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From: 19100
Subject: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 27 Oct 2023 10:25:00
Message: <web.653bc74bd74eb93e6ac4d8bcedfc8715@news.povray.org>
This scene is my first that's (mostly) based on real world measurements, I think
I've read enough USBC specification documents to be certified or something.

Grab the source files here:
https://archive.org/download/19100-povray/king.zip


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Attachments:
Download 'king.png' (165 KB)

Preview of image 'king.png'
king.png


 

From: Bald Eagle
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 27 Oct 2023 14:10:00
Message: <web.653bfc307612b3661f9dae3025979125@news.povray.org>
"19100" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> This scene is my first that's (mostly) based on real world measurements, I think
> I've read enough USBC specification documents to be certified or something.
>
> Grab the source files here:
> https://archive.org/download/19100-povray/king.zip

That really came out very nice.  :)

The neon lights are very cool.
The alley's wood floor pattern could maybe benefit from some stretching in the
z-direction, maybe with a wee bit less turbulence?

Not sure about the red cinder-block wall.  Seems off somehow.  Also too
CGI-perfect.

The bowling ball in the foreground would benefit from a little bit of
fill-lighting, and the icing on the cake would be to add just a touch of
motion-blur.

Maybe define a rolling function and make a few highly-transparent copies of the
ball that "roll into" the 3 balls in the render.

You could also possibly make the far ball actually hit and have some of the pins
mid-tumble in the air.

Great job - I'm sure it was a challenging exercise in measuring and modeling!

- BW


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From: 19100
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 27 Oct 2023 16:05:00
Message: <web.653c17917612b366d41e7859edfc8715@news.povray.org>
"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "19100" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> > This scene is my first that's (mostly) based on real world measurements, I think
> > I've read enough USBC specification documents to be certified or something.
> >
> > Grab the source files here:
> > https://archive.org/download/19100-povray/king.zip
>
> That really came out very nice.  :)
>
> The neon lights are very cool.
> The alley's wood floor pattern could maybe benefit from some stretching in the
> z-direction, maybe with a wee bit less turbulence?
>
> Not sure about the red cinder-block wall.  Seems off somehow.  Also too
> CGI-perfect.
>
> The bowling ball in the foreground would benefit from a little bit of
> fill-lighting, and the icing on the cake would be to add just a touch of
> motion-blur.
>
> Maybe define a rolling function and make a few highly-transparent copies of the
> ball that "roll into" the 3 balls in the render.
>
> You could also possibly make the far ball actually hit and have some of the pins
> mid-tumble in the air.
>
> Great job - I'm sure it was a challenging exercise in measuring and modeling!
>
> - BW

Thanks! Those are great notes to take into account for any future revisions.
Looking at the bricks perhaps it's the lack of weathering that makes them seem
off, maybe the scale too. The afterimages are a really good idea, 2.2 was before
scripting but the SDL is easy to generate so both that and the pin physics are
very doable. Getting the measurements was probably the most time consuming part
of it all, finding the dimensions of a specific small detail is a real pain when
there's so much SEO-optimized crap out there with the same handful of repeated
information.


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From: Chris R
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 31 Oct 2023 09:50:00
Message: <web.654105c07612b366c2a6235cc1b6e@news.povray.org>
"19100" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> > "19100" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> > > This scene is my first that's (mostly) based on real world measurements, I think
> > > I've read enough USBC specification documents to be certified or something.
> > >
> > > Grab the source files here:
> > > https://archive.org/download/19100-povray/king.zip
> >
> > That really came out very nice.  :)
> >
> > The neon lights are very cool.
> > The alley's wood floor pattern could maybe benefit from some stretching in the
> > z-direction, maybe with a wee bit less turbulence?
> >
> > Not sure about the red cinder-block wall.  Seems off somehow.  Also too
> > CGI-perfect.
> >
> > The bowling ball in the foreground would benefit from a little bit of
> > fill-lighting, and the icing on the cake would be to add just a touch of
> > motion-blur.
> >
> > Maybe define a rolling function and make a few highly-transparent copies of the
> > ball that "roll into" the 3 balls in the render.
> >
> > You could also possibly make the far ball actually hit and have some of the pins
> > mid-tumble in the air.
> >
> > Great job - I'm sure it was a challenging exercise in measuring and modeling!
> >
> > - BW
>
> Thanks! Those are great notes to take into account for any future revisions.
> Looking at the bricks perhaps it's the lack of weathering that makes them seem
> off, maybe the scale too. The afterimages are a really good idea, 2.2 was before
> scripting but the SDL is easy to generate so both that and the pin physics are
> very doable. Getting the measurements was probably the most time consuming part
> of it all, finding the dimensions of a specific small detail is a real pain when
> there's so much SEO-optimized crap out there with the same handful of repeated
> information.

