"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
>    Hmm, could be, I think I've always had problems with choosing the right
> gamma numbers. At the moment assumed_gamma is set to .75, which looks ok to
> me.

Uh!

I keep having no idea (and can't seem to learn) which of all those gamma
settings to set to 1.0 and which to set to 2.2 - but I know for sure that there
should *not* be a .75 *anywhere*...

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St. nous illumina en ce 2009-01-31 07:13 -->
> Hi all, thought I'd better post something because I haven't for a while 
> now...
> 
>   I've come to the conclusion that PoV-Ray *is* a part of RL. (For me at 
> least).
> 
>   Anyway, here's a Tiffany lamp that I've been working on recently. This is 
> the colourful version with area_light turned off so don't worry, the final 
> won't be like this. I tried a render last night with area_light turned on 
> and this morning it was at 63% and had been running for 7 hours, so I 
> stopped it. It was a closer shot as well.  :)
> 
>   I've frosted the red glass but I'm not sure if it will actually do 
> anything in the final image yet (or I'm not sure what I'm trying to achieve, 
> I guess some kind of diffusion I suppose), so I might take that out.
> 
>    Light is a single light_source, and all PoV 'bog' standard textures.  ;)
> 
>    Anyway, C&C always welcome.
> 
>      ~Steve~
> 
> 
Have you tryed using photons and some micro normals for the shade? Or some 
averaged normals? If you use averaged normals, don't use to many, try with 5 and 
don't go over 10 to 12.
That way, a point light shadow will receive light from the glass parts. There 
will also be some colour bleeding from area to area.
Tifany lamps, if I remembre correctly, only rarely use realy transparent glass, 
but more cloudy and translucent ones. And, often, the transparent glass was far 
from flat and uniform.

When averaging normals with reflections, 10 averaged normals give 10 samples.
When averaging normals with transparency, the first surface generate 10 samples, 
and each one of those, when encoutering the second surface, generate 10 more. 
This result in 100 total samples per pixel.


Do you know that Mr. Tyfany was a precurson in recycling? He started making his 
lamps to recuperate the breaked glass he all to often got in his glass 
deliveries. He also reused the bits left over after making stained glass for 
churches.

-- 
Alain
-------------------------------------------------
Don't waste your time on a man/woman, who isn't willing to waste their time on you.

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"clipka" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message 
news:web.4984fd3afd113391a50ebcaf0@news.povray.org...
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
>>    Hmm, could be, I think I've always had problems with choosing the 
>> right
>> gamma numbers. At the moment assumed_gamma is set to .75, which looks ok 
>> to
>> me.
>
> Uh!
>
> I keep having no idea (and can't seem to learn) which of all those gamma
> settings to set to 1.0 and which to set to 2.2 - but I know for sure that 
> there
> should *not* be a .75 *anywhere*...

 :) Why not? If I increase it, it gets darker.

    ~Steve~

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"clipka" <nomail@nomail> wrote in message 
news:web.4984fbea3364c832a50ebcaf0@news.povray.org...
> "St." <dot### [at] dotcom> wrote:
>> Here's the proper image attached with AA still off and area_light off 
>> too.
>> I'm doing another image later which I'll post tomorrow sometime.
>
> How come we can see the projected light on the mirror surface? Must be 
> *really*
> dusty... :P

   No, clean as a whistle! ;) Actually, it's not a mirror, it's just a box 
with a polished chrome finish. Now, it is planned to have some actual glass 
there because there really should be a double reflection of the lamp - one 
reflection from the mirror foil and one from the glass itself.  But I think 
the render time will suffer.

   ~Steve~

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Ok, I didn't render this last night because in the end, I realised that 
there was too much to play with so did the playing this morning instead. :)

  I've just rendered this image now, it took 1 hour 22 minutes with 
area_light turned on and normal AA. I changed the colours of the glass to be 
less pale as per Thomas' suggestion, but are these colours too vivid now? I 
also made the glass more opaque which kind of looks good to me, but what do 
you think?

   Lastly, I changed (for now) the lamp stand from Gold_Metal to T_Gold_2A 
which looks better imo. I haven't tried to make it look bronze yet, and I 
might need some help with that, but anyway, that's the next thing to try. 
Oh, and a power cable with possibly one of those switches that hangs down... 
oh, you know what I mean. :)

   ~Steve~

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Attachments:
Download 'snapshot2.jpg' (229 KB)

Preview of image 'snapshot2.jpg'

"Alain" <ele### [at] netscapenet> wrote in message 
news:4984fe9d@news.povray.org...
> St. nous illumina en ce 2009-01-31 07:13 -->

> Have you tryed using photons and some micro normals for the shade?

