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>>> I currently get £14,000 a year. Which isn't a lot of money.
>>
>> Dude, that's not even minimum wage here.
>
> Minimum wage here is £14,373.74 (€=alt-0128 £=alt-156 and ü=alt-129 but
> that was not the question) if I computed it right
Doesn't it vary depending on how many hours you work?
(Note that my wages are not *precisely* £14,000, that's just the nearest
round figure. I don't know the precise figure off the top of my head.)
>>> never [knowingly] met anybody who earns anywhere near £30,000 a year.
>>
>> You definitely need to move. That's not even college graduate money here.
>
> Seconded. Feeling like talking to a wall.
Well, everybody else in this city seems to not have a problem finding a
job, so...
--
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*
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On 31-1-2010 19:06, Orchid XP v8 wrote:
>>>> I currently get £14,000 a year. Which isn't a lot of money.
>>>
>>> Dude, that's not even minimum wage here.
>>
>> Minimum wage here is £14,373.74 (€=alt-0128 £=alt-156 and ü=alt-129
>> but that was not the question) if I computed it right
>
> Doesn't it vary depending on how many hours you work?
sure, that is full time. 38 or 40 hours per week.
Are you working full-time?
> (Note that my wages are not *precisely* £14,000, that's just the nearest
> round figure. I don't know the precise figure off the top of my head.)
>
>>>> never [knowingly] met anybody who earns anywhere near £30,000 a year.
>>>
>>> You definitely need to move. That's not even college graduate money
>>> here.
>>
>> Seconded. Feeling like talking to a wall.
>
> Well, everybody else in this city seems to not have a problem finding a
> job, so...
>
Sorry, what *city*?
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Orchid XP v8 wrote:
> Doesn't it vary depending on how many hours you work?
I calculated based on 2000 hours, i.e., 8 hours x 5 days x 50 weeks.
> Well, everybody else in this city seems to not have a problem finding a
> job, so...
No, those that couldn't find a job *left*. :-)
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
Forget "focus follows mouse." When do
I get "focus follows gaze"?
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>> Doesn't it vary depending on how many hours you work?
>
> sure, that is full time. 38 or 40 hours per week.
> Are you working full-time?
I am. I was just clarifying the point that there's a dependence there.
>> Well, everybody else in this city seems to not have a problem finding
>> a job, so...
>>
> Sorry, what *city*?
...?
--
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*
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> department or something,
Err, no. FWIW the starting salary for graduates at our place wasn't much
below that several years ago. For someone with a degree and 5 years
relevant experience I'd say 30k was easily achievable and you wouldn't be
expected to be in charge of anyone.
> hadn't realised that there are real people out there who actually earn
> this much money.
I don't think I've ever had a boss that earned less than 50K. I think you
have a totally skewed view of salaries because you are paid so little in
your current job.
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I guess you put an extreme amount of value on familiarity.
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Orchid XP v8 wrote:
> Plan B: Try the local paper...
Well, that worked a little better. Of the 27 jobs returned from my
search, 7 of them were actually what I asked for (rather than some
superficially similar-sounding job), and I was able to apply to 2 of them.
OTOH, it's the local paper. They get two or three computer jobs *per
month*. o_O And that's for web design, data entry, technical support and
every other computer-related category put together, not just the one
specific area I'm looking at.
Oh dears.
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>> Maybe it means "Unix operating systems in general, but especially Linux
>> and Solaris, and from all Linux distros especially Red Hat".
>
> In my experience, no, it just means the person putting together the list
> doesn't know what they're talking about, literally. They have a pile of
> paper with a list of skills different people told them they were looking
> for, so they wrote them all down.
This seems to be my experience too.
I briefly mentioned on one CV that one of the programs I wrote deleted
various temp files, including the "web cache". And I got some recruiter
calling me up claiming that I was ideal for a role because I "know
cashae", which apparently is some niche programming language used in the
healthcare system. Way to completely fail to comprehend what I wrote, man!
> Either
> that, or they're optimizing for search engines, just plugging in what
> everyone might search for.
That too. Lots and lots of these things start with a long list of search
terms before the [vaguely] human-readable part starts.
Reading these adverts, one gets the impression of some underpaid nobody
hurridly scribbling down text all day without the slightest clue what
they're talking about, and without bothering with such niceties as
spelling and grammar.
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>> department or something,
>
> Err, no. FWIW the starting salary for graduates at our place wasn't
> much below that several years ago.
*Starting* salary?
> For someone with a degree and 5 years relevant experience
[7 years]
> I'd say 30k was easily achievable and you
> wouldn't be expected to be in charge of anyone.
Really? I find that quite surprising.
Hell, my sister is an accountant and she doesn't earn nearly that much.
And my dad has over 30 years experience as a parmacutical analyst
[that's highly skilled, specialist work that's difficult to hire for]
and he earns less than that.
>> (I hadn't realised that there are real people out there who actually
>> earn this much money.
>
> I don't think I've ever had a boss that earned less than 50K. I think
> you have a totally skewed view of salaries because you are paid so
> little in your current job.
Hmm, thinking about it... I vaguely "know" our CEO. He must surely be on
a bit more than 50K. I "know" our Director of IT [who no longer works
here as of Friday], and he probably earns a tad more than 50K too.
I guess most managers just don't make a habit of telling everybody how
much more money they earn than you do...
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> *Starting* salary?
Yes! I just did a search on monster for "graduate software" and nearly
every result had a salary range somewhere between 20 and 30K as a *starting*
salary. The same is true of "graduate engineer". Heck, two of my best
friends from University (both did computer science) got a job with this
company writing software for internet routers and their starting salary was
30K. My starting salary was closer to 20K than 30K, but that was 7 years
ago, I know now they are offering new graduates closer to 30K.
According to prospects.ac.uk the average graduate starting salary ranges
from 20 to 25k depending on who you ask. I would imagine that having a
computer science degree would put you above the average.
>> For someone with a degree and 5 years relevant experience
>
> [7 years]
>
>> I'd say 30k was easily achievable and you wouldn't be expected to be in
>> charge of anyone.
>
> Really? I find that quite surprising.
How come? Even if you started on 20K, a 50% pay increase over 7 years is not
surprising.
> Hell, my sister is an accountant and she doesn't earn nearly that much.
If she is working for a reputable accountancy firm, has done the
qualifications and has more than 7 years experience (IIRC she is older than
you?) then that seems pretty poor pay to me.
> Hmm, thinking about it... I vaguely "know" our CEO. He must surely be on a
> bit more than 50K.
Probably a big "bit" more.
> I "know" our Director of IT [who no longer works here as of Friday], and
> he probably earns a tad more than 50K too.
You'd think so.
> I guess most managers just don't make a habit of telling everybody how
> much more money they earn than you do...
You can easily estimate it though, by looking at similar jobs at other
companies, how your internal pay structure works etc. For example I know
that my manager must be earning more than a "lead engineer", which must be
earning more than I do. I know roughly what % increase you get for
promotion, so my manager must be on about 60-70K. I can also then guess
that the director of my department is on about 80-90K, and the MD probably
110-130K. This ties in well with job adverts I've seen for similar
positions in other companies, and from talking with other people.
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