"Gilles Tran" <git### [at] wanadoofr> wrote in
news:3f5ade0c@news.povray.org: 

> 
> POV-Ray is not used for commercial production purposes (in general).
> Hence people who want to enter a career in 3D production are not
> likely to use it because it won't get them started (or not for long at
> least). These folks need to show their stuff around to get jobs,
>
> 

Blue Sky Studios would be the exception to that rule, since use their own 
custom raytracer.  Perl, PHP, and Python with Povray would be a plus on a 
resume for them.


-- 
Tom
_________________________________
The Internet Movie Project
http://www.imp.org/

Post a reply to this message

Tom Galvin <tom### [at] imporg> wrote in
news:Xns### [at] 204213191226: 


> 
> Blue Sky Studios 
> 

They made "Ice Age".  Sorry for ommiting that.



-- 
Tom
_________________________________
The Internet Movie Project
http://www.imp.org/

Post a reply to this message

Program ended abnormally on 07/09/2003 10:05, Due to a catastrophic Tim
Nikias v2.0 error:

> 
>>YMMV.  I've tried a few of the other packages, and still prefer POV.
> 
> 
> What does YMMV mean? 

"Your mileage may vary"

-- 
/*Francois Labreque*/#local a=x+y;#local b=x+a;#local c=a+b;#macro P(F//
/*    flabreque    */L)polygon{5,F,F+z,L+z,L,F pigment{rgb 9}}#end union
/*        @        */{P(0,a)P(a,b)P(b,c)P(2*a,2*b)P(2*b,b+c)P(b+c,<2,3>)
/*   videotron.ca  */}camera{orthographic location<6,1.25,-6>look_at a }

Post a reply to this message

Eh? And whats that supposed to signify?

I don't get it. And I'm just talking about the
sense in that context and the phrase YMMV
in itself as well. I'm non-native english speaker,
so let's say that me being german is guilty. :-)

-- 
Tim Nikias v2.0
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights
Email: no_lights (@) digitaltwilight.de


>
> Program ended abnormally on 07/09/2003 10:05, Due to a catastrophic Tim
> Nikias v2.0 error:
>
> >
> >>YMMV.  I've tried a few of the other packages, and still prefer POV.
> >
> >
> > What does YMMV mean?
>
> "Your mileage may vary"
>
> -- 
> /*Francois Labreque*/#local a=x+y;#local b=x+a;#local c=a+b;#macro P(F//
> /*    flabreque    */L)polygon{5,F,F+z,L+z,L,F pigment{rgb 9}}#end union
> /*        @        */{P(0,a)P(a,b)P(b,c)P(2*a,2*b)P(2*b,b+c)P(b+c,<2,3>)
> /*   videotron.ca  */}camera{orthographic location<6,1.25,-6>look_at a }
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.515 / Virus Database: 313 - Release Date: 01.09.2003

Post a reply to this message

Tim Nikias v2.0 wrote:
> Eh? And whats that supposed to signify?
> 
> I don't get it. And I'm just talking about the
> sense in that context and the phrase YMMV
> in itself as well. I'm non-native english speaker,
> so let's say that me being german is guilty. :-)

"YMMV" ("your mileage may vary") is a commonly
used English phrase on these groups. It's meant to
signify that your results may be different than those
experienced by the poster, due to unforseen
conditions or varying circumstances. It's "borrowed"
from automobile TV commercials that used to make
claims of good gas mileage for their cars ("your
mileage may vary").


-- 
Steve Martin, CPBE CBNT

Post a reply to this message

Ah, okay. Now I understand. Thanks. :-)


-- 
Tim Nikias v2.0
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights
Email: no_lights (@) digitaltwilight.de


> Tim Nikias v2.0 wrote:
> > Eh? And whats that supposed to signify?
> >
> > I don't get it. And I'm just talking about the
> > sense in that context and the phrase YMMV
> > in itself as well. I'm non-native english speaker,
> > so let's say that me being german is guilty. :-)
>
> "YMMV" ("your mileage may vary") is a commonly
> used English phrase on these groups. It's meant to
> signify that your results may be different than those
> experienced by the poster, due to unforseen
> conditions or varying circumstances. It's "borrowed"
> from automobile TV commercials that used to make
> claims of good gas mileage for their cars ("your
> mileage may vary").
>
>
> -- 
> Steve Martin, CPBE CBNT
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.515 / Virus Database: 313 - Release Date: 01.09.2003

Post a reply to this message

Hugo Asm <hua### [at] post3teledk> wrote in message
news:3f5b64ca@news.povray.org...
> It could also be, that users of POV-Ray are generally more mathmatically
> minded people. At least we are forced to be, and even I've come to value
> math! But look at  p.binaries.images  and see the amount of images that
are
> based on something mathematically, which is great, but misses an appealing
> light, color and composition.

