I suggest a new group for the purpose of discussing possible
changes to Pov-Ray and to aid as a forum for the discussion
of adding additional features to the program.
   I have seen both of the above topics being discussed on just
about every group on this server and it might help to create a
central repository for the Pov-Team to draw from.

Ken Tyler

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The povray.programming group sort of covers this theme... And you'll instantly
get a load of requests that couldn't be implemented anyway.
Still, it might be nice to narrow the topic down with a new group and see what
is suggested.

Margus

Ken wrote:
> 
>    I suggest a new group for the purpose of discussing possible
> changes to Pov-Ray and to aid as a forum for the discussion
> of adding additional features to the program.
>    I have seen both of the above topics being discussed on just
> about every group on this server and it might help to create a
> central repository for the Pov-Team to draw from.
> 
> Ken Tyler

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Margus Ramst wrote:

> The povray.programming group sort of covers this theme... And you'll instantly
> get a load of requests that couldn't be implemented anyway.
> Still, it might be nice to narrow the topic down with a new group and see what
> is suggested.
>
> Margus

The programning aspects of the proposed additions/changes
could still be taken to that group. I was thinking this might also
help reduce the feature requests that the Pov-Team has to deal
with in private emails or often times is sent incorrectly to the
bug reports address.

Ken Tyler

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Ken wrote:
> I was thinking this might also
> help reduce the feature requests that the Pov-Team has to deal
> with in private emails or often times is sent incorrectly to the
> bug reports address.
> 

I don't think that these request will be reduced in number by creating a
new newsgroup. People who sent feature request to the bug-report address
don't tend to read the advices carefully.
Apart from this I like your idea because it is channeling the requests
to one newsgroup where the POVray developers can fetch them when they
are looking for feedback and new ideas (if they need it).

-- 
Marc Schimmler

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On Mon, 16 Nov 1998 02:02:12 -0800, Ken <tyl### [at] pacbellnet> wrote:
>   I suggest a new group for the purpose of discussing possible
>changes to Pov-Ray and to aid as a forum for the discussion
>of adding additional features to the program.
>   I have seen both of the above topics being discussed on just
>about every group on this server and it might help to create a
>central repository for the Pov-Team to draw from.

This is based on the assumption that the POV-Team writes things
because we want them to.  Like most free software projects, POV
gets things added because they scratch one of the developers' 
personal itches.  

I have a list of about 2 dozen things, some small and some not, 
that I'd still like to see added to even the superpatch, which 
already has about that many things that aren't in the official 
release.  Incredibly enough, that's what's left on the list 
after I remove all the impossible stuff.  What's really lacking 
is people who are sufficiently skilled with programming, math, 
and the vagaries of the POV code to implement all of the great 
ideas that are out there.

If anyone wants to see a forum that's already devoted to 
discussion of just this topic, go to Twyst's PatchStation
at http://twysted.net/patchstation and check out the forums
there.  Granted, there hasn't been a lot of discussion there,
but I suspect that's because it hasn't been well-advertised.

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Ron Parker wrote:

> This is based on the assumption that the POV-Team writes things
> because we want them to.  Like most free software projects, POV
> gets things added because they scratch one of the developers'
> personal itches.

As already noted the discussions will happen weather the Povteam hears of
them or not both here and on c.g.r.r. Might as
well at least try to condense them into a single place instead
of across all the groups on this server. And bless the Pov team
if they do read through the ideas and get a new itch. You never
know it might happen. There were a flurry of changes to this last
release because of user input from these news groups during
the last beta testing rounds. This shows that they don't mind some
input from the public at large. This new group could also act as
the beta testing feedback area in future beta realeases of Pov-Ray.
It would help filter the feedback from the general question in
the .gereral subject group.

> I have a list of about 2 dozen things, some small and some not,
> that I'd still like to see added to even the superpatch, which
> already has about that many things that aren't in the official
> release.  Incredibly enough, that's what's left on the list
> after I remove all the impossible stuff.  What's really lacking
> is people who are sufficiently skilled with programming, math,
> and the vagaries of the POV code to implement all of the great
> ideas that are out there.

And I wish I could contribute in this arena but alas I too lackthe skills
to be of any help there.

> If anyone wants to see a forum that's already devoted to
> discussion of just this topic, go to Twyst's PatchStation
> at http://twysted.net/patchstation and check out the forums
> there.  Granted, there hasn't been a lot of discussion there,
> but I suspect that's because it hasn't been well-advertised.

It may serve a purpose but I don't see it having the same bennifits
that my proposed group would have. Certainly the pov team has
enough to do than visit Twyst's dicussion forum. No disrespect
intended.

Ken Tyler

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On Mon, 16 Nov 1998 11:43:07 -0800, Ken <tyl### [at] pacbellnet> wrote:
>> If anyone wants to see a forum that's already devoted to
>> discussion of just this topic, go to Twyst's PatchStation
>> at http://twysted.net/patchstation and check out the forums
>> there.  Granted, there hasn't been a lot of discussion there,
>> but I suspect that's because it hasn't been well-advertised.
>
>It may serve a purpose but I don't see it having the same bennifits
>that my proposed group would have. Certainly the pov team has
>enough to do than visit Twyst's dicussion forum. No disrespect
>intended.

Of course.  But other developers with much more time to scratch
other people's itches have been known to read and even post to
that forum. :)

You're right, of course, such a group would have many benefits,
so long as it's understood by all involved that just because you
ask for something doesn't mean you get it.  Even in the realm of
bugfixes, there have been a lot of hard feelings because one thing
or another hasn't been fixed.  I can see feature requests being
even more controversial; just look at some of the threads in 
.programming.

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Ron Parker wrote:
> 
> You're right, of course, such a group would have many benefits,
> so long as it's understood by all involved that just because you
> ask for something doesn't mean you get it.  Even in the realm of
> bugfixes, there have been a lot of hard feelings because one thing
> or another hasn't been fixed.  I can see feature requests being
> even more controversial; just look at some of the threads in
> .programming.

Just adding another "aye" voice to the crowd. I've been wanting someone
to add rotate_path and  translate_path to povray for a while but I'm not
quite up on the 4d math needed to impliment them as a patch. Gives me a
place to bug some people about it. :)

-- 
Lewis A. Sellers: writer and contract Multimedia Website Developer
mailto:lse### [at] usitnet (The Fourth Millennium Foundation)
http://www.public.usit.net/lsellers/ & http://www.intrafoundation.com
http://brain-of-pooh.tech-soft.com/users/critters/bios/sellers_lewis.html

You can bug the living bejesus out of me live on ICQ @ 491461
(If I don't get back to you within a month, I'm out of prozac in some
dark corner somewhere screaming things quite unintelligable but -- most
curiously -- thick with a sumerian accent.)

"The comedy is over" -i pagliacci

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Ron Parker wrote:

> Of course.  But other developers with much more time to scratch
> other people's itches have been known to read and even post to
> that forum. :)

Speaking of forums and the Pov teams accepting newitches, I have gotten
the impression that many of the features
currently implemented in all versions of Pov have been a
result of discussions on the compuserve go povray forum.
This then would simply act as an extension to that forum.

> You're right, of course, such a group would have many benefits,
> so long as it's understood by all involved that just because you
> ask for something doesn't mean you get it.  Even in the realm of
> bug fixes, there have been a lot of hard feelings because one thing
> or another hasn't been fixed.  I can see feature requests being
> even more controversial; just look at some of the threads in
> .programming.

  I would be the last to argue with the inherent nature of people to
stamp their little feet when thing are not going their way. There
is not much that anyone could do about that other than run a
moderated discussion group. But who wants that.

Ken Tyler

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