"Chris Cason" <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote in
message news:45c076e4@news.povray.org...
> Having seen the amount of comments regarding the IRTC's current pause,
it's
> clear that there is a real spirit of competition amongst many users who
are
> now looking for a productive outlet for that.
>
> I've been associated with the IRTC since it was the 'RTC' and run by Matt
> Kruse. However irtc.org has always been 'the' IRTC, and honestly I don't
> expect this to change a lot. IMO the admins have done a fantastic job in
> keeping the competition rolling for more than ten years. Even if the
current
> situation is not resolved there is no technical reason for the site to be
> closed down (though of course it would be wise to modify any parts that
refer
> to accepting submissions and so forth).
>
> However this is not the primary point I want to make in this post.
>
> My point I think is that the IRTC can operate in parallel with whatever
might
> come up to serve as an outlet for this creative spirit of yours. It is not
a
> case of 'replacing' the IRTC, or even having a successor to it. Just for
> there to be something suitable (and preferably fairly automated) that can
> operate as your virtual sounding stage.
>
> I can provide the POVCOMP site source code and web hosting for a new
> competition. Long-time POV user Lance Birch, a professional web designer,
is
> willing to supervise and assist with the coding stage. We would need some
> additional help there, as well as at least three trusted people who are
> willing to make a long term commitment to supervising the operation of the
> contest.
>
> Going on, to me, the question is: what would pique your interest and keep
it
> long term? A clone of the IRTC? Or something quite different, but with a
> similar flavor? Or something else entirely? Or even a competition that has
no
> set flavor - one that changes according to the times?
>
> I would like to suggest one possibility. It would be interesting to be abl
e
> to conduct a series of competitions - of variable length according to
> difficulty - that I would perhaps describe as the "POV-Team's Challenge".
>
> This would involve us coming up with interesting or intriguing ideas for
> renderings - either stills or animations - and challenging you guys to
show
> us what y'all can do. It need not be limited to POV-Ray, though of course
> that's our primary focus.
>
> I've no opinion how voting would work. But the winner(s) of each round
would
> get a nice virtual medal rendered in 100% recycled electrons and a spiffy
> title of some sort. Possibly I could even tweak the news server web view
to
> auto-append an award JPG of some sort to the bottom of all their posts
whilst
> they hold the title (i.e. the badge stays there permanently, but only gets
> added to posts they make whilst title-holder. Or something like that.)
>
> Anyhow: what sort of ideas might we pitch? Here's a few that come to mind:
>
>   1. Challenge: make us laugh. No cliches! Be original.
>
>   2. Challenge: using http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/28710584/ as
your
>      inspiration, come up with something different (no copies!) but that
>      invokes a similar sense (of, perhaps, anticipation?*) in viewers
minds.
>
>      * this word makes me think of the RHPS. Anyone for a Rocky Horror
round?
>
>   3. You are provided with a photograph of an equipment room of some sort
>      (perhaps a server room). It has plenty of electronic/computer gear/
>      wiring in it. You also get measurements of the room and of the larger
>      bits of furniture within it, sufficient to re-create a reasonable
>      facsimile of it.
>
>      Challenge: steampunk it. Photorealism is encouraged.
>
>   4. You are supplied a music track in mp3 format and a data file in text
>      format, suitable for parsing by POV-Ray's SDL.
>
>      Prior to the start of the competition, a group of you would have
created
>      a set of SDL routines to manipulate, interpolate, and otherwise use
this
>      raw data in order to be able to perform the below task (if you're not
>      using POV, you will have to find your own way to deal with it).
>
>      The data file contains sufficient information that the audio can be
>      matched to each of the 3 or 4 instruments used to record it, such
that
>      an instrument or scene could be animated in time with it.
>
>      Challenge: create an animation using the above. It is not required
that
>      you animate instruments. You may choose to make something trippy or
>      cool coupled with the beat. It's up to you. Length should be at least
>      20 seconds, but would preferably be the same as that of the audio
file.
>
>      To be reasonably feasible I would expect that most of the animation
>      would have to be automated - but SDL is one of POV's strengths.
>
>      [This challenge was inspired by Animusic*, LOR**, the 'Wizards of
>       Winter' video***, and similar items over the years].
>
>       *   http://www.animusic.com/
>       **  http://www.lotsofrobots.com/
>       *** http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IK90Ys2LhSo
>
>   5. You are supplied with a set of images that, if put together, form a
>      short film (in the region of 300 seconds or so). This movie is shot
>      using a real video camera and consists of a defined room or outdoor
>      area, the measurements of which are supplied to you, along with the
>      details and locations of one or two of the major items of furniture
>      present. You are additionally provided with camera tracking data* in
>      a form suitable to be used in SDL, plus some macros to deal with it.
>
>      The actual details of the video, where it is shot, and what it
contains
>      (e.g. if there are people present, and if so, what they are
doing/saying
>      etc) will be determined by reasonable consensus in advance.
>
>      Challenge: render something into this scene such that the finished
>      result appears seamless. You can choose any part of the supplied
data,
>      including non-sequential portions, but the result should be at least
20
>      seconds long.
>
>      [Obviously, http://runevision.com/3d/anims/hologram.asp inspired
this].
>
>      * If possible this will be high-accuracy date captured from the
physical
>        camera motion, if we can get access to the equipment required. If
not
>        then it would be derived.
>
> 4 and 5 would obviously be longer-term projects and may run in parallel
with
> shorter ones. Participants in all of these challenges would be encouraged
to
> share WIP's, techniques, and macros with others if they so choose. The
spirit
> of the challenges to experiment, learn, enjoy, do new things, and most of
all
> create neat stuff with POV.
>
> So. Anyone interested?
>
> -- Chris

