Tim Nikias v2.0 wrote:
> The advantage of well-documented code is not
> only that its a benefit for others, but also,
> that you may understand someday later how you
> did it, and what you did.

Are you sure you don't mean well-commented code? I still want to comment
my code, just not make documentation (or help-files).

> But particles? How often does a standard
> user really need them?

Exactly...

> But its good to know that you'll still be in
> the newsgroups, you've been of good help, and
> I'd miss that.

Aw, thanks. :) You can be sure I'll keep an eye on these groups, even in
periods where I don't seem to post very much.

> But what about your walking system? Finish
> that one and release it, or not?

Unfortunately it's too far from being finished. I can't even call it a
system - it's just some code right now. It's not generic enough, not
user-friendly, and not documented, which means that it's not even close
to being half finished. I don't think I'll continue the development of
it, so it won't be released... :(

Rune
--
3D images and anims, include files, tutorials and more:
rune|vision:  http://runevision.com (updated Oct 19)
POV-Ray Ring: http://webring.povray.co.uk

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If you don't want to finish it, then how about
at least preparing the scene with the spider so
that one can declare a surface, a path, and let
the spider crawl? And since the Spider is
probably Inverse-Kinematics, one could also
model one's own spider...

Then we'd (or I, for one) could have at least
look at how you did it and play around with
some spiders. :-)

-- 
Tim Nikias v2.0
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights


> > The advantage of well-documented code is not
> > only that its a benefit for others, but also,
> > that you may understand someday later how you
> > did it, and what you did.
>
> Are you sure you don't mean well-commented code? I still want to comment
> my code, just not make documentation (or help-files).
>
> > But particles? How often does a standard
> > user really need them?
>
> Exactly...
>
> > But its good to know that you'll still be in
> > the newsgroups, you've been of good help, and
> > I'd miss that.
>
> Aw, thanks. :) You can be sure I'll keep an eye on these groups, even in
> periods where I don't seem to post very much.
>
> > But what about your walking system? Finish
> > that one and release it, or not?
>
> Unfortunately it's too far from being finished. I can't even call it a
> system - it's just some code right now. It's not generic enough, not
> user-friendly, and not documented, which means that it's not even close
> to being half finished. I don't think I'll continue the development of
> it, so it won't be released... :(
>
> Rune
> --
> 3D images and anims, include files, tutorials and more:
> rune|vision:  http://runevision.com (updated Oct 19)
> POV-Ray Ring: http://webring.povray.co.uk
>
>


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Gulp! :-} I for one am guilty of downloading both of your particle/water systems
and not posting any results. I have played with them to get the technique right
but have not come up with any ideas to incorporate them in scenes that would
either do them justice or look good. I had one project that would have used both
of them but another element scunnered me of the project (HiWire) so it is lying
fallow. 
	Rune I am sorry you don't feel it's worth the effort but for my part it
is. Your particle system will be in my armoury (Not WMD, I hasten to add) and
will be used when I have the time, a more powerful PC and more visits by the
muse. Tim your work is inspirational and I'm glad you found PartixGen.

BTW Now Luis Gomes has released his Insert code for Moray these systems will be
easer to use for some of the non purists. 

Regards
        Stephen

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mca### [at] aolcom (S McAvoy) wrote:
> Rune I am sorry you don't feel it's worth
> the effort but for my part it is.

Well, it's not like I've been disappointed or anything. I know there are
some people who use the include, and that's nice to know. :) It's just
that with hundreds of hours invested in a project, it'd be nice if the
amount of active and visible users could be counted in hundreds rather
than in tens, and that's simply not possible within the confinements of
the POV-Ray community.

That, and the fact that my passion is drifting from development to
artistic expression...

Rune
--
3D images and anims, include files, tutorials and more:
rune|vision:  http://runevision.com (updated Oct 19)
POV-Ray Ring: http://webring.povray.co.uk

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Tim Nikias v2.0 wrote:
> If you don't want to finish it, then how about
> at least preparing the scene with the spider so
> that one can declare a surface, a path, and let
> the spider crawl?

I might, I might... It would still be a lot of cleaning up.

> And since the Spider is probably Inverse-Kinematics,
> one could also model one's own spider...

Right now he spider is *not* very well separated from the code that
controls its movements, so one would have to put some time into
understanding it all...

> Then we'd (or I, for one) could have at least
> look at how you did it and play around with
> some spiders. :-)

Heh, yeah. I'll consider it...

Rune
--
3D images and anims, include files, tutorials and more:
rune|vision:  http://runevision.com (updated Oct 19)
POV-Ray Ring: http://webring.povray.co.uk

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On Tue, 22 Jul 2003 16:57:54 +0200, "Rune" <run### [at] runevisioncom> wrote:


>
>That, and the fact that my passion is drifting from development to
>artistic expression...
>
Well who can blame you, That's really what it is about for most of us.

Regards
        Stephen

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Evolution:
POV-ignorant -step1-> Newbie -step2-> Standard user -step3-> advanced user

Systems like your particle systems greatly help in step3, even if they are
'only' used as a source of inspiration and a teaching aid.
Nobody really *needs* even POV-Ray, but we all *want* to see (and sometimes
use) everything we can get.
And who doesn't want realistic fire, flocking animals, water splashes,
smoke, fireworks and so on?  -- even in stills: ignite a fire, let it
evolve until it looks right, then take a snapshot.

   Sputnik

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message news:3f1d8a9b$1@news.povray.org...
| Evolution:
| POV-ignorant -step1-> Newbie -step2-> Standard user -step3-> advanced
user
|

There needs to be another step added at the end of your chain. A step
for those who create algorithms rather than just translate them into POV
code. The reason that these include files are never used is that by the
time a person becomes familiar enough with macros to use the files, he
is more than capable of coding these algorithms himself. The way to
contribute to the POV community is with *original* algorithms, or at
least horribly complex algorithms that cannot be coded by a "Standard
user".

 -Shay

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I wouldn't say that. By the time one can use my
LSSM Macros, you're probably not able to
understand all of it, let alone do it yourself. They've
got a very intuitive handling (at least, that's the
feeling I have, can't get any easier to use them unless
confining the effects too much), but the background
in keeping track of calculation steps, interpolation,
different arrays, intersection tests, handling of
corners, macros for easy path definition... I don't
think if one grasps the idea how to declare the
object the water shall interact with, that one is
also able to code the structure himself.

The same applies for different other applications
as well. Being able to use a particle system doesn't
make you able to code one yourself. There's lots
of tiny things to be addressed in proper coding, and
you don't get all that just by knowing how the main
idea works.

-- 
Tim Nikias v2.0
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights


> | Evolution:
> | POV-ignorant -step1-> Newbie -step2-> Standard user -step3-> advanced
> user
> |
>
> There needs to be another step added at the end of your chain. A step
> for those who create algorithms rather than just translate them into POV
> code. The reason that these include files are never used is that by the
> time a person becomes familiar enough with macros to use the files, he
> is more than capable of coding these algorithms himself. The way to
> contribute to the POV community is with *original* algorithms, or at
> least horribly complex algorithms that cannot be coded by a "Standard
> user".
>
>  -Shay
>
>


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> There needs to be another step added at the end of your chain.

Agreed. And more steps: -> artist -> advanced artist -> ...;
-> programmer -> POV-Ray developer -> ...

I just wanted to empathize that even include files which are
never used are a valuable contribution to the POV-Ray community
because they help to improve our abilities. I've learnt *much*
from the work of others although I prefer to do everything
myself.

   Sputnik

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