Shay <sha### [at] nonenone> wrote:
> 1. The person who f**ks with computers, programming, etc. so much that 
> he is eventually able to turn his hobby into a career. Those I know of 
> this type really do have no lives. After the long work hours, the junk 
> food, the smoking, and WOW, there isn't much time or energy left for a life.

  Personally I think you are just presenting your ideal of what "having a
life" is, and when someone does not have it. And it's precisely what I was
talking about: Why is your definition of "having a life" more correct rather
than someone else's? Isn't someone "having a life" when he is happy with
what he is doing?

  Just because someone doesn't act like the majority of people doesn't mean
he doesn't "have a life". Just because someone isn't so social as most of
other people, and just because he doesn't have "healthy" hobbies besides
work doesn't necessarily mean he doesn't "have a life".

  Personally I don't enjoy "socializing" by going to night clubs and bars
and the like. They are noisy, crowded, chaotic and often full of tobacco
smoke. I don't drink nor smoke, I don't enjoy talking with drunken people,
and there's nothing in night clubs and bars that I would enjoy. Yet someone
could say that I "don't have a life" because of that.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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Warp wrote:

>   Personally I think you are just presenting your ideal of what "having a
> life" is, and when someone does not have it. And it's precisely what I was
> talking about: Why is your definition of "having a life" more correct rather
> than someone else's? Isn't someone "having a life" when he is happy with
> what he is doing?

I agree.

If I can find a way of living my life that actually makes me happy and 
leaves me feelin fulfilled... I'll be happy. :-D

Well... I guess that's kind of a tautology... hmm.

I say that I "don't have a life" because the way I'm living currently 
does *not* make me feel happy and fulfilled. And I'm sure there are 
plenty of people who never touch a computer who never the less feel just 
the same way.

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*

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Shay wrote:
> Eero Ahonen wrote:
>>
>> Usually having "no life" can be translated directly into "not having a
>> girl-/boyfriend" and/or "not enjoying all freetime at
>> bars/pubs/nightclubs".
> 
> Having "no life" is missing out on the kinds in relationships which take
> hours and hours to develop - is not being able to keep commitments you
> *wan't* to keep - is failing to progress in your personal goals outside
> of one non-social area of interest.

Ah yes, what I ment is how having no life is normally intepreted here
(physical location, ie. southern Finland). Goes partly on top of each
other - eg. being single can be either own choice or unwanted failure.

> We were told as children than programmers would be as respected and
> wealthy as doctors. 

It might have been the image back then, but the world changes. Respect
also depends on who's judging - eg. I don't respect titles, I respect
persons. No matter if you're doctor, lumberjack, stock player, teacher
or anything else - if you're person to respect, you'll gain respect.

> Some can treat computer-work like any other career,
> but many get caught up with gaming, chatrooms, internet, learning new
> languages, etc..

True. Computers and digital world offer so much choices that it can be
very addictive.

>  -Shay

-Aero

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Orchid XP v8 wrote:
>> Yes. Try driving digital signal to the speakers themselves ;).
> 
> I rather suspect you'd hear nothing at all. Digital signals usually
> operate at frequencies way outside the sensitivity of the human ear, if
> not the speaker cones themselves... (Besides being *far* too low
> amplitude in the first place.)
> 

Digitality doesn't define frequencies, besides they can (and will) be
mixed (you know that GSM-noise that comes out of your speakers if you'll
keep phone too close to preamp? It's ~200Hz, while the phone's interval
to discuss with base station is 4,7ms). Digitality defines having
limited amount of values, theoretically making the sound being like
morse-coding. OTOH, if you calculate the pulses to match the speaker
correctly, you'll end up with normal sound (the speakers have inductance
and capacitans) by using the speaker itself as D/A-converter driven by
eg. PWM.

Ah, and don't worry about amplitude. Amplifiers have been invented.

-Aero

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"Orchid XP v8" <voi### [at] devnull> wrote in message 
news:4926f5ac@news.povray.org...
> I say that I "don't have a life" because the way I'm living currently does 
> *not* make me feel happy and fulfilled. And I'm sure there are plenty of 
> people who never touch a computer who never the less feel just the same 
> way.

