Jim Kress wrote:
> 
> From: http://www.opengl.org/Products/Products.html
haven't read it.

> "OpenGL is the most widely used API on UNIX and Win9x/NT systems for
> professional & consumer graphics applications. With the licensing of OpenGL
> by Apple, it is also making rapid headway into Mac OS applications. "
there still is DOS, my fav. :-) 

> It started life in the Unix world and then migrated elsewhere.
ok, i started in DOS, and mainly feel at home there.

 

-- 
//Spider 
( spi### [at] bahnhofse ) [ http://www.bahnhof.se/~spider/ ]
#declare life = rand(seed(42))*sqrt(-1);

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Jim Kress wrote in message <36d9d984.0@news.povray.org>...
>Does Moray import POV height fields (like from Leveler) and POV inc files?
>Last time I looked, I didn't see that it could.  I need this capability to
>make it worth while.
>
>Also, Moray is expensive ...
>
>--
>Jim
Moray doesn't "import" h_f's rather it allows you to create one from an
image, as for Moray being expensive, look into all the other commercial
modellers out there.

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Personally, I think it would be more useful to add REYES scanline
rendering to POV.  Maybe call it POV-Scan. :)

I don't see that a real-time engine would be that useful WITHIN POV,
since that's more appropriate for a modeller...but a nice scanline
renderer would be great for previewing scenes.

It would probably require major additions to the code (In other words, a
pipe dream).

-Mike

Jim Kress wrote:
> 
> The only annoying thing I run into when using POV-ray is the inability to
> preview my scenes.  I spend a seemingly endless amount of time rendering,
> re-rendering, re-rendering,... just to get the camera and lighting position
> I need.
> 
> OpenGL offers an easy to implement, raster scan technology that could be
> (easily?) implemented in POV-Ray.  It would be ideal for generating previews
> so the user could determine camera, lighting, etc and then do the final
> render with the ray-tracer.  If I knew how to do C++, I'd do it myself but
> since I don't, is there anyone out there who would like to add this
> IMMENSELY useful feature to POV?
> 
> Please, please, please, .....
> 
> --
> Jim
> 
> Check out my web site http://www.kressworks.com/
> It'll blow your mind (politically), stimulate your senses (artistically)
> and provide scientific insights beyond compare!
> 
> Be sure to read the Warp maintained POV VFAQ:
> http://iki.fi/warp/povVFAQ.html

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ooohhh.. maybe I could do this for my Senior Thesis... thanks for the
idea, but if I do it, it won't be done until next year at earliest...

Steve


Jim Kress wrote:
> 
> The only annoying thing I run into when using POV-ray is the inability to
> preview my scenes.  I spend a seemingly endless amount of time rendering,
> re-rendering, re-rendering,... just to get the camera and lighting position
> I need.
> 
> OpenGL offers an easy to implement, raster scan technology that could be
> (easily?) implemented in POV-Ray.  It would be ideal for generating previews
> so the user could determine camera, lighting, etc and then do the final
> render with the ray-tracer.  If I knew how to do C++, I'd do it myself but
> since I don't, is there anyone out there who would like to add this
> IMMENSELY useful feature to POV?
> 
> Please, please, please, .....
> 
> --
> Jim
> 
> Check out my web site http://www.kressworks.com/
> It'll blow your mind (politically), stimulate your senses (artistically)
> and provide scientific insights beyond compare!
> 
> Be sure to read the Warp maintained POV VFAQ:
> http://iki.fi/warp/povVFAQ.html

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You seem to imply that it is not standard on Windows. Is that what you meant?
It's been around for quite awhile, and in WinNT since vary early, and in 95
since OSR/2.

Thorsten Froehlich wrote:

> In article <36d9d4f2.0@news.povray.org> , "Jim Kress" <jim### [at] dccmailcom>
> wrote:
>
> > OpenGL offers an easy to implement, raster scan technology that could be
> > (easily?) implemented in POV-Ray.
>
> Except on mainstream platforms OpenGL is available everywhere.
> If you use a Win PC you can use Moray...
>
>      Thorsten

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In article <36d9d81c.0@news.povray.org> , "Thorsten Froehlich" 
<fro### [at] charliecnsiitedu> wrote:

> Except on mainstream platforms OpenGL is available everywhere.
Sometimes what I write is not what I want to write :-(
This sentence should say (nearly) exactly the opposite:

Except on mainstream platforms OpenGL isn't available everywhere.
                                        ^^^

Sorry, for this stupid typo!


