Brook Monroe wrote:
> 
> Matthew Mc Clement wrote:
> 
> > Yup, you're right, moray is to [sic] confusing. I myself tried and then
> > stopped using it almost immediately. Can't get used to the interface.
> 
> Obviously you've never seen AutoCAD.  THAT's confusing.  Moray is the
> least-confusing CAD interface I've ever seen, and I'm very surprised to find
> this opinion voiced.  What is it that you find so confusing?  (I'm a
> Moray-for-Windows beta-tester, BTW.)
> 
> jbm!

Well, I just can't get used to the interface. It bugs me for some
reason. If you run Linux try Amapi(http://www.yonowat.com). The
interface is totaly original, and I have been using it for about 6
months now, and I guess I've just gotten to used to it. I can't even use
basic modellers like Breeze Designer, Povlab, GUM, just to name a few.
PovsB is about the only windows modeller I can use. Of the dos modellers
I can use MNM but thats USE, I am by no means a pro at it. In fact I
have trouble with most modellers. The ones I can use best are Amapi(of
course :)), Truespace 2, Extreme 3D, Infini-D(only a little), PovsB and
MNM. Imagine, 3DS, Lightwave just seem too confusing for some reason or
another....which is a pitty as Truespace is the only modeller that
supports reasonably easy and good animation effects...sigh!

Cheers, Matthew

P.S. I have tried Autocad 14 and yeah, you're right, it is a bit
confusing ;-). Microstation is nice, but even the student licenses are a

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Matthew Mc Clement wrote:

> Well, I just can't get used to the interface. It bugs me for some
> reason. If you run Linux try Amapi(http://www.yonowat.com).

Nope.  Can't run Linux.  Too used to MS Office.  (Weak reasoning, perhaps, but by
now it's a habit.)

> The interface is totaly original,

Actually, I find that a frightening thought. :)

> and I have been using it for about 6
> months now, and I guess I've just gotten to used to it. I can't even use
> basic modellers like Breeze Designer, Povlab, GUM, just to name a few.

I'll agree with you there.

> PovsB is about the only windows modeller I can use. Of the dos modellers
> I can use MNM but thats USE, I am by no means a pro at it. In fact I
> have trouble with most modellers. The ones I can use best are Amapi(of
> course :)), Truespace 2, Extreme 3D, Infini-D(only a little), PovsB and
> MNM. Imagine, 3DS, Lightwave just seem too confusing for some reason or
> another....which is a pitty as Truespace is the only modeller that
> supports reasonably easy and good animation effects...sigh!
>

I never could figure out Truespace's UI.  I tried it for several versions and I
still couldn't figure out how to do the simplest thing.  Lightwave I had more
success at, except for getting the lighting right.

Of course, I program for a living.  I don't do rendering for a living.  (And some
say you can tell that from my work.)

jbm!

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Brook Monroe wrote:

> Matthew Mc Clement wrote:
>
> > Kardal wrote:
> > >
> > > Starting with moray?!  I started and still use raw pov code.  Moray is too
> > > confusing.
> >
> > Yup, you're right, moray is to [sic] confusing. I myself tried and then
> > stopped using it almost immediately. Can't get used to the interface.
>
> Obviously you've never seen AutoCAD.  THAT's confusing.  Moray is the
> least-confusing CAD interface I've ever seen, and I'm very surprised to find
> this opinion voiced.  What is it that you find so confusing?  (I'm a
> Moray-for-Windows beta-tester, BTW.)
>
> jbm!

  I've been spoiled by the powerful and expensive CADKey 97 (www.cadkey.com).
Unfortunatley, I can't use it for pov because there is no cheap direct, or even
indirect, way to export to pov.  It exports Autocad DXF files, but I haven't found
a good DXF to Anything I Can Use converter.

I'll have to wait and see what the windows version looks like.

~Kardal~

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Kardal wrote:

> Brook Monroe wrote:
>
> I've been spoiled by the powerful and expensive CADKey 97 (www.cadkey.com).

Oh, ~expensive~.  Well, I was going to look, but I can't afford expensive right now.

> Unfortunatley, I can't use it for pov because there is no cheap direct, or even
> indirect, way to export to pov.  It exports Autocad DXF files, but I haven't found
> a good DXF to Anything I Can Use converter.
>

Any of the DXF-to-POV converters I've seen produce less than useful results because
you can't tag different parts of the object with different textures--everything comes
out as a monolithic mesh.  That's not much use when you're rendering an F-14 or
what-have-you.  The Win32 version still sports the 4-view interface, which is what
attracted me to Moray in the first place.  (That, and the lack of that annoying
"command-line" thing that AutoCad and MNM do.)

jbm!

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There is one out there, I had it a while ago and lost the zip of
it...you can export dxf-pov and either label parts with a texture
(pov-original) before export or in the pov code the parts are either
union triangles or bicubics, separate, and can be re textured.

It very much depends on the original dxf, I've found - some let you
export parts, other seem to be one unit...???
-- 
** Lets clean up the world - kill a politician today!!
** The only good politician is a dead politician.
** To email me: bay### [at] coastlinkcomau
** Believe 1% of what you see or hear.
** Always read between the lines.

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BearFace wrote:
> 
> There is one out there, I had it a while ago and lost the zip of
> it...you can export dxf-pov and either label parts with a texture
> (pov-original) before export or in the pov code the parts are either
> union triangles or bicubics, separate, and can be re textured.
> 
> It very much depends on the original dxf, I've found - some let you
> export parts, other seem to be one unit...???

