 |
|
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
I never realized before that when people talk about an "RPG" game, they mean
one involving "leveling up". I always thought it had something to do with, I
dunno, role playing or something. :-)
For quite some time, I couldn't figure out why Bioshock was an "RPG" and not
an "FPS."
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Insanity is a small city on the western
border of the State of Mind.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On 8-7-2009 6:09, Darren New wrote:
> I never realized before that when people talk about an "RPG" game, they
> mean one involving "leveling up". I always thought it had something to
> do with, I dunno, role playing or something. :-)
>
> For quite some time, I couldn't figure out why Bioshock was an "RPG" and
> not an "FPS."
>
According to wikipedia 'BioShock is a first-person shooter with
role-playing game customization and stealth elements'. Given the choice
from these two descriptions I think I would also choose the one that
suggests using your brain in stead of the one that suggests simple
braindead violence. Not so much for the players, but for the parents.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Darren New wrote:
> I never realized before that when people talk about an "RPG" game, they
> mean one involving "leveling up". I always thought it had something to
> do with, I dunno, role playing or something. :-)
Most video game players, when speaking of RPGs, are really speaking of
CRPGs. Historically, computers have lacked the ability to allow
adequate RP, and instead focused on the systems used for running the
games (the numbers).
As a result, most people think of RPGs as being characterized by such
systems.
Rather sad, really. There was a real RPG a few years ago, an indie one
where you're sitting in a room with a married couple. You talk to them
by typing sentences in, using natural language, and they also responded
naturally. Since there was no apparent system (everything under the
hood was hidden; the only feedback you got was what the couple said),
along with no end-state (no way to win or lose), many people said it
didn't even qualify as a game. Yet, working through this couple's
problems with them was supposed to be quite engaging.
(NB: I never actually got around to playing it, unfortunately, but I
read a few good articles on it!)
Yet games like WOW, which nothing *but* grinding through the system,
sell like Mary Jane hot-cakes bundled with free condoms :(
--
Chambers
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
andrel wrote:
> According to wikipedia 'BioShock is a first-person shooter with
> role-playing game customization and stealth elements'.
"Stealth elements"? The only "stealth element" is the existance of magic
potions to make you turn invisible when you stop moving, to make you quieter
when you do move, and to give you extra power when you club someone over the
head with the pipe wrench. Given that the first two are not especially
helpful without the third, I'm not sure where the "stealth element" comes
into play. :-) Maybe I'm just spoiled by Thief and Deus Ex.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Insanity is a small city on the western
border of the State of Mind.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Chambers wrote:
> As a result, most people think of RPGs as being characterized by such
> systems.
Yeah. In college, I had a couple of excellent GMs that could tell the
interactive story for hours with barely a dice roll, never looking at a
character sheet or anything. I'd completely forgotten until I saw the
article making the distinction that the tabletop RPGs were heavily into
skill levels and such.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Insanity is a small city on the western
border of the State of Mind.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
On 8-7-2009 18:13, Darren New wrote:
> andrel wrote:
>> According to wikipedia 'BioShock is a first-person shooter with
>> role-playing game customization and stealth elements'.
>
> "Stealth elements"? The only "stealth element" is the existance of
> magic potions to make you turn invisible when you stop moving, to make
> you quieter when you do move, and to give you extra power when you club
> someone over the head with the pipe wrench. Given that the first two are
> not especially helpful without the third, I'm not sure where the
> "stealth element" comes into play. :-) Maybe I'm just spoiled by Thief
> and Deus Ex.
>
He, I didn't write that entry. Probably was someone from the company
that released BioShock.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Chambers <Ben### [at] gmail com_no_underscores> wrote:
> Most video game players, when speaking of RPGs, are really speaking of
> CRPGs. Historically, computers have lacked the ability to allow
> adequate RP, and instead focused on the systems used for running the
> games (the numbers).
What constitutes a RPG computer game is a very sliding scale.
There are certainly games which get very close to the real thing. A good
example would be the Baldur's Gate series, which uses the AD&D ruleset
(with some minor practical shortcuts due to the medium) and thematics.
Of course the stories, settings and paths are rather fixed because it
would be quite impossible for a computer to generate the story as it goes,
but given this limitation it gets the job done quite well.
(One nice thing about the Baldur's Gate series is that you don't need
to know *anything* about AD&D in order to play it, as all the logic and
math happens under the hood. However, if you are experienced in AD&D you
will probably see the rules being used.)
Then some games start deviating a bit from the pure AD&D-style role
playing. For example the Elder Scrolls series uses its own rules and
playing logic, but is still quite a "hard" RPG (but not as hard as the
Baldur's Gate series).