Chris -
I would be interested. If you would like to contact me we can start some
dialog.
I can tell you who I am, my background, and what I do.
Thank you
Darin

Post a reply to this message

"Chris Cason" <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote in
message news:45c076e4@news.povray.org...
> Having seen the amount of comments regarding the IRTC's current pause,
it's
> clear that there is a real spirit of competition amongst many users who
are
> now looking for a productive outlet for that.
>
> I've been associated with the IRTC since it was the 'RTC' and run by Matt
> Kruse. However irtc.org has always been 'the' IRTC, and honestly I don't
> expect this to change a lot. IMO the admins have done a fantastic job in
> keeping the competition rolling for more than ten years. Even if the
current
> situation is not resolved there is no technical reason for the site to be
> closed down (though of course it would be wise to modify any parts that
refer
> to accepting submissions and so forth).
>
> However this is not the primary point I want to make in this post.
>
> My point I think is that the IRTC can operate in parallel with whatever
might
> come up to serve as an outlet for this creative spirit of yours. It is not
a
> case of 'replacing' the IRTC, or even having a successor to it. Just for
> there to be something suitable (and preferably fairly automated) that can
> operate as your virtual sounding stage.
>
> I can provide the POVCOMP site source code and web hosting for a new
> competition. Long-time POV user Lance Birch, a professional web designer,
is
> willing to supervise and assist with the coding stage. We would need some
> additional help there, as well as at least three trusted people who are
> willing to make a long term commitment to supervising the operation of the
> contest.
>
> Going on, to me, the question is: what would pique your interest and keep
it
> long term? A clone of the IRTC? Or something quite different, but with a
> similar flavor? Or something else entirely? Or even a competition that has
no
> set flavor - one that changes according to the times?
>
> I would like to suggest one possibility. It would be interesting to be abl
e
> to conduct a series of competitions - of variable length according to
> difficulty - that I would perhaps describe as the "POV-Team's Challenge".
>
> This would involve us coming up with interesting or intriguing ideas for
> renderings - either stills or animations - and challenging you guys to
show
> us what y'all can do. It need not be limited to POV-Ray, though of course
> that's our primary focus.
>
> I've no opinion how voting would work. But the winner(s) of each round
would
> get a nice virtual medal rendered in 100% recycled electrons and a spiffy
> title of some sort. Possibly I could even tweak the news server web view
to
> auto-append an award JPG of some sort to the bottom of all their posts
whilst
> they hold the title (i.e. the badge stays there permanently, but only gets
> added to posts they make whilst title-holder. Or something like that.)
>
> Anyhow: what sort of ideas might we pitch? Here's a few that come to mind:
>
>   1. Challenge: make us laugh. No cliches! Be original.
>
>   2. Challenge: using http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/28710584/ as
your
>      inspiration, come up with something different (no copies!) but that
>      invokes a similar sense (of, perhaps, anticipation?*) in viewers
minds.
>
>      * this word makes me think of the RHPS. Anyone for a Rocky Horror
round?
>
>   3. You are provided with a photograph of an equipment room of some sort
>      (perhaps a server room). It has plenty of electronic/computer gear/
>      wiring in it. You also get measurements of the room and of the larger
>      bits of furniture within it, sufficient to re-create a reasonable
>      facsimile of it.
>
>      Challenge: steampunk it. Photorealism is encouraged.
>
>   4. You are supplied a music track in mp3 format and a data file in text
>      format, suitable for parsing by POV-Ray's SDL.
>
>      Prior to the start of the competition, a group of you would have
created
>      a set of SDL routines to manipulate, interpolate, and otherwise use
this
>      raw data in order to be able to perform the below task (if you're not
>      using POV, you will have to find your own way to deal with it).
>
>      The data file contains sufficient information that the audio can be
>      matched to each of the 3 or 4 instruments used to record it, such
that
>      an instrument or scene could be animated in time with it.
>
>      Challenge: create an animation using the above. It is not required
that
>      you animate instruments. You may choose to make something trippy or
>      cool coupled with the beat. It's up to you. Length should be at least
>      20 seconds, but would preferably be the same as that of the audio
file.
>
>      To be reasonably feasible I would expect that most of the animation
>      would have to be automated - but SDL is one of POV's strengths.
>
>      [This challenge was inspired by Animusic*, LOR**, the 'Wizards of
>       Winter' video***, and similar items over the years].
>
>       *   http://www.animusic.com/
>       **  http://www.lotsofrobots.com/
>       *** http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IK90Ys2LhSo
>
>   5. You are supplied with a set of images that, if put together, form a
>      short film (in the region of 300 seconds or so). This movie is shot
>      using a real video camera and consists of a defined room or outdoor
>      area, the measurements of which are supplied to you, along with the
>      details and locations of one or two of the major items of furniture
>      present. You are additionally provided with camera tracking data* in
>      a form suitable to be used in SDL, plus some macros to deal with it.
>
>      The actual details of the video, where it is shot, and what it
contains
>      (e.g. if there are people present, and if so, what they are
doing/saying
>      etc) will be determined by reasonable consensus in advance.
>
>      Challenge: render something into this scene such that the finished
>      result appears seamless. You can choose any part of the supplied
data,
>      including non-sequential portions, but the result should be at least
20
>      seconds long.
>
>      [Obviously, http://runevision.com/3d/anims/hologram.asp inspired
this].
>
>      * If possible this will be high-accuracy date captured from the
physical
>        camera motion, if we can get access to the equipment required. If
not
>        then it would be derived.
>
> 4 and 5 would obviously be longer-term projects and may run in parallel
with
> shorter ones. Participants in all of these challenges would be encouraged
to
> share WIP's, techniques, and macros with others if they so choose. The
spirit
> of the challenges to experiment, learn, enjoy, do new things, and most of
all
> create neat stuff with POV.
>
> So. Anyone interested?
>
> -- Chris

