 |
|
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Darren New <dne### [at] san rrcom> wrote:
> Warp wrote:
> > The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion was my first modern "sandbox-style" game
> > I played, and it was a magnificent experience.
> Actually, I'd say that Thief and Myst/Riven were both sandbox-style games.
Not in the sense that "a sandbox game" is usually used. What is usually
meant with it is that the whole outworld (which usually should be very big)
is completely open to be explored, so you can go anywhere you want and do
whatever you want. There are no levels which are played one after another,
like in more traditional games.
Thief consists of levels, and the gameplay is pretty linear from level
to level. In Myst/Riven you are not completely free to go wherever you like,
but you are limited to predefined narrow paths (mainly due to technical
limitations).
--
- Warp
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Warp wrote:
> Not in the sense that "a sandbox game" is usually used. What is usually
> meant with it is that the whole outworld (which usually should be very big)
> is completely open to be explored, so you can go anywhere you want and do
> whatever you want. There are no levels which are played one after another,
> like in more traditional games.
Fair enough. Certainly Myst and Riven fit that mold. The later ones had
more of an interactive story, so you have to (for example) solve some
puzzles, then someone else comes along and does something, and then you have
to go solve other puzzles.
> Thief consists of levels, and the gameplay is pretty linear from level
> to level.
OK. But within each level, you could pretty do anything and everything you
wanted, even to the point of managing to get places you weren't supposed to
go by using the environment. Sure, inter-level it's linear.
> In Myst/Riven you are not completely free to go wherever you like,
> but you are limited to predefined narrow paths (mainly due to technical
> limitations).
The paths really go most everywhere. Other than being unable to swim, I
can't think of too many places you couldn't get to for reasons not obvious
in the level design. Indeed, a good amount of the fun of Riven was figuring
out how to get to places you could see and knew you needed to be there, but
you couldn't figure out where the entrance was.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Eiffel - The language that lets you specify exactly
that the code does what you think it does, even if
it doesn't do what you wanted.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Darren New wrote:
> Myst and Riven had good
> graphics (altho obviously limited to stills).
Following those: Myst III and Myst IV use 360° stills (so you can rotate the
view freely), with a lot of live video embedded (way more real video of
actors with chroma key than in Riven).
Myst V is the first in the series to use real-time 3D graphics.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Nicolas Alvarez wrote:
> Darren New wrote:
>> Myst and Riven had good
>> graphics (altho obviously limited to stills).
>
> Following those: Myst III and Myst IV use 360° stills (so you can
rotate the
> view freely), with a lot of live video embedded (way more real video of
> actors with chroma key than in Riven).
>
> Myst V is the first in the series to use real-time 3D graphics.
There's also "RealMyst", which is Myst #1 redone with a 3D FPS engine. Lo
oks
like crap, relatively speaking, because the care put into the original
textures wasn't there in the engine.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Eiffel - The language that lets you specify exactly
that the code does what you think it does, even if
it doesn't do what you wanted.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
And lo On Thu, 03 Jun 2010 19:19:15 +0100, Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> did
spake thusly:
> Phil Cook v2 <phi### [at] nospamrocainfreeservecouk> wrote:
>> From reviews some are disappointed they dropped the sandbox aspect for a
>> linear fixed storyline approach.
>
> The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion was my first modern "sandbox-style" game
> I played, and it was a magnificent experience.
>
> Unfortunately after playing with it for a month or so, I got actually
> immunized against the marvels of an open and realistic world, and
> afterwards
> any sandbox-style game has been outright boring. Thus it would be such a
> problem for me.
>
> (I go to more detail here:
> http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/sandbox_games.html )
To my mind it's not that the sandbox gives you everything it's that your
actions seem to be inconsequential to the story or the world. They are, in
theory, open Final Fantasy games. "Oh no a giant meteor is about to hit
our planet and only you can save us by defeating the dark wizard who pulls
it closer, but first I'm having difficulty finding my sheep can you help?"
there's a level of disconnect there if you just plough through the story
you're either woefully underpowered or have a sense of unease that you've
missed out on everything the world can offer. Try to take advantage of the
'world' and as you say ennui sets in.
Okay I harp on about InFamous but it works. It's a small open world you
can just run around, but the side-quests matter; fix the satellite uplinks
and more people can contact you with jobs, sort out this problem and the
enemies won't venture into that area in such high numbers meaning you
don't have to run through then or stop to slug it out each time. It has an
effect so much so that one of the side-missions I tend to leave to last is
getting the El-Trains running; with them defunct you can use the railway
as a quick transit system, with them running you have to watch out you
don't get splattered by a train, on the plus side the trains move faster
if you can hitch a ride and they can also splat enemies on the tracks too.
All the side-missions connect to the main story and both affect the world
around you.
--
Phil Cook
--
I once tried to be apathetic, but I just couldn't be bothered
http://flipc.blogspot.com
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Phil Cook v2 wrote:
> To my mind it's not that the sandbox gives you everything it's that your
> actions seem to be inconsequential to the story or the world.
In Black&White, you play a local God trying to keep your followers happy.
It's also not particularly interesting. The hype sounded great, but it was
like "Nice engine. Where's the game?"
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Eiffel - The language that lets you specify exactly
that the code does what you think it does, even if
it doesn't do what you wanted.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Darren New wrote:
> In Black&White, you play a local God trying to keep your followers
> happy. It's also not particularly interesting. The hype sounded great,
> but it was like "Nice engine. Where's the game?"
Maybe it's just me, but given a game where you can do absolutely
anything you want, my reaction is typically "so what are you supposed to
do?"
(I had this problem with Frontier Elite II, which is supposedly the best
computer game ever written...)
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Yotzse reviewed it.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/zero-punctuation/1756-Alan-Wake
I haven't watched it yet, but there's almost undoubtably spoilers. :-)
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Eiffel - The language that lets you specify exactly
that the code does what you think it does, even if
it doesn't do what you wanted.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
> Unfortunately after playing with it for a month or so, I got actually
> immunized against the marvels of an open and realistic world, and
> afterwards
> any sandbox-style game has been outright boring. Thus it would be such a
> problem for me.
>
> (I go to more detail here:
> http://warp.povusers.org/grrr/sandbox_games.html )
I liked the way GTA does it, whereby you only get access to a limited area
of the complete world initially, and are forced to get to some point in the
story before other parts of the world become accessible (of course you can
see the other areas on the map, which makes you want to get to them). GTA
is also very good how it has several separate storylines throughout the
missions, and then some come together towards the end of the game whilst
others remain separate. Of course to make this work you cannot truly do any
mission in any order, sometimes you get a "Complete X and come back here"
message, but IME it wasn't very often. Certainly GTA San Andreas was one of
the best games I've ever played.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
Darren New wrote:
> Yotzse reviewed it.
>
> I haven't watched it yet, but there's almost undoubtably spoilers. :-)
Gotta love ZP! Sometimes I delude myself into thinking that I could do
stuff like this. After all, it's just a guy talking really fast, right?
Well, um... no. No I cannot do this. Sadly.
From this review, I gather that it isn't very good.
Post a reply to this message
|
|
| |
| |
|
|
|
|
| |
|
|