On the other end of the sliding scale of "RPG'ness" are the Japanese
style RPGs, which are quite "soft" RPG. They are usually characterized
by almost everything happening automatically (including leveling up and
learning of skills/spells), so the player is usually not given any options
on what to learn. They are also characterized by rather linear storylines
with only minor (and usually irrelevant) sidequests which serve little
more than for level-grinding and getting equipment.
Then there are games which have some RPG-like features (such as getting
experience from fighting, leveling up and learning skills/spells), but
which cannot really be called RPGs.
--
- Warp
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Chambers wrote:
> Darren New wrote:
>> I never realized before that when people talk about an "RPG" game,
>> they mean one involving "leveling up". I always thought it had
>> something to do with, I dunno, role playing or something. :-)
>
> Most video game players, when speaking of RPGs, are really speaking of
> CRPGs. Historically, computers have lacked the ability to allow
> adequate RP, and instead focused on the systems used for running the
> games (the numbers).
>
> As a result, most people think of RPGs as being characterized by such
> systems.
>
> Rather sad, really. There was a real RPG a few years ago, an indie one
> where you're sitting in a room with a married couple. You talk to them
> by typing sentences in, using natural language, and they also responded
> naturally. Since there was no apparent system (everything under the
> hood was hidden; the only feedback you got was what the couple said),
> along with no end-state (no way to win or lose), many people said it
> didn't even qualify as a game. Yet, working through this couple's
> problems with them was supposed to be quite engaging.
>
> (NB: I never actually got around to playing it, unfortunately, but I
> read a few good articles on it!)
>
> Yet games like WOW, which nothing *but* grinding through the system,
> sell like Mary Jane hot-cakes bundled with free condoms :(
>
CoLA - City of Lost Angels, in Second Life, not to mention New Delphi,
Crossroads, Bloodrayne, and a mess of non-English ones, all in SL, are
fair examples of RP (was 135 such sims, in... probably close to 15+
chains, or worlds if you will, each with anything from 1-20 sims). There
are probably far more now, but the page that showed all of them was
removed a while back from the website for it. Story line is 100% user
fed, within the parameters of the back stories. It "does" have levels
and stats, and the like, but its only for combat (at the moment), not
for anything else. A redesign is in the works that will integrate the
function of the system into the client used to log in, and go with a
system where you assign points to traits, to get specialization in
different "skills", rather than just getting levels, and becoming move
powerful as a result. There is no "grind", since there isn't anything to
kill, other than other RPers, and that won't gain you XP (only being in
the sims, with the meter on, actively involved, will get you that).
But, it has flaws, not the least being that it depends on SL to work,
and.. their sim system can be unstable as all hell some days, not to
mention lagging and other problems. :p
But, yeah. Most people think RP, and they think WoW, or EQ2, or
something like that.
--
void main () {
If Schrödingers_cat is alive or version > 98 {
if version = "Vista" {
call slow_by_half();
call DRM_everything();
}
call functional_code();
}
else
call crash_windows();
}
<A HREF='http://www.daz3d.com/index.php?refid=16130551'>Get 3D Models,
3D Content, and 3D Software at DAZ3D!</A>
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Warp wrote:
> Of course the stories, settings and paths are rather fixed because it
> would be quite impossible for a computer to generate the story as it goes,
I'm not so sure about that. While in theory there are an unlimited
number of stories, they're constructed of discreet elements that show up
repeatedly even in widely varied plots. There are even fewer stories
that readily qualify as 'stereotypical RPG fare', even taking
mind-bending plot-twists-from-left-field into consideration. So it's
really just a matter of chaining together elements from a table,
throwing in unique names and geography, balancing mechanics (which could
probably be done by the software, really...run a few hundred simulated
events in the background, adjusting things as needed), and you have a
computer-generated 'unique' storyline. How complex it is is really just
determined by quality of the table from which it grabs elements.
--
Tim Cook
http://empyrean.freesitespace.net
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Tim Cook wrote:
> I'm not so sure about that. While in theory there are an unlimited
> number of stories, they're constructed of discreet elements that show up
> repeatedly even in widely varied plots. There are even fewer stories
> that readily qualify as 'stereotypical RPG fare', even taking
> mind-bending plot-twists-from-left-field into consideration. So it's
> really just a matter of chaining together elements from a table,
> throwing in unique names and geography, balancing mechanics (which could
> probably be done by the software, really...run a few hundred simulated
> events in the background, adjusting things as needed), and you have a
> computer-generated 'unique' storyline. How complex it is is really just
> determined by quality of the table from which it grabs elements.
For one of my classes I wrote a detailed business proposal to do just
that :) Of course, I figured on a 5 year timeline, and a few million
dollars for the R&D, so we never got to try it out... still, it's been
on the "back shelf" of my head for a while now, and I keep hoping I'll
have a chance to work on something like this.
--
Chambers
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
|
|