In my images with brick walls, I have started using iso-surfaces that use the
brick pigment-pattern to define the shape of the bricks and the mortar as
separate objects.  I apply turbulence to the brick pattern to get less perfect
brick edges, and then also apply pigment patterns to the visible face of the
brick, (for me the Z-axis), to apply a texture to them.  I then use some
techniques I found to vary the color/texture of the bricks so they vary rather
than having a uniform texture, but still preserving a single texture per brick.

I have attached an example.


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Attachments:
Download 'scene-1.3-2021-10-07.png' (1418 KB)

Preview of image 'scene-1.3-2021-10-07.png'
scene-1.3-2021-10-07.png


 

From: 19100
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 31 Oct 2023 11:45:00
Message: <web.654120187612b366d53960eeedfc8715@news.povray.org>
"Chris R" <car### [at] comcastnet> wrote:
> "19100" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> > "Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> > > "19100" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> > > > This scene is my first that's (mostly) based on real world measurements, I
think
> > > > I've read enough USBC specification documents to be certified or something.
> > > >
> > > > Grab the source files here:
> > > > https://archive.org/download/19100-povray/king.zip
> > >
> > > That really came out very nice.  :)
> > >
> > > The neon lights are very cool.
> > > The alley's wood floor pattern could maybe benefit from some stretching in the
> > > z-direction, maybe with a wee bit less turbulence?
> > >
> > > Not sure about the red cinder-block wall.  Seems off somehow.  Also too
> > > CGI-perfect.
> > >
> > > The bowling ball in the foreground would benefit from a little bit of
> > > fill-lighting, and the icing on the cake would be to add just a touch of
> > > motion-blur.
> > >
> > > Maybe define a rolling function and make a few highly-transparent copies of the
> > > ball that "roll into" the 3 balls in the render.
> > >
> > > You could also possibly make the far ball actually hit and have some of the pins
> > > mid-tumble in the air.
> > >
> > > Great job - I'm sure it was a challenging exercise in measuring and modeling!
> > >
> > > - BW
> >
> > Thanks! Those are great notes to take into account for any future revisions.
> > Looking at the bricks perhaps it's the lack of weathering that makes them seem
> > off, maybe the scale too. The afterimages are a really good idea, 2.2 was before
> > scripting but the SDL is easy to generate so both that and the pin physics are
> > very doable. Getting the measurements was probably the most time consuming part
> > of it all, finding the dimensions of a specific small detail is a real pain when
> > there's so much SEO-optimized crap out there with the same handful of repeated
> > information.
>
> In my images with brick walls, I have started using iso-surfaces that use the
> brick pigment-pattern to define the shape of the bricks and the mortar as
> separate objects.  I apply turbulence to the brick pattern to get less perfect
> brick edges, and then also apply pigment patterns to the visible face of the
> brick, (for me the Z-axis), to apply a texture to them.  I then use some
> techniques I found to vary the color/texture of the bricks so they vary rather
> than having a uniform texture, but still preserving a single texture per brick.
>
> I have attached an example.

That's really interesting, thanks for explaining your technique Chris.


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From: jr
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 1 Nov 2023 06:50:00
Message: <web.65422c417612b36662ceee076cde94f1@news.povray.org>
hi,

"19100" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> This scene ...

has a real nice "atmosphere".  agree that the neon signs are very good.  have
not yet looked at the code, thank you for posting though.


regards, jr.


