Warp wrote:
> Gilles Tran <gitran_nospam_@wanadoo.fr> wrote:
>> Required Skills:
>>     * C/C++
>>     * Linux (RedHat/Centos)
>>     * 3d graphics math
>>     * OpenGL and graphics cards
> 
>   That's a very tempting job offer, but such job offers always crash
> because of one thing: They require fluent spoken English skills and good
> communication skills.

	Are you saying they always *really* require it, or that they just *say*
they require it?

	I'd say try anyway. A lot of people over here hire folks with great
technical skills and poor verbal skills (and poor grammatical skills,
and often poor writing skills). I'm referring to a portion of the
foreign students here.

-- 
"A man doesn't know what happiness is until he's married. By then it's
too late." - Frank Sinatra


                    /\  /\               /\  /
                   /  \/  \ u e e n     /  \/  a w a z
                       >>>>>>mue### [at] nawazorg<<<<<<
                                   anl

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And lo on Thu, 31 Jan 2008 13:43:13 -0000,  did spake, saying:

> Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
<snip>
> Best Regards,
> Mike C.

Just FYI showing up on Opera as a blank name probably because of this -

From: "Mike the Elder" <SPELL:

it don't like them thar pointy things.

-- 
Phil Cook

--
I once tried to be apathetic, but I just couldn't be bothered
http://flipc.blogspot.com

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On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 20:47:40 EST, "Mike the Elder" <SPELL: wrote:

>
>The bad news is...
>http://www.pitt.edu/%7Ekiesling/dude/dude.pdf

Thank you :)


Regards
	Stephen

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"Phil Cook" <phi### [at] nospamrocainfreeservecouk> wrote:
> And lo on Thu, 31 Jan 2008 13:43:13 -0000,  did spake, saying:
>
> > Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
> <snip>
> > Best Regards,
> > Mike C.
>
> Just FYI showing up on Opera as a blank name probably because of this -
>
> From: "Mike the Elder" <SPELL:
>
> it don't like them thar pointy things.
>
> --
> Phil Cook

I removed the whole thing to be sure the offending bit would go. I never typed a
"<", the site threw it in.  I believe it may have been the colon that caused the
problem.  I'll get around to creating a signature with a properly bot-proof
reference to my email eventually.  Thanks for the heads up.

Best Regards,
Mike C.

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Warp wrote:
> I estimate that in 3-4 months I would be able to speak English quite fluently. 

It also helps tremendously if you have someone who *is* a native speaker 
actively helping you out, pointing out your mispronunciations and odd 
word choices and such, methinks. At least, that's my experience.

>   I have already been turned down from a software developer job at Ubisoft
> because of this. I would have otherwise been more than qualified.

That sucks. Sorry to hear that.

-- 
   Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
     On what day did God create the body thetans?

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Mike the Elder wrote:
> Dude, the good news is that you can understand approximately 70% of the speech
> patterns of the typical native San Franciscan by mastering a single term.

Frighteningly true. :-)

-- 
   Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
     On what day did God create the body thetans?

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Mueen Nawaz wrote:
> 	I'd say try anyway. A lot of people over here hire folks with great
> technical skills and poor verbal skills (and poor grammatical skills,
> and often poor writing skills). I'm referring to a portion of the
> foreign students here.

I don't know where "over here" is, but my experience in the USA is that 
most of the technical *and marketing* people here have poor grammatical 
and writing skills.

If you apply for the job, you might consider offering to take a couple 
weeks of private night classes to brush up on problem areas, if that's 
the sort of thing that would help.

-- 
   Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
     On what day did God create the body thetans?

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On Fri, 01 Feb 2008 08:57:31 -0800, Darren New wrote:

> I don't know where "over here" is, but my experience in the USA is that
> most of the technical *and marketing* people here have poor grammatical
> and writing skills.

I have had a similar experience; it's amazing how many marketing people 
(in particular) can't spell or write a sentence that makes any sense.

Jim

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Rune wrote:
> I have the same problem.
> 
> My written English is quite good, but my spoken English is very bad because 
> I've never practised it intensively, like I have with my written English.
> 
> I'm under an everyday illusion that I understand spoken English fine. Here 
> in Denmark we don't have voice overs for foreign movies and TV and while 
> there *are* subtitles, the simultaneous exposure to the original language 
> still works as practice, to the point that many people will notice if the 
> words have been translated in an counterintuitive way. If subtitles are 
> missing, I can still understand 98% of what is said just fine. However, my 
> guess is that I don't understand native English speakers very well at all. 
> At least, that's what happened when I was in England many years ago. While 
> you normally don't notice it, spoken English in movies is *far* better 
> pronounced that how people talk in real life.
> 
> This is my biggest fear when I'm going to the Game Developers Conference in 
> San Francisco in two weeks time: That I'll find myself utterly unable to 
> understand what most people are saying except if they speak slow and clearly 
> to me, and that I'll sound like I'm bad at communicating due to lack of 
> practise with speaking the language...
> 
Let me reassure you, you won't be able to understand most of it. Mainly 
because the majority will be freshly imported Asians with 1 or 2 years 
of experience in pronunciation in an environment of mostly non native 
Americans.

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Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
> It also helps tremendously if you have someone who *is* a native speaker 
> actively helping you out, pointing out your mispronunciations and odd 
> word choices and such, methinks. At least, that's my experience.

  That's one HUGE problem, though. People are way too "polite" to comment
on your mistakes, even if it would benefit you a lot if the did.

  I have had more than one experience related to this just in writing.
I have written something consistently in the wrong way for *years* before
someone *finally* commented that it's wrong, after which I started writing
it correctly. In each case it exasperated me why nobody had said it to me
before. I can't know if I write something in the wrong way if nobody tells me.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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