Chris -
I would be interested to help out.
If you would like to contact me we can start some dialog.
I can tell you who I am, my background, and my education.
Thank you
Darin

Post a reply to this message

Jim Charter wrote:
> Didn't know you were a Rocky Horror fan.  I was just invited to 

haven't watched it for years but was quite keen on back in the day. saw the
stage show as well, maybe half a dozen times over the years. the whole thing
is just good crazy fun:) ... the 'mad scientist in castle' theme is fertile
soil for a computer graphics competition, especially when mixed with a good
dose of humor.

> Robbins'/Sarandon's ranch on Sunday.  Their son is goalie on the hockey 

neat! ... I've always felt that SS doesn't like to be reminded of her role in
that movie, when she was not so nearly famous :/

Post a reply to this message

> If you would like to contact me we can start some dialog.
> I can tell you who I am, my background, and my education.

thanks for the offer, if there is enough interest in participating I will do
so. I think this will depend on the direction the IRTC takes.

-- Chris

Post a reply to this message

Count me in Chris. I also think the mix of technical and artistic challenges
could definitely give more people the chance and desire to compete.

I've not participated in the past nearly as much as I would have liked, but
have been a huge follower of IRTC since I discovered it ~10 years ago. I
want to see it stick around, but we should take this opportunity to see if
we can't change it/add to it to make it better than it's been.

Post a reply to this message

Chris Cason <del### [at] deletethistoopovrayorg> wrote:

> Even if the current situation is not resolved there is no technical
> reason for the site to be closed down (though of course it would
> be wise to modify any parts that refer to accepting submissions
> and so forth).

It's not clear to me why the IRTC can't be continued in the current form. As
I understand things, the primary issue is that the admin is AWOL. Prior to
that, the primary issue was the admin was consistantly late in posting and
announcing new topics.