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From: Alain Martel
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 1 Nov 2023 12:47:17
Message: <65428115$1@news.povray.org>
Le 2023-10-31 à 09:48, Chris R a écrit :

> In my images with brick walls, I have started using iso-surfaces that use the
> brick pigment-pattern to define the shape of the bricks and the mortar as
> separate objects.  I apply turbulence to the brick pattern to get less perfect
> brick edges, and then also apply pigment patterns to the visible face of the
> brick, (for me the Z-axis), to apply a texture to them.  I then use some
> techniques I found to vary the color/texture of the bricks so they vary rather
> than having a uniform texture, but still preserving a single texture per brick.
> 
> I have attached an example.

You overdid the turbulence on the bricks. Real bricks, even weathered 
ones, tend to have much smoother faces.


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From: Mike Miller
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 4 Nov 2023 23:50:00
Message: <web.6547100c7612b366f22cdb33dabc9342@news.povray.org>
"19100" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> This scene is my first that's (mostly) based on real world measurements, I think
> I've read enough USBC specification documents to be certified or something.
>
> Grab the source files here:
> https://archive.org/download/19100-povray/king.zip


Nice job,
The neon graphics are a nice touch. It would be cool to see some light bleed
onto the wall face behind the neon. I agree with BW that the brick wall is a bit
off. Maybe some poster/prints on the wall to break down the space. I'd like to
see this view with a longer camera lens. The Pins seem far away. ...now I want
to go bowling. Mike


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From: Bald Eagle
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 5 Nov 2023 04:10:00
Message: <web.65475b047612b3661f9dae3025979125@news.povray.org>
"Mike Miller" <mil### [at] gmailcom> wrote:

> The neon graphics are a nice touch. It would be cool to see some light bleed
> onto the wall face behind the neon.

Ah, yes - hadn't thought about that.
Non-zero pigment components, some reflection, and radiosity ought to fix that up
nicely.

> I agree with BW that the brick wall is a bit
> off. Maybe some poster/prints on the wall to break down the space.

Well, it was mor of the fact that most cider block walls are gray, and most
brick walls are red - but that's a red cinder block wall.

It might look more normal as painted drywall - but maybe that's how the bowling
alley was made & painted...  dunno.  I've had plenty of renders of real things
where people complained that "it would never be that way!!!" --- until I post
the actual photograph.

Sometimes reality is stranger than depiction.   ;)

- BW


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From: 19100
Subject: Re: [POV-Ray 2.2] Pin King
Date: 5 Nov 2023 11:30:00
Message: <web.6547c2387612b3667a69a5d6edfc8715@news.povray.org>
"Bald Eagle" <cre### [at] netscapenet> wrote:
> "Mike Miller" <mil### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>
> > The neon graphics are a nice touch. It would be cool to see some light bleed
> > onto the wall face behind the neon.
>
> Ah, yes - hadn't thought about that.
> Non-zero pigment components, some reflection, and radiosity ought to fix that up
> nicely.
>
> > I agree with BW that the brick wall is a bit
> > off. Maybe some poster/prints on the wall to break down the space.
>
> Well, it was mor of the fact that most cider block walls are gray, and most
> brick walls are red - but that's a red cinder block wall.
>
> It might look more normal as painted drywall - but maybe that's how the bowling
> alley was made & painted...  dunno.  I've had plenty of renders of real things
> where people complained that "it would never be that way!!!" --- until I post
> the actual photograph.
>
> Sometimes reality is stranger than depiction.   ;)
>
> - BW

Thanks Mike. I wanted to include light bleed but didn't think it would be
possible without adding a bunch of spotlights, BW's suggestion sounds like it
might do the trick though! Putting some decor on the wall is a good idea, my
intention was for it to be a brick wall but BW is right that it resembles cinder
blocks. The overall design is an amalgamation of a bunch of different references
so it doesn't recreate a specific location, but even so there's plenty to tweak
when I get around to it!


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