I think you just hit the nail on the head.

I used to be much more of an introvert than I am now, but I seem to waiver 
between "Having a life" and "not".  For me, the problem becomes when I 
obsess on something to the point of neglecting other things which should be 
a priority.  I don't feel good about myself when that happens.  I've done it 
with programming, porn, poker, povray (to a lesser extent), and a hand-ful 
of other things.

Generally, the phrase seems to be more about developing aquaintences, 
friends, and otherwise being sociable.  But for the vast majority of the 
population, they can never understand things like the thrill of getting X to 
work after spending days/weeks/months of hard work to resolve a problem. 
Alcoholics may "have a life", in terms of the idea that they are developing 
the social aspects of their lives, but it is certainly not beneficial to 
them.  But at least they don't drink alone...

Personally, I think that the times of "not having a life" need to be 
balanced.  Last year, I worked (at my job) pretty much the entire month of 
September and part of October.  I'd get home late, and had to work most 
weekends.  It took a toll on me, but after the job was done, I took some 
days off (not all in a row), and otherwise slowed down the pace.  The 
overall effect for me was a great feeling of accomplishment (I met the 
deadline) and then the time-off seemed so much sweeter.  But in that time, I 
truly went into my own world.  I ate, drank, and slept my job 
(figuratively).  I had "no life" in the social sense, but I felt very 
fullfilled at my job.  For 1.5 months, I was the most important person at my 
company.

Having been an introverted nerd, and whatever I am now (less introverted), I 
honestly believe that getting out and exposing yourself to social situations 
is good for the soul/psyche or whatever else you want to call it.  I don't 
really believe that someone can be fullfilled without that.  I've been doing 
a camping, bicycle tour for the last 4 years, and I'm really glad that I do 
it.  It forces me to interact with people in situations where I would 
otherwise feel uncomfortable.  Riding a bike alone for 6 hours/day REALLY 
SUCKS!  Riding with good company can be a ton of fun!

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Orchid XP v8 wrote:
> I say that I "don't have a life" because the way I'm living currently
> does *not* make me feel happy and fulfilled. And I'm sure there are
> plenty of people who never touch a computer who never the less feel just
> the same way.

I'm currently feeling like: http://bash.org/?505242

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Jeremy "UncleHoot" Praay wrote:
> But for the vast majority of the population, they can never
> understand things like the thrill of getting X to work after
> spending days/weeks/months of hard work to resolve a problem. 

They understand the thrill AND what an expensive high that thrill is. We 
all do, but many of our expensive highs are not as accessible as the 
computer in the next room and are therefore less dangerous. The poker 
with which you were so obsessed was Online poker, wasn't it? :)

Chasing these highs is exactly what takes a person away from "having a 
life." And I'm not talking about bars a night clubs either. I'm married, 
35 years old, and have never had a drink in my life - nightclubs hold 
little fascination.

  -Shay

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Orchid XP v8 wrote:
> 
> I say that I "don't have a life" because the way I'm living currently 
> does *not* make me feel happy and fulfilled. And I'm sure there are 
> plenty of people who never touch a computer who never the less feel just 
> the same way.

Yes, but a geek doesn't just "touch a computer." He spends months or 
years in front of one (in essence, playing with fire) developing his 
skills. Some resist temptation, but non-geeks are not subject to those 
temptations at all.

After reading some of your posts, I though it might be fun to learn 
Haskell myself. Thankfully, sanity prevailed.

  -Shay

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Shay wrote:
> Yes, but a geek doesn't just "touch a computer." He spends months or
> years in front of one (in essence, playing with fire) developing his
> skills. Some resist temptation, but non-geeks are not subject to those
> temptations at all.

Nice, now define "nerd" please.

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On Sun, 23 Nov 2008 00:46:48 -0200, Nicolas Alvarez wrote:

> Shay wrote:
>> Yes, but a geek doesn't just "touch a computer." He spends months or
>> years in front of one (in essence, playing with fire) developing his
>> skills. Some resist temptation, but non-geeks are not subject to those
>> temptations at all.
> 
> Nice, now define "nerd" please.

Network Emergency Repair Dude (or "Dudette", if you prefer)

Jim

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