I don't understand why, if the current admin has disappeared, the IRTC can't
be taken over by another administrator. There have been various admins that
have come and gone in the past, and I don't see why the contest hinges on
this one particular admin.

> Going on, to me, the question is: what would pique your interest and keep
> it long term? A clone of the IRTC? Or something quite different, but with a
> similar flavor? Or something else entirely? Or even a competition that has no
> set flavor - one that changes according to the times?

Again, I don't understand the necessity of closing the "old" IRTC and coming
up with another contest. It seems to me that there's still
considerable interest in maintaining the IRTC in its current form.

I understand how it would be beneficial to have additional competitions,
especially if they are focused on POV-Ray specific features. However,
replacing the IRTC with something new is a bit like throwing the baby out
with the bathwater.

In fact, given the number of submissions for this Animation round, I don't
understand why this round can't be open for judging.

-- David

Post a reply to this message

David Cuny <dcu### [at] lansetcom> wrote:
> It's not clear to me why the IRTC can't be continued in the current form.

  Many people have the opinion that the IRTC could benefit from some
spicing up. Give people more varied challenges than just a topic.
Appeal to a more wide variety of people. Try something different from
time to time.

  The IRTC could also perhaps benefit from a more focused approach.
The current liberal approach is ok, but it has gotten a bit old. That
doesn't mean that there couldn't be free-form rounds from time to time,
but perhaps increase the challenge and set up more specific rules.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

Post a reply to this message

Chris Cason wrote:

...


The lack of responses surprises me.  Actually I thought I did respond to 
this in the positive but I am so bleery-eyed after a night of driving I 
probably forgot to press SEND

Anyway I like the idea of shaking up the format a bit, especially the 
idea of variable length contests and contests in parallel.  I also think 
the idea of "challenges" over, or in addition to, "topics" is a good 
one.  Your examples are intriguing and suggest some enticing 
possiblilties for starting from a "seed" of materials, image, or source 
in another media rather than a topic or concept.  I think all of this 
alos allows you to "raise the bar" in some places while still giving 
fledglings a place to compete.


 > So. Anyone interested?
 >
 >

Question is a little ambiguous but if you are asking for volunteers I am 
willing.  However my skills are fairly limited, technically.

-JC

Post a reply to this message

I'm certainly interested to see what comes of this. My two cents would be
that, though I enjoy the technical aspects of POV a great deal, and would
be exited to see some competition in that realm, I alo think that the
artistic possibilities are rarely fully developed and deserve equally to be
explored.

At least in my opinion, it isn't so much the competition as the deadline,
and the chance for feedback. Doing an IRTC round is a sort of
NaNoWriMo-like event for me --- I finally finish an entire image because I
HAVE to. In that spirit, I think it would be fun to have some
so-fast-it's-silly contests; 24 hours to make a scene? 1 hour?

Finally, I will say that I do a good bit of web design, and I can work
pretty happily in perl, PHP, ASP, HTML, and javascript. I'll happily donate
time if you want it.


Sam Bleckley
http://enso.freeshell.org/

Post a reply to this message

[Previous post got lost; reposting]

I think this is an excellent idea. My two cents:

(cent one) I think that, as interesting as it will be to have technical
competition, the artistic possiblities of POV have only rarely been
explored ot their full potential; it might be equally interesting to have a
few 'rounds' that go exactly in the opposite direction and be as completely
artistic as possible. Of course, it is the synthesis fo the tow that makes
the most interestic scenes (to me), but limiting one's self is always a
good exercise.

(cent two) I always used the IRTC less for competition and more for a
deadline (gasp). Entering the IRTC was a NaNoWriMo-like experience for me,
forcing a project to completion. It might be fun to have some uber-short
*time* contests; 24 scenes, that sort of thing (in addition, of course, to
the others)

Brainstorming now, would it be sensible to instead just build a structured
site in which *any* member could start a contest, administer it, give all
the rules, etc, prizes, whatever? Then you can have a constant flow of new
contests without any one person getting sick of the work. There would,
inevitably, be many contests with no entrants, or just one or two, but at
the same time, there would be no backseat drivers. *shrugs* I don't know if
that would be the smart way, but it would certainly be the _internet_ way ;)

Finally (and in conclusion; that is, to wrap up) I am pretty comfortable
doing web-based programming (PHP, ASP, perl, mySQL) and would happily
donate some time and energy to this project, if you wanted it.

Sam Bleckley
http://enso.freeshell.org/

Post a reply to this message