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From: Tek
Subject: Booster glow
Date: 10 Mar 2003 19:47:31
Message: <3e6d3223@news.povray.org>
I've just added a rather nice booster glow effect to the spaceship I'm using in
the animation I'm working on at the moment. The ship's looking a lot better than
it did in it's early appearance on p.b.a (message titled "Teleportation").

Anyway, I thought I'd post it here 'cause it looks pretty :)

Here the boosters are all firing at once, just to test them, but in the
animation I'll be using a kind of rocket-ship-inverse-kinematics to light up the
boosters according to the acceleration and angular acceleration the ship
experiences as it follows a spline. I'll post an animation of this effect in
action as soon as I get the chance to render it!

Comments? Suggestions?

--
Tek
http://www.evilsuperbrain.com


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From: Renderdog
Subject: Re: Booster glow
Date: 10 Mar 2003 22:20:04
Message: <web.3e6d551453557273c459a4b40@news.povray.org>
Great looking spaceship, and very original. Very nice renders/lighting as
well. I'll mention a few things that came to me as I looked at it, FWIW,
but since it's intended for animation I'm not sure these comments apply.

The thruster glows are very pretty and hint at an unusual thruster
technology. I relate color to temperature (and cleaness of burn) so the
hottest part seems to be on the edge, the blue flame. Perhaps for an
animation the flames would change as thrusters fired, first a single color,
and then the outside rings/glows increase in visibility or pulsing as time
passes. The thruster flames look ultraviolet and highly radioactive;
nuclear thrusters?

The non-symetrical pattern used to texture the craft looks like one of those
random patterns used to fool the eye, to keep the enemy from locking on the
target.

I've read men identify cars using the same part of their brain used to
identify faces. This craft seems to be missing it's eyes (cockpit or
weapons), but I don't see any clear size cues. I'm guessing it's between a
fighter and bomber sized vehicle.

The thrusters might benefit from having a deeper tunnel from which the flame
exits.

I see what look like some reflections of the flames, but I always look for a
glow washing back across a vehicle's dark side when thrusters fire. Might
be too slow to use a point light source for each thruster in an animation
so you could create a section of the vehicle around each thruster
pattern-mapped as if lit, and swap it in/out for each thruster, but that's
a lot of work for a subtle effect.

The black and white circles on the craft remind me of the Space Vision
System patterns used on the space station as a docking/berthing aid.

I hope all this gibberish helps,
Mark


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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Booster glow
Date: 11 Mar 2003 08:05:10
Message: <3e6ddf06@news.povray.org>
"Renderdog" <slo### [at] hiwaaynet> wrote in message
news:web.3e6d551453557273c459a4b40@news.povray.org...
> Great looking spaceship, and very original. Very nice renders/lighting as
> well.

Thank you :) It's particularly good 'cause these pictures take only about 30
seconds to render on a 2GHz machine!

> The thruster glows are very pretty and hint at an unusual thruster
> technology. I relate color to temperature (and cleaness of burn) so the
> hottest part seems to be on the edge, the blue flame. Perhaps for an
> animation the flames would change as thrusters fired, first a single
color,
> and then the outside rings/glows increase in visibility or pulsing as time
> passes. The thruster flames look ultraviolet and highly radioactive;
> nuclear thrusters?

I confess I've put no thought into what colour they should be, apart from
very loosely taking inspiration from after burners on fighter jets. I like
your suggestions :) Nuclear thrusters are a good explanation. I'd already
considered the idea of having the flames change colour, I think I might also
make them change shape, e.g. so the concentric rings scroll outwards from
the center as it warms up.

> The non-symetrical pattern used to texture the craft looks like one of
those
> random patterns used to fool the eye, to keep the enemy from locking on
the
> target.

The previous colour scheme was blue and yellow, which looked a little too
improbable, so I went for slightly more military colours. I hadn't really
thought about it trying to fool the eye (after all I figure people shooting
at spaceships probably have good lock-on systems!) but I like the asymetry
from an aesthetic point of view. Now you point it out it is very reminiscent
of a camouflage pattern, I like that!

> I've read men identify cars using the same part of their brain used to
> identify faces. This craft seems to be missing it's eyes (cockpit or
> weapons), but I don't see any clear size cues. I'm guessing it's between a
> fighter and bomber sized vehicle.

ah, yes... I'll explain that in a moment...

> The thrusters might benefit from having a deeper tunnel from which the
flame
> exits.

I tried putting the flame deeper inside the booster, but it looked wrong.
All you saw protruding was a bunch of parallel lines, 'cause you couldn't
see that the flame's cylindrical without being able to see the circles at
the hot end of it. Having that sticking out the booster looked wrong, and
very flat.

> I see what look like some reflections of the flames, but I always look for
a
> glow washing back across a vehicle's dark side when thrusters fire. Might
> be too slow to use a point light source for each thruster in an animation
> so you could create a section of the vehicle around each thruster
> pattern-mapped as if lit, and swap it in/out for each thruster, but that's
> a lot of work for a subtle effect.

Good idea. It may be possible to use light sources, my animation's rendering
very fast at the moment.

> The black and white circles on the craft remind me of the Space Vision
> System patterns used on the space station as a docking/berthing aid.

Right, this is where I'll explain the whole "cockpit" thing from above...
You see, those spots are meant to be windows! That's where the sense of
scale is, I reckon the ship's about the size of an average passenger jet. I
guess I'll have to improve the window effect, and maybe go for a different
style of window entirely. Any suggestions you have would be appreciated :)

> I hope all this gibberish helps,
> Mark

Yes it does. Thank you!