     Thorsten

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In article <36DA00C2.45AFA4A9@geocities.com> , "Jon A. Cruz" 
<jon### [at] geocitiescom> wrote:

> You seem to imply that it is not standard on Windows. Is that what you meant?

No, I made a stupid typo changing what I wanted to say completely, sorry! Of
course as you noticed what I wrote makes no sense at all! (See my other new
post.)


     Thorsten

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Jim Kress wrote:
> 
> The only annoying thing I run into when using POV-ray is the inability to
> preview my scenes.  I spend a seemingly endless amount of time rendering,
> re-rendering, re-rendering,... just to get the camera and lighting position
> I need.
> 
> OpenGL offers an easy to implement, raster scan technology that could be
> (easily?) implemented in POV-Ray.

What POV-Ray could use is an OpenGL-based modeler.  If it's external to
POV-Ray itself but capable of producing POV-Ray files (even, in the best
of all possible worlds, reading POV-Ray files), the platform-dependence
Thorsten mentions wouldn't be an issue.  None of the currently available
modelers are very portable, AFAIK.  But what you suggest is best
implemented in a modeler rather than the (existing) renderer.

Mark Gordon
mtg### [at] mailbagcom
http://www.mailbag.com/users/mtgordon/index.html

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Just to toss this in here for possible implementors:

Java3D could be one way to get a decent modeler going, and get some
cross-platform at the same time.
The current implementations use OpenGL on Solaris, and OpenGL on MS Windows, with
a DirectX version coming soon.

I'm in the middle of a couple other projects at the moment, so haven't taken this
up. However, once I get a simple distributed rendering system going, a simple
animator/modeller is close to next. After looking at the Java3D demo apps, it
seems to be at a good performance/abilities level for such applications.


Mark Gordon wrote:

> Jim Kress wrote:
> >
> > The only annoying thing I run into when using POV-ray is the inability to
> > preview my scenes.  I spend a seemingly endless amount of time rendering,
> > re-rendering, re-rendering,... just to get the camera and lighting position
> > I need.
> >
> > OpenGL offers an easy to implement, raster scan technology that could be
> > (easily?) implemented in POV-Ray.
>
> What POV-Ray could use is an OpenGL-based modeler.  If it's external to
> POV-Ray itself but capable of producing POV-Ray files (even, in the best
> of all possible worlds, reading POV-Ray files), the platform-dependence
> Thorsten mentions wouldn't be an issue.  None of the currently available
> modelers are very portable, AFAIK.  But what you suggest is best
> implemented in a modeler rather than the (existing) renderer.
>
> Mark Gordon
> mtg### [at] mailbagcom
> http://www.mailbag.com/users/mtgordon/index.html
>
> -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
> Version: 3.12
> GCS/S d-- s-:+> a- C++ UA+$ UH+$ UO+ $US+ $UL++++ P+++ L++(+++) E W++ N+
> o--
> K++ w---$ O- M V--$ PS++ PE- Y+ PGP->+ t+ 5++ X R+ tv-- b++ DI++ D+ G
> e++>++++
> h- r*%--- y--
> ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------

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"Jim Kress" <jim### [at] dccmailcom> wrote:

>OpenGL offers an easy to implement, raster scan technology that could be
>(easily?) implemented in POV-Ray.  It would be ideal for generating previews
>so the user could determine camera, lighting, etc and then do the final
>render with the ray-tracer.  If I knew how to do C++, I'd do it myself but
>since I don't, is there anyone out there who would like to add this
>IMMENSELY useful feature to POV?

Don't think we haven't thought of this. But it would be -very- difficult.

OpenGL is totally different to POV in that it only implements a few primitives,
and basically requires that any complex object be built up from polygons.

POV, on the other hand, supports an extensive set of primitives, plus other
advanced things such as CSG (performing CSG on polygon meshes is not trivial).

To make a OpenGL preview, we would have to write code for each and every
primitive that POV supports, that would convert an instance of that primitive
into a form suitable for use in OpenGL, plus, probably do the CSG as well
(unless we can factor it into the conversion process - thus leveraging the
existing CSG code in POV).

It's certainly high on my wish list for 4.0 but there's no telling if it will
ever happen.

However, if there's any good C/C++ programmers out there who want to volunteer
to add such support to the existing 3.1d codebase ...

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