Warp wrote:

>   I have not fully understood why, but conspiracy theories are extremely
> enticing, especially when properly presented.

>   Maybe this is something related to human psychology.

It surely *must* be. I don't know what specifically. (Confirmation bais? 
Excitement? Elitism? Herd behaviour?) But it surely couldn't be this 
popular otherwise. One person believing something silly could just be 
delusional. But millions choosing to believe something silly? There must 
be some deeper reason for why.

Of course, if you want to believe that the Lock Ness Monster is real, 
that's fine by me. But when people are *dying* needlessly because of 
some stupid conspiracy theory... this is "not fine". It's not fine at all!

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Invisible wrote:
> (For example, you show people photos from a pair of digital cameras.
> Most people prefer camera X, and a few prefer camera Y. Now you tell
> them that camera X is 5 megapixels, but camera Y is 10 megapixels.
> Suddenly everybody prefers the photos from camera Y. WTF??)
> 
> I worry about the human race... Seriously, how did a species so stupid
> survive for so long?

	Don't confuse stupidity with the inability to be objective. And to be
fair, the latter is hard, and needs overt training. Besides, why the
belief that intelligence has much to do with survival?

	We're still quite ignorant about the human brain and psychology. When I
see stuff like:

http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/dan_gilbert_asks_why_are_we_happy.html

	I realize that I'd be the stupid one to have pre-conceived assumptions
on what's normal behavior. Expecting people to be something other than
what the brain naturally provides, and not even being sure on what the
is natural for the brain, is ludicrous.

-- 
If you ate pasta and antipasta, would you still be hungry?


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                       >>>>>>mue### [at] nawazorg<<<<<<
                                   anl

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Invisible wrote:
> Of course, if you want to believe that the Lock Ness Monster is real,

	No one believes in the Lock Ness monster.

	The Loch Ness monster, however, is another story. 	

> that's fine by me. But when people are *dying* needlessly because of
> some stupid conspiracy theory... this is "not fine". It's not fine at all!

	It's fine if they choose it and don't damage others.

-- 
If you ate pasta and antipasta, would you still be hungry?


                    /\  /\               /\  /
                   /  \/  \ u e e n     /  \/  a w a z
                       >>>>>>mue### [at] nawazorg<<<<<<
                                   anl

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Mike Raiford wrote:
> they eventually started to give the same answer as the 
> rest of the group. WTF?

I saw Candid Camera do this with an elevator in an office building. They 
eventually had the guy facing the back, with his hat off, covering his rump 
with it. :-)

-- 
   Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   Why is there a chainsaw in DOOM?
   There aren't any trees on Mars.

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Warp wrote:
>   Maybe this is something related to human psychology.

I remember reading something about this. If you're in a tribe of 100 people, 
most everyone is somewhat dependent on everyone else, so the likelihood that 
someone would lie to you about something important is low. Except for things 
like competition, mates, etc, for which we seem to have little trouble 
catching liars.

If there's something unobvious going on, it's a survival benefit to know 
about it, and hearing it from someone whose welfare is interrelated to yours 
is a pretty reliable indicator compared to finding out on your own with 
possible disastrous consequences.

Of course, this is yet another Just So explanation.

-- 
   Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   Why is there a chainsaw in DOOM?
   There aren't any trees on Mars.

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Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
> I remember reading something about this. If you're in a tribe of 100 people, 
> most everyone is somewhat dependent on everyone else, so the likelihood that 
> someone would lie to you about something important is low. Except for things 
> like competition, mates, etc, for which we seem to have little trouble 
> catching liars.

> If there's something unobvious going on, it's a survival benefit to know 
> about it, and hearing it from someone whose welfare is interrelated to yours 
> is a pretty reliable indicator compared to finding out on your own with 
> possible disastrous consequences.

> Of course, this is yet another Just So explanation.

  Yeah, it sounds like another evolution psychology story.

  Not that it isn't true or based on facts. It's just hard to know what
is really caused by genetic inheritance, and what is caused by something
else.

  One could go the other way around and say that believing conspiracy
theories is the opposite of herd behavior. But this doesn't mean it's a
good thing. Herd behavior, although it's almost always used with a negative
connotation, is not necessarily a bad thing. Individuals survive better
when they are part of a larger group and act the same as the others, thus
contributing to the whole, thus helping everyone survive. If someone goes
against the herd, he will be singled out, and possibly thrown out of the
herd because he doesn't want to be like the others, to his detriment or
even demise.

  Basically, behaving differently from others may be *against* survival
instinct, and can be personally destructive.

  But why do humans have such a strong instinct of being individuals,
being different, standing out? What can be gained from this behavior?
Is believing in conspiracy theories part of this phenomenon?

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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Warp wrote:
>   One could go the other way around and say that believing conspiracy
> theories is the opposite of herd behavior.

Actually, it was kind of my point that it *is* herd behavior. But now we 
have lots of people from outside the "herd" pretending to be in the herd.

Sort of like how you can spook a whole herd of horses or birds by having one 
run (or fly) thru the crowd. What's a stampede if not a conspiracy theory 
that someone unknown is attacking members of the group?

And then lions use this to their advantage, having one lioness spook a group 
of animals towards a bunch of other lionesses hiding in the grass. Which is 
kind of what we see with conspiracy theory con-men.

-- 
   Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   Why is there a chainsaw in DOOM?
   There aren't any trees on Mars.

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Invisible wrote:
>
http://www.badscience.net/2009/01/what-if-everything-you-thought-you-knew-about-aids-was-wrong/

> 
> 
> For reasons I can't entirely put my finger on, I find this whole thing 
> really disturbing.
> 
> Maybe I just find it upsetting that hundreds of scientists have spent 
> thousands of man-years pouring research into this lethal disease to find 
> out what causes it, but then some random person goes "hey, actually, I 
> think really you're all wrong - I don't have any logic or evidence, I 
> just believe this, for no particular reason". And now other people 
> actually *believe* this nonesense. And people are dying because of it.

One blogger has studied the phenomena extensively and come up with a 
deck of cards you can use when reading these things. When ever they make 
some idiot argument, you just play the card that corresponds to the 
tactic. lol First article in their list of cards is:

http://scienceblogs.com/denialism/2007/04/denialists_deck_of_cards_the_2.php

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void main () {

     if version = "Vista" {
       call slow_by_half();
       call DRM_everything();
     }
     call functional_code();
   }
   else
     call crash_windows();
}

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Invisible escreveu:
>>> GroupThink is scary.
>>
>> Doubly scary as that was the example I was thinking of :-)
> 
> NOO! WE'RE ALL LEMMINGS!! ;_;

My pet view of most of mankind is as bovines:  slowly muching away their 
grass, thoughtless expression in the face, always following the rest of 
the band.

Very few individuals are able to step away from the herd and see the 
bigger picture, and not be influenced by it.  Those can clearly see 
where to go and think of how to get there.  They thus become the group's 
leaders.

You wouldn't believe how bad and perverse group thinking can be in a 3rd 
world country like Brazil.  It means poor, analphabetized folks led by 
bad pirated, loud paranoid music and movies, getting subjobs and trying 
to act cool like TV celebrities by having drug-fueled group sex parties 
without condoms still as teens.  Which eventually leads to poorer and 
dumber generations still to come.  I see no hope for these poor, 
acephalic souls...

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