On Thu, 07 Aug 2008 11:37:46 -0700, Darren New wrote:

> Jim Henderson wrote:
>> On Thu, 07 Aug 2008 09:49:24 -0700, Darren New wrote:
>> 
>>> Jim Henderson wrote:
>>>> I don't want to owe that
>>>> kind of money on an unsecured loan of any kind.  I'd much rather have
>>>> things paid off (that's a really good feeling to have).
>>> That's good.  But better an unsecured loan than a secured loan! :-)
>> 
>> Well, from a credit standpoint, a secured loan like an equity line
>> (where the "security" is the property) makes good sense.
> 
> Sure. I just meant that all else being equal, having the person you owe
> money to being unable to do something about it if you don't pay them
> back is a good thing. :-)
> 
> Of course, it's easier to get a lower rate and more money on a secured
> loan.

Oh, ISWYM.  And yes, good point.

>> I have heard some
>> people use the equity in their homes to make money (by investing it),
>> but that seems a little risky to me.
> 
> Everything that makes you money is risky. It's a matter of whether the
> payment is worth the risk.

True.  I know that some loans do prohibit certain uses of the money, but 
that seems *generally* easy to get around - you don't use the loan money 
for investing, but you use it to pay for what it's allowed for, freeing 
up other money for investment.  I suspect those types of restrictions 
would be very difficult to enforce.

>> But using that money appropriately is the key - using it to enhance the
>> value of the property through improvements seems to be the best route
>> to go.
> 
> It certainly doesn't hurt.  Even better is saving up, *earning*
> interest, *then* putting the roof on, if you can wait.

Of course.  Most people find it difficult to save up the $14K that we had 
to spend (total tear-off and replace).  But most people are very poor 
money managers. :-)

>> types of "secured" credit cards (where you pay money as a security
>> deposit and then your limit is set to what you put down as a deposit).
> 
> The quotes shouldn't be around "secured" but around "credit" there. It
> isn't a credit card if you're not borrowing the money.

True....

Jim

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Jim Henderson wrote:
> True.  I know that some loans do prohibit certain uses of the money,

The only restrictions I've ever seen are for gambling (which is more a 
legal restriction) and for paying a "down payment" (because, you know, 
the point of the down payment is it's the part you didn't borrow).

> Of course.  Most people find it difficult to save up the $14K that we had 
> to spend (total tear-off and replace).  But most people are very poor 
> money managers. :-)

Depends how much you make, too, I guess. I'm pretty conservative with 
savings.

-- 
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
  Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
  kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
  who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
  and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?

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On Thu, 07 Aug 2008 11:56:57 -0700, Darren New wrote:

> Jim Henderson wrote:
>> True.  I know that some loans do prohibit certain uses of the money,
> 
> The only restrictions I've ever seen are for gambling (which is more a
> legal restriction) and for paying a "down payment" (because, you know,
> the point of the down payment is it's the part you didn't borrow).

I vaguely recall seeing something about investing in one set of paperwork 
I looked at (not the one we agreed to).

>> Of course.  Most people find it difficult to save up the $14K that we
>> had to spend (total tear-off and replace).  But most people are very
>> poor money managers. :-)
> 
> Depends how much you make, too, I guess. I'm pretty conservative with
> savings.

Yeah, we tend to run closer to the edge than I'd like.  Part of the 
challenge is when you make the transition from "not making much" to 
"making enough to save some" is that you've got to pay off what you've 
borrowed while in the "not making much" phase.  Many people (myself 
included) don't learn until after you get to the "making enough to save 
some" how to really manage money.

Money management is something that I think *should* be taught in school, 
though - there are so many "life skills" that kids coming out of high 
school (or college for that matter) don't have but should; that's one of 
them.

Jim

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Jim Henderson wrote:
> Money management is something that I think *should* be taught in school, 

Yeah. I never understood why "home economics" never taught any economics.

-- 
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
  Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
  kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
  who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
  and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?

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On Thu, 07 Aug 2008 12:50:09 -0700, Darren New wrote:

> Jim Henderson wrote:
>> Money management is something that I think *should* be taught in
>> school,
> 
> Yeah. I never understood why "home economics" never taught any
> economics.