  Photons is there in my code Alain, but it's commented out. ;) I did try it 
but the first couple of lines took a while iirc.

   As for the normals, I've got this:

   normal{ bumps .5 scale .0001}

  enabled on the glass, but it's not actually showing now when it should be 
like in that other image. Hmm, I wonder why that is?


Or some
> averaged normals? If you use averaged normals, don't use to many, try with 
> 5 and don't go over 10 to 12. That way, a point light shadow will receive 
> light from the glass parts. There will also be some colour bleeding from 
> area to area.


Ok, this sounds good, but I've never used average normals, so how would I do 
that?


> Tifany lamps, if I remembre correctly, only rarely use realy transparent 
> glass, but more cloudy and translucent ones. And, often, the transparent 
> glass was far from flat and uniform.

     Yes, I know what you mean, I think I've got the translucency ok now, so 
I'll try to warp the glass panels a little. Should look good I think.


>
> When averaging normals with reflections, 10 averaged normals give 10 
> samples.
> When averaging normals with transparency, the first surface generate 10 
> samples, and each one of those, when encoutering the second surface, 
> generate 10 more. This result in 100 total samples per pixel.

    Is this a slow process? It does sound good.


>
>
> Do you know that Mr. Tyfany was a precurson in recycling? He started 
> making his lamps to recuperate the breaked glass he all to often got in 
> his glass deliveries. He also reused the bits left over after making 
> stained glass for churches.

    Do you know what? It all makes sense now. I never got the link to the 
recycling part. <Ding!/lightbulb> Heh...

      ~Steve~


>
> -- 
> Alain
> -------------------------------------------------
> Don't waste your time on a man/woman, who isn't willing to waste their 
> time on you.

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St. wrote:
> 
>  :) Why not? If I increase it, it gets darker.

Then you'll add more light and/or fix your display gamma in povray.ini
(so POV's preview looks correct):
Display_Gamma           = 1.6 (that my laptop's setting, check your own
monitor)

http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html#gammachart

>     ~Steve~

-Aero

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"Mike Hough" <nos### [at] nospamcom> schreef in bericht 
news:49848f0f$1@news.povray.org...
> Will look real nice with the area light enabled. The glass seems almost 
> like it is glowing. If you are using ambient for that part, I would try 
> turning that off and trying double_illuminate instead. Might give it a 
> little more depth.
>

Aah! High ambient! that explains a lot! I would settle for some intermediary 
value in this case.

Thomas

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"Eero Ahonen" <aer### [at] removethiszbxtnetinvalid> wrote in message 
news:4985654d$1@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:
>>
>>  :) Why not? If I increase it, it gets darker.
>
> Then you'll add more light and/or fix your display gamma in povray.ini
> (so POV's preview looks correct):
> Display_Gamma           = 1.6 (that my laptop's setting, check your own
> monitor)
>
> http://www.normankoren.com/makingfineprints1A.html#gammachart

    Cool. Thanks, it says 2.2 or 1.8. I tried both of these in the 
povray.ini file and it's still too dark.

       ~Steve~


>
>>     ~Steve~
>
> -Aero

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"St." <dot### [at] dotcom> schreef in bericht news:49856234@news.povray.org...
> Ok, I didn't render this last night because in the end, I realised that 
> there was too much to play with so did the playing this morning instead. 
> :)
>
>  I've just rendered this image now, it took 1 hour 22 minutes with 
> area_light turned on and normal AA. I changed the colours of the glass to 
> be less pale as per Thomas' suggestion, but are these colours too vivid 
> now? I also made the glass more opaque which kind of looks good to me, but 
> what do you think?
>
>   Lastly, I changed (for now) the lamp stand from Gold_Metal to T_Gold_2A 
> which looks better imo. I haven't tried to make it look bronze yet, and I 
> might need some help with that, but anyway, that's the next thing to try. 
> Oh, and a power cable with possibly one of those switches that hangs 
> down... oh, you know what I mean. :)
>

Ah yes, this begins to look good. The colors are a bit too *primary* to my 
taste. You could try to use somewhat *off* reds, yellows, and blues; maybe 
even a very tiny bit different for each piece of glass. A bit darker too. 
Scale down the ambient too. Maybe a value around 0.5 will look nice. The 
opacity is allright I think.

A bronze I use, but which might not be correct for your base, is the 
following, originally from Texture Magic:

  texture {
   pigment {
    colour rgb<0.549,0.467,0.137>
   }
   normal { granite 0.1  scale 0.01 }
   finish {
    ambient 0
    diffuse 0.7
    brilliance 2.0
    specular 0.3
    roughness 0.005
    metallic
   }
  }

Thomas

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