--
Tek
http://www.evilsuperbrain.com


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From: Renderdog
Subject: Re: Booster glow
Date: 11 Mar 2003 10:40:05
Message: <web.3e6e026b535572737ba9929f0@news.povray.org>
Tek wrote:

>Thank you :) It's particularly good 'cause these pictures take only about 30
>seconds to render on a 2GHz machine!

That's amazing. I need a new machine (and perhaps more thought in my
construction).

>I confess I've put no thought into what colour they should be, apart from
>very loosely taking inspiration from after burners on fighter jets. I like
>your suggestions :) Nuclear thrusters are a good explanation. I'd already
>considered the idea of having the flames change colour, I think I might also
>make them change shape, e.g. so the concentric rings scroll outwards from
>the center as it warms up.

The outward scrolling sounds like it would look great!

>I tried putting the flame deeper inside the booster, but it looked wrong.
>All you saw protruding was a bunch of parallel lines, 'cause you couldn't
>see that the flame's cylindrical without being able to see the circles at
>the hot end of it. Having that sticking out the booster looked wrong, and
>very flat.

I understand what you mean there. Could you leave the flame as it is with a
deeper tunnel (more visible chrome on the inside of the nozzle)? I have no
idea what that would look like, but I know the orbiter's main engine's blue
flames appear to be detached from the nozzles. The orbiter's engines also
have a nice "focusing" effect when they start up.

>Right, this is where I'll explain the whole "cockpit" thing from above...
>You see, those spots are meant to be windows! That's where the sense of
>scale is, I reckon the ship's about the size of an average passenger jet. I
>guess I'll have to improve the window effect, and maybe go for a different
>style of window entirely. Any suggestions you have would be appreciated :)

Maybe a shiny rim around the windows, similar to the thrusters, to give it a
port-hole look. More regular spacing might also help, and none right next
to thrusters (especially since they're nuclear :-).


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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Booster glow
Date: 11 Mar 2003 14:57:38
Message: <3e6e3fb2$1@news.povray.org>
Renderdog <slo### [at] hiwaaynet> wrote:
> That's amazing. I need a new machine (and perhaps more thought in my
> construction).

Well it takes only 1 minute on my 550MHz machine at home :) The 2GHz one is my
work machine, though I've just bought myself a new PC that's even faster, but
it's broken so I won't be able to use it for a few more days... :(

> I understand what you mean there. Could you leave the flame as it is with a
> deeper tunnel (more visible chrome on the inside of the nozzle)? I have no
> idea what that would look like, but I know the orbiter's main engine's blue
> flames appear to be detached from the nozzles. The orbiter's engines also
> have a nice "focusing" effect when they start up.

Yeah, I know the effect you mean. It looks cool. Though I see what you meant
about the tunnel, I was confused 'cause there -is- a tunnel ther already! The
reason you can't see it is I've foolishly coloured it black! I'll play with some
different styles and see what looks good.

> Maybe a shiny rim around the windows, similar to the thrusters, to give it a
> port-hole look. More regular spacing might also help, and none right next
> to thrusters (especially since they're nuclear :-).

Very good suggestions, I'll see what I can do :)

Thanks!

--
Tek
http://www.evilsuperbrain.com


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From: Daniel Matthews
Subject: Re: Booster glow
Date: 12 Mar 2003 02:12:37
Message: <34931207.itMbZIBNlx@3-e.net>
Not bad, here is what the real thing looks like.
Plasma with magnetic containment that is.
:o)

Tek wrote:

> I've just added a rather nice booster glow effect to the spaceship I'm
> using in the animation I'm working on at the moment. The ship's looking a
> lot better than it did in it's early appearance on p.b.a (message titled
> "Teleportation").
> 
> Anyway, I thought I'd post it here 'cause it looks pretty :)
> 
> Here the boosters are all firing at once, just to test them, but in the
> animation I'll be using a kind of rocket-ship-inverse-kinematics to light
> up the boosters according to the acceleration and angular acceleration the
> ship experiences as it follows a spline. I'll post an animation of this
> effect in action as soon as I get the chance to render it!
> 
> Comments? Suggestions?
> 
> --
> Tek
> http://www.evilsuperbrain.com

-- 
Your connection failed because: Unoptimized hard drive


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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Booster glow
Date: 12 Mar 2003 03:59:20
Message: <3e6ef6e8@news.povray.org>
"Daniel Matthews" <dan#@3-e.net> wrote in message
news:349### [at] 3-enet...
> Not bad, here is what the real thing looks like.
> Plasma with magnetic containment that is.
> :o)

Cool!

well, incredibly hot, actually :)

--
Tek
http://www.evilsuperbrain.com


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From: Tek
Subject: Re: Booster glow
Date: 12 Mar 2003 08:18:15
Message: <3e6f3397$1@news.povray.org>
"Tek" <tek### [at] evilsuperbraincom> wrote in message
news:3e6d3223@news.povray.org...
> Here the boosters are all firing at once, just to test them, but in the
> animation I'll be using a kind of rocket-ship-inverse-kinematics to light
up the
> boosters according to the acceleration and angular acceleration the ship
> experiences as it follows a spline. I'll post an animation of this effect
in
> action as soon as I get the chance to render it!

Aforementioned animation is now on p.b.a :)

--
Tek
http://www.evilsuperbrain.com


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