The never-ending catch-22 of CG... artists works best when they don't have
to be bothered by technical considerations, and technicians work best when
they can fiddle with the numbers and not worry about mere aesthetics... yet
CG is ALWAYS a combination of the two.
>
> Even I sometimes feel, there is an abyss between the artist and the
> mathematican.

Well, definitely a difference in thought processing. For some people that
difference is an abyss, for others it's a small sidestep. Regardless of the
size of the gap, a successful CG artist has to be able to bridge it.

>
> In the past, artists worked with simple tools like paper and pencil. And I
> know how many artists don't really *think* about what they're doing (they
> are unable to, if they're on drugs!) they are just working with their
> instincts, feelings, and improvise whatever they're doing. It's a wonder
how
> something great can come out of this, but...

Actually, I find it a wonder that anything great can come out of the sets of
rules, formulas, procedures, etc that make up the way most things are
taught.  Constructing an image from rules or formulas *may* produce a nice
looking image, but probably one that looks good today and is forgotten
tomorrow.   Feelings, intuition and instinct are much more communal, and an
image produced by an artist who is in tune with them and expresses them in
his work is more likely to elicit those same feelings in the viewer, and
will still do so a year or decades later.  That is what art is all about.

>
> Moving the mouse around on the screen, comes closer to this, than using th
e
> keyboard.

Probably most of the time in modeling, although scripting is often faster
for some kinds of objects.  But for setting up lighting, or for working with
LOTS of objects I find that a GUI gets in the way a lot because of too much
information on screen at once.


Maybe that's why POV-Ray is shamelessly ignored among many
> artistic webpages?

I think some of the most artistic CG images I've seen are POV-Ray, but art
and industry are two different things. The CG industry revolves mainly
around animation, photorealism, production deadlines and the ability to move
your product between all the commercial packages.  POV-Ray is an anomaly in
that scene.

But I started ray-tracing with Bryce, then was learning Truespace when I
discovered POV-Ray.  Now Truespace is gathering dust, Bryce is relegated to
a terrain editor and I find that the flexibility of POVs SDL let me be far
more artistic than either of those.  Have never used Maya or 3DSMax, but I
understand they both have scripting languages built into them, so I imagine
they are considerably more flexible, but $$$ is a big barrier there.  As
long as I can create my images, and as long as POV lets me improve
artistically, then it's the best tool for the job.

RG

Post a reply to this message

In article <3f5b6035@news.povray.org>, tji### [at] euskalnetnet says...

> noticias 3f5b3c43$1@news.povray.org...
> <snip>
> > > Modellers exist for POV.
> > Moray? SPatch? Yeah, some do exist. But can they really
> > compete with Lightwave, Maya, etc? I'm not so sure about
> > that.
> > (AFAIK though, Maya has a POV-Ray Plug-In...)
> 
>  Modellers for povray?. Almost every 3D$ program can act
> as a modeller for povray
Sort of...

> (I'm still waiting for someone who create a converter from
> mesh or mesh2 to obj or 3ds.)
This is why it is only 'sort of'. If it doesn't output native POV code or 
only supports a version from 10 years ago, or fails to support some basic 
features (Moray's direct addition of SDL doesn't count imho, especially 
if it is an object you are trying to add and position), then it isn't 
really a good POV-Ray modeller. Nearly every conversion method messes 
something up, fails to convert some things or flat out won't support some 
features that make it impossible to take full advantage of the modellers 
capabilities. A 'real' modeller for POV-Ray would have to be 100% 
supportive of the current version and at least attempt to provide native 
and 'accurate' conversion of models from other popular apps. Having 16 
different programs to do this, because all of them are missing something 
you need, isn't helpful in the least from my view.

> 
> I think that the level of knowledge and practice you have with
> the program you are using is what really makes the difference
> (and usually the amount of work invested in an scene also
> counts ;-)
True, but even mastery of one, that has a complicated solution that takes 
hours to produce, isn't quite as good as one that will let you do the 
same thing as a standard feature in a few clicks. The idea is for 
programs to progress, not develop some bizarre form of computerized urban 
blight, because the zoning laws say you can't have one modeller that 
supports everything correctly. ;) lol

-- 
void main () {

    call functional_code()
  else
    call crash_windows();
}

Post a reply to this message

In article <3f5b3f31$1@news.povray.org>, z99### [at] bellsouthnet says...
> Tim Nikias v2.0 wrote:
> > On Renderosity, I have yet to see one incredible
> > pic where it doesn't say: Maya/Lightwave/etc with
> > Post Processing by Photoshop/Combustion/etc, Hair
> > made with ... background with...