR, ID or CA you can get a card at 
Sterling Savings Bank with pretty good terms, as well.

...Chambers

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