Attached is a template for a proposed mesh-based character. I think that it
would be cool to have a mesh object that is parameterizable, in that you could
quickly come up with a range of characters just by defining a few splines
differently. It would also be cool to be animatable, such that the shape of
mouth and size of eye openings could be moved, perhaps with another clock-based
spline, to have it blink and talk.  One could in theory make a character
anywhere from say, Mr. Incredible to the puny "Nathan" rig's head:
http://www.blendswap.com/3D-models/characters/th-nathan-rig/


This thing here looks hideous, but is more an attempt to demonstrate the pieces
of mesh code that would have to be put together.  It would work well with Ingo's
MSM.inc files. The nose of course in this simple version is not meant to be a
"hole" but a bulge.

Ideally, "cheek ridges" and "brow ridges" and two nostril holes would be added.
Someday I might do this but I just leave it out there as a way to benefit
humanity if anyone were interested.

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Attachments:
Download 'meshhead.png' (35 KB)

Preview of image 'meshhead.png'

On 11/04/2010 01:42 AM, gregjohn wrote:
> Attached is a template for a proposed mesh-based character. I think
> that it would be cool to have a mesh object that is parameterizable,
> in that you could quickly come up with a range of characters just by
> defining a few splines differently. It would also be cool to be
> animatable, such that the shape of mouth and size of eye openings
> could be moved, perhaps with another clock-based spline, to have it
> blink and talk.  One could in theory make a character anywhere from
> say, Mr. Incredible to the puny "Nathan" rig's head:
> http://www.blendswap.com/3D-models/characters/th-nathan-rig/
>
Have you considered this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Human_head_proportions.svg

"Coding, analysis, interpretation, and recognition of facial expressions"
http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.50.2949&rep=rep1&type=pdf

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...and just in case,..
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernoff_face
http://mrl.nyu.edu/~perlin/facedemo/

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bart <bar### [at] homeorg> wrote:
> Have you considered this:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Human_head_proportions.svg
>
> "Coding, analysis, interpretation, and recognition of facial expressions"
> http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.50.2949&rep=rep1&type=pdf


Um, I'm talking about a paramaterizable head, so you could make it any shape you
want. That figure is just the template of the Ingo-MSM's that would have to be
coded to make it a smooth mesh2.

Your paper however does make me wonder if that's possible easier/sooner with
blobs.

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> bart<bar### [at] homeorg>  wrote:
>> Have you considered this:
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Human_head_proportions.svg
>>
>> "Coding, analysis, interpretation, and recognition of facial expressions"
>> http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.50.2949&rep=rep1&type=pdf
>
>
> Um, I'm talking about a paramaterizable head, so you could make it any shape you
> want. That figure is just the template of the Ingo-MSM's that would have to be
> coded to make it a smooth mesh2.
>
> Your paper however does make me wonder if that's possible easier/sooner with
> blobs.
>
>
>

Did you ever had a look at blobman? It's head is a blob, as everything 
else, and not very beleivable.
But, it is indeed posable and can be made to somewhat express emotions.


Alain

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Alain <aze### [at] qwertyorg> wrote:
>
> Did you ever had a look at blobman? It's head is a blob, as everything
> else, and not very beleivable.
> But, it is indeed posable and can be made to somewhat express emotions.
>
>

I've gotten povray blobs to do this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1rjVO-UNUY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AT_7nAr99A&feature=related

And was wanting to try to see what could be done with a mesh. The blobs are
pretty cool, but as I'd designed the people, it was with a whole lot of trial
and error to get the shapes I wanted (although I did parameterize the chin).
But these look hideous in radiosity or lighting that shows off the bumps that
occur between the blob elements.

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> Alain<aze### [at] qwertyorg>  wrote:
>>
>> Did you ever had a look at blobman? It's head is a blob, as everything
>> else, and not very beleivable.
>> But, it is indeed posable and can be made to somewhat express emotions.
>>
>>
>
> I've gotten povray blobs to do this:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1rjVO-UNUY
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AT_7nAr99A&feature=related
>
> And was wanting to try to see what could be done with a mesh. The blobs are
> pretty cool, but as I'd designed the people, it was with a whole lot of trial
> and error to get the shapes I wanted (although I did parameterize the chin).
> But these look hideous in radiosity or lighting that shows off the bumps that
> occur between the blob elements.
>

The trick is to reduce the strength of the elements or increase the 
thressold and increase the number of elements.
You may also need to increase the radius.
This will contribute to smooth out and hide the seams.



Alain

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Alain <aze### [at] qwertyorg> wrote:
>
> The trick is to reduce the strength of the elements or increase the
> thressold and increase the number of elements.
> You may also need to increase the radius.
> This will contribute to smooth out and hide the seams.
>
>
>

No. I've already got dozens of elements (a pancake stack) in the chin-- it think
I've exhausted the ability of blobs (but not the elusive blob2). I'm interested
in getting people thinking about smooth-faced, if cartoony, mesh2 heads.

Anyone see any drawbacks to this system in the image? (Of course, all the
dimensions will be paramaterizable.   I'm wondering if making brows,
cheek-smile-things, etc.,  will just make this completely impractical.

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On 11/4/2010 8:55 PM, gregjohn wrote:
> Alain<aze### [at] qwertyorg>  wrote:
>>
>> Did you ever had a look at blobman? It's head is a blob, as everything
>> else, and not very beleivable.
>> But, it is indeed posable and can be made to somewhat express emotions.
>>
>>
>
> I've gotten povray blobs to do this:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o1rjVO-UNUY
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9AT_7nAr99A&feature=related
>
> And was wanting to try to see what could be done with a mesh. The blobs are
> pretty cool, but as I'd designed the people, it was with a whole lot of trial
> and error to get the shapes I wanted (although I did parameterize the chin).
> But these look hideous in radiosity or lighting that shows off the bumps that
> occur between the blob elements.

The current version of my mesh modeler can be found at:

http://evilsnack.byethost22.com/lionsnake.htm

If you have the patience to model human beings with blobs, then you 
probably have the patience to model a human being with my modeler.  It's 
missing a lot of features, but it works.

You can make riggable models, and certainly some sort of universal man. 
  The model exports POV-Ray .INC files, which you can pose by setting 
the appropriate variables before calling the file.

Regards,
John

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John VanSickle <evi### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:

> If you have the patience to model human beings with blobs, then you
> probably have the patience to model a human being with my modeler.  It's
> missing a lot of features, but it works.
>
> You can make riggable models, and certainly some sort of universal man.
>   The model exports POV-Ray .INC files, which you can pose by setting
> the appropriate variables before calling the file.
>
> Regards,
> John


Thanks I guess I should try it. But your system involves exporting a mesh per
frame, yes? That is what I am trying, either hardheadedly or brilliantly, to
avoid at all costs.  I guess I'd say I have the patience to model a human with
meshes *one time*.  Then I want to parameterize the nose, eyes, cheeks, brow,
and animate the mouth & eyes.

Partly this is just to see what can be done, but I also think it's helpful for
povray itself to demonstrate the power of its scripting language.

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