Actually it really depends on the program you are importing the dxf
into. dxf supports both layers and different colours for the various
parts. For example: Extreme 3d imports dxf files but for some reason
totaly ignores the layers. If you want sperate the pieces you need to
make them different colours even although extreme 3d supports layers??!!
On the other hand, Breeze Designer just imports the dxf file as a big
mesh(actually as a 2d dxf extrusion I think but its about the same
thing) and so you can't texturize the seperate parts.

what it all sums up as is that I personally hate the dxf format because
the files are large and clumsy. I'd have prefered it if the .3ds format
was standard as its files are more compact. Admittedly it is binary and
I think there may be problems with transfering it between to types of
computers but then you can just use .asc files which are the plain text
versions of 3ds files....

Cheers, Matthew

P.S. Have you tried WCVT2POV? Wriiten by Keith Rule. Try a serach on
altavista as I've lost the url to his webpage....

Post a reply to this message

Matthew Mc Clement wrote:

> BearFace wrote:
> >
> > There is one out there, I had it a while ago and lost the zip of
> > it...you can export dxf-pov and either label parts with a texture
> > (pov-original) before export or in the pov code the parts are either
> > union triangles or bicubics, separate, and can be re textured.
> >
> > It very much depends on the original dxf, I've found - some let you
> > export parts, other seem to be one unit...???
>
> Actually it really depends on the program you are importing the dxf
> into. dxf supports both layers and different colours for the various
> parts. For example: Extreme 3d imports dxf files but for some reason
> totaly ignores the layers. If you want sperate the pieces you need to
> make them different colours even although extreme 3d supports layers??!!
> On the other hand, Breeze Designer just imports the dxf file as a big
> mesh(actually as a 2d dxf extrusion I think but its about the same
> thing) and so you can't texturize the seperate parts.
>
> what it all sums up as is that I personally hate the dxf format because
> the files are large and clumsy. I'd have prefered it if the .3ds format
> was standard as its files are more compact. Admittedly it is binary and
> I think there may be problems with transfering it between to types of
> computers but then you can just use .asc files which are the plain text
> versions of 3ds files....
>
> Cheers, Matthew
>
> P.S. Have you tried WCVT2POV? Wriiten by Keith Rule. Try a serach on
> altavista as I've lost the url to his webpage....

 Tried it, did not work.  Shame.

~Kardal~

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I would bet that Crossroads(the new and improved version of WCVT2POV) would
convert it. Try it out.

Kardal wrote:

> Matthew Mc Clement wrote:
>
> > BearFace wrote:
> > >
> > > There is one out there, I had it a while ago and lost the zip of
> > > it...you can export dxf-pov and either label parts with a texture
> > > (pov-original) before export or in the pov code the parts are either
> > > union triangles or bicubics, separate, and can be re textured.
> > >
> > > It very much depends on the original dxf, I've found - some let you
> > > export parts, other seem to be one unit...???
> >
> > Actually it really depends on the program you are importing the dxf
> > into. dxf supports both layers and different colours for the various
> > parts. For example: Extreme 3d imports dxf files but for some reason
> > totaly ignores the layers. If you want sperate the pieces you need to
> > make them different colours even although extreme 3d supports layers??!!
> > On the other hand, Breeze Designer just imports the dxf file as a big
> > mesh(actually as a 2d dxf extrusion I think but its about the same
> > thing) and so you can't texturize the seperate parts.
> >
> > what it all sums up as is that I personally hate the dxf format because
> > the files are large and clumsy. I'd have prefered it if the .3ds format
> > was standard as its files are more compact. Admittedly it is binary and
> > I think there may be problems with transfering it between to types of
> > computers but then you can just use .asc files which are the plain text
> > versions of 3ds files....
> >
> > Cheers, Matthew
> >
> > P.S. Have you tried WCVT2POV? Wriiten by Keith Rule. Try a serach on
> > altavista as I've lost the url to his webpage....
>
>  Tried it, did not work.  Shame.
>
> ~Kardal~



--
                    Bryan Cool
   **********
       http://xoom.com/Cool3d/ - Cool3D
            ********************************
       http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Cavern/5621/
             Bryan Cool's Web of Spider-Man

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Michael,

	If you see this please give me a city block number!  I
	have sent email twice, perhaps it did not get through.

_John Miskinis_

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John,

On Sat, 10 Jan 1998 12:38:35 -0500, John Miskinis <mis### [at] emccom>
wrote:

>Michael,
>
>	If you see this please give me a city block number!  I
>	have sent email twice, perhaps it did not get through.
>
>_John Miskinis_


I have replied twice !

Did you get any of them ?  If not, what is your e-mail address?

I've tried mis### [at] emccom, which bounced, and mis### [at] milemccom
and mis### [at] docmilemccom which didn't bounce.

Bye for now

Michael

----------------------------------

Copied message:-

Hello John,

John Miskinis wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
>         This was/is a very cool idea.  I would like to join this
>         effort.  Please assign me a "spot", and I'll create a
>         basic scene, and build on it over time.

Thanks John.
Your block has been claimed.  I'll be updating my homepage soon with a
guide for builders, but briefly, this is all you should need to get
started.

The blocks are +112.5 units in the X and Z directions( 225m square),
+Y is up,and yours is the block whose centre is translated < -125, 0,
-875 >
from the origin. The scale is 1 unit = 1 metre.

The ground for the city is a plane with a 1000 unit deep box cut from
it
under the city to allow cunstruction below ground level.  This means 
that your file will need to contain your own ground, with a line
something
like this:-

box {<-112.5,0,-112.5> <112.5,-.1,112.5> translate < -125, 0, -875 >
pigment
 {color rgb <0.1,0.8,0.1>}}

Your contribution can use bitmaps and multiple .inc files, but should
be
sent as one compressed file if possible.  To avoid file name clashes I
am
allocating everyone a prefix for their filenames, yours is "bb".
Please 
start all of your filenames with this, and please use only lower case
in 
your filenames.

I look forward to seeing your contribution,

Bye for now

Michael

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