LOL, you know, I never thought of it that way, but you're right....

Cooking and sewing on buttons are useful skills, but only if you can 
afford the equipment for either of those activities. :-)

Money management definitely should fall in there somewhere.  How to 
balance a checkbook, schedule payments, do financial planning, set goals 
and figure out how to meet them.....I'm sure there are others.

Jim

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"Darren New" <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote in message 
news:489b415e@news.povray.org...
> St. wrote:
>>  That's exactly what I do. I hope they never get rid of cash,
>
> They can't. There's huge portions of the economy that are actually 
> black-market. :-)
>
> Alternately, they already have. There's no cash left. All that's left is 
> debt and federal reserve notes.

 OMG. Don't start me on that side of it. I heard the other day that a 
payment for your old car to be scrapped might be introduced here. (Remember 
my post?) I don't want to drive around in an electric matchbox! I will sit 
at home instead and do everything on the internet, and get fat, costing our 
lovely National Health a whole lot more money until I die... :o/

   Damn, this world is... ******

   ~Steve~



>
> -- 
> Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
>  Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
>  kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
>  who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
>  and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?

Post a reply to this message

"Darren New" <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote in message 
news:489b51f0$1@news.povray.org...
> Jim Henderson wrote:
>> Money management is something that I think *should* be taught in school,
>
> Yeah. I never understood why "home economics" never taught any economics.

     Heh, they did in our school: Beans on toast or cheese straws.

     ("Home Economics" was our cooking lessons which they don't have now).

        Yes, I had to wear a pinny too...  O-O

       ~Steve~


>
> -- 
> Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
>  Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
>  kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
>  who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
>  and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?

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Phil Cook wrote:

> 
> Eh? You mean where I monitor bills and credit card statements as one  
> combined outgoing prior to payment dates and ensure that funds exist  
> within the bank account to deal with them in advance such that going on  
> holiday for a fortnight and not being able to get to the bills doesn't  
> mean me returning to invoice plus reminder plus reminder plus 
> threatening  letter; that sort of maturity?

Yep.


> 
> That's the bizarreness so you buy something on CC for $40 then when it  
> comes to pay you send them $50 so you have positive $10? The only way I  
> see this as a good thing is if the credit card pays interest on the  
> amount, which I know some do, but in that instance they wouldn't be  
> refunding it to you so why do it?
> 

More like: keep +$400 in the account.  I know I'm going to go down to 
Circuit City to buy a $59 router.  So I transfer $60 in before I go. 
While I'm there I remember I needed some toner for the printer. $70.  So 
I pickup the router and the toner on the card.  I come home.  No 
worries, the router and the toner is covered, so is the $40 of groceries 
and $75 gas that I charged and for got about.  In a coupla weeks I 
notice all the activity warnings in the bank folder on my e-mail and I'm 
waiting for a scene to render anyway, so I pop a couple open and notice 
that my +ve balance is down to +$316.  I check the activity and see all 
is okay.  I post transfer of say, $100, into the account. Meanwhile the 
recurring topup charge I set up for my daughter's cell phone is never 
going to fail.

I'll admit that maybe it's bizarre but what am I *so* guilty of?  Maybe 
of being a bit neurotic, maybe of just thinking in a different way? It 
keeps the money more tangible to me. The monthly due-date lockstep just 
trips me up that's all.

-Jim

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St. wrote:
>      ("Home Economics" was our cooking lessons which they don't have now).

Actually, I dated someone who took "Home Economics" as a college-level 
course. (She was studying to be a grade-school teacher, so it probably 
wasn't as lame as it sounds.)  There they actually taught things like 
how to examine clothes in the store to determine how well made they are 
and such. Sorta like economics.

-- 
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
  Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
  kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
  who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
  and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?

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Jim Charter wrote:
> I'll admit that maybe it's bizarre but what am I *so* guilty of? 

I don't think anyone is accusing you of being guilty of anything. I'm 
just wondering, if that's how you're trying to use a "credit" card, why 
you don't switch to a debit card. That's what they're for.

-- 
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
  Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
  kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
  who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
  and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?

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