In article <47d6da2f$1@news.povray.org>, voi### [at] devnull says...
> Warp wrote:
> 
> >   Personally I don't see why anyone would want to "upgrade" right now.
> 
> It has SHINY THINGS!!
>
They actually want to play the latest games, which MS still won't 
release a XP version of DirectX 10 for? That would be the only damn 
reason I would get it. Kind of a catch-22. Buy an Xbox 360, which costs 
way more than I want to spend (unless its on a laptop), so I can play 
Halo 2 and 3, or rework an older machine to run Vista, so I can at least 
play 2.... Never mind other things that are coming out as well.

Pain in the fracking ass!
 
-- 
void main () {

    if version = "Vista" {
      call slow_by_half();
      call DRM_everything();
    }
    call functional_code();
  }
  else
    call crash_windows();
}

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3D Content, and 3D Software at DAZ3D!</A>

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Jim Henderson wrote:
> And I couldn't get to it.  No way, no how.  So, frustrated, I grabbed a 
> monitor to see what the dumb thing had done.  You know what?  It reverted 
> EVERY SINGLE CHANGE to the user profile I had put in place.  UAC was 
> enabled; Aero was enabled.  VNC wouldn't start; the firewall (which I had 
> disabled) was active.  It was as if I had just completed the "first boot" 
> setup.

You know what?  MS got sick of users (and third-party programmers) not 
liking being told that certain things (like turning off the firewall) 
are dumb ideas and doing them anyways.  So they said heck with it, and 
now you can't "just turn off" things.  You have to do it correctly.

I don't remember where I got this, might've been here, but this entry in 
particular is gold: 
http://shippingseven.blogspot.com/2008/01/big-changes.html

Aero I played with a little for a few days, then switched to classic view.

-- 
Tim Cook
http://empyrean.digitalartsuk.com

-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
Version: 3.12
GFA dpu- s: a?-- C++(++++) U P? L E--- W++(+++)>$
N++ o? K- w(+) O? M-(--) V? PS+(+++) PE(--) Y(--)
PGP-(--) t* 5++>+++++ X+ R* tv+ b++(+++) DI
D++(---) G(++) e*>++ h+ !r--- !y--
------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------

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Patrick Elliott <sel### [at] rraznet> wrote:
> They actually want to play the latest games, which MS still won't 
> release a XP version of DirectX 10 for?

  How many games supporting extra features of DX10 are there? (And how
many of those games run at a reasonable framerate when using those extra
features with current hardware?)

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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On Tue, 11 Mar 2008 18:24:58 -0400, Tim Cook wrote:

> Jim Henderson wrote:
>> And I couldn't get to it.  No way, no how.  So, frustrated, I grabbed a
>> monitor to see what the dumb thing had done.  You know what?  It
>> reverted EVERY SINGLE CHANGE to the user profile I had put in place. 
>> UAC was enabled; Aero was enabled.  VNC wouldn't start; the firewall
>> (which I had disabled) was active.  It was as if I had just completed
>> the "first boot" setup.
> 
> You know what?  MS got sick of users (and third-party programmers) not
> liking being told that certain things (like turning off the firewall)
> are dumb ideas and doing them anyways.  So they said heck with it, and
> now you can't "just turn off" things.  You have to do it correctly.

The problem is that they left the "just turn off" option in there.  And 
it worked.  Once.  I'll grant them that they didn't ask me a million 
times (like they used to) if I was sure that I wanted to do what I was 
doing.

But silently screwing with settings I put in place doesn't make me happy.

> I don't remember where I got this, might've been here, but this entry in
> particular is gold:
> http://shippingseven.blogspot.com/2008/01/big-changes.html
> 
> Aero I played with a little for a few days, then switched to classic
> view.

Same here.  Even on XP, I couldn't get over the "Fisher-Price" look that 
was default on XP.

Jim

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On Tue, 11 Mar 2008 17:25:54 -0500, Warp wrote:

> And how
> many of those games run at a reasonable framerate when using those extra
> features with current hardware?

On a so-called "Vista-capable" machine, to boot?

Jim

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Nicolas Alvarez wrote:

> What about Windows Movie Maker?

That's great for what? Converting your digicam's AVI's for YouTube?

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Warp wrote:
> Mike Raiford <mra### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
>> My vista upgrade to my home computer hasn't been as smooth as the 
>> upgrade adviser has lead me to believe.
> 
>   But why did you "upgrade"? Wasn't XP working for you for some reason?
> Was there something in Vista which you really needed and which isn't
> available for XP? Peer pressure? Hype?
> 

DirectX 10, Some major improvements in the shell UI. Been using machines 
at work that have it. I liked it, so I upgraded. It wasn't a necessary 
upgrade, per se... But it was probably one of the more painful ones.

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Warp wrote:
> Patrick Elliott <sel### [at] rraznet> wrote:
>> They actually want to play the latest games, which MS still won't 
>> release a XP version of DirectX 10 for?
> 
>   How many games supporting extra features of DX10 are there? (And how
> many of those games run at a reasonable framerate when using those extra
> features with current hardware?)
> 

Flight Sim has preliminary support, Though come to find out that 
"Supports DirectX 10" on the box wasn't true at all. :(

So, I have no idea if FSX works or looks any better on a DX10 machine, 
still. But I can tell you under XP with a reasonably fast system, it 
either looked like crap or ran dog slow. Your choice.

So, now I'm shopping for a real DX10 video card.

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In article <47d8207c$1@news.povray.org>, mra### [at] hotmailcom says...
> Warp wrote:
> > Patrick Elliott <sel### [at] rraznet> wrote:
> >> They actually want to play the latest games, which MS still won't 
> >> release a XP version of DirectX 10 for?
> > 
> >   How many games supporting extra features of DX10 are there? (And how
> > many of those games run at a reasonable framerate when using those extr
a
> > features with current hardware?)
> > 
> 
> Flight Sim has preliminary support, Though come to find out that 
> "Supports DirectX 10" on the box wasn't true at all. :(
> 
> So, I have no idea if FSX works or looks any better on a DX10 machine, 
> still. But I can tell you under XP with a reasonably fast system, it 
> either looked like crap or ran dog slow. Your choice.
> 
> So, now I'm shopping for a real DX10 video card.
> 
Doesn't run slow on ours. But its buggier than hell, including one 
unpatched one, which causes corruption of a stupid logbook file. I 
finally set up a simple batch file to run every time my fathers machine 
started, to delete the file, so the game would work if he had to reboot 
it (and often it would hang the game so bad you did).

Now, Halo 2, as far as I know, won't run without Vista. Same for some 
other games, or at least their box says so. No idea if this is true or 
not though. Seriously, I don't think the problem is DirectX 10, but 
rather Vista itself. Adding a bit better features and things like god 
lights **shouldn't** slow the frame rate down. Running it on an OS that 
can't run non-3D software without it running slower than hell... That 
*would* probably make 3D run like tree sap in winter.

But, it just pisses me off that I can't even buy the newest games 
without either shelling out for a console, or buying and OS that won't 
run them right anyway.

-- 
void main () {

    if version = "Vista" {
      call slow_by_half();
      call DRM_everything();
    }
    call functional_code();
  }
  else
    call crash_windows();
}

<A HREF='http://www.daz3d.com/index.php?refid=16130551'>Get 3D Models,
 
3D Content, and 3D Software at DAZ3D!</A>

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Mike Raiford wrote:

> Warp wrote:
>> Patrick Elliott <sel### [at] rraznet> wrote:
>>> They actually want to play the latest games, which MS still won't
>>> release a XP version of DirectX 10 for?
>> 
>>   How many games supporting extra features of DX10 are there? (And how
>> many of those games run at a reasonable framerate when using those extra
>> features with current hardware?)
>> 
> 
> Flight Sim has preliminary support, Though come to find out that
> "Supports DirectX 10" on the box wasn't true at all. :(
> 
> So, I have no idea if FSX works or looks any better on a DX10 machine,
> still. But I can tell you under XP with a reasonably fast system, it
> either looked like crap or ran dog slow. Your choice.
> 
> So, now I'm shopping for a real DX10 video card.

That's true - with XP SP2 on a 3.4 gHz machine with PCI-EX 7950 Nvidia card
(ok, ok, that's a bit dated already, I know!) I rarely get more than 6 FPS
on the ground at an airport. At altitude I can make about 22 on my rig in
FSX. That's with most options on - dropping options doesn't seem to help
much either. Going to 3x on antialiasing makes it unsimmable - 1 or 2 FPS.
-- 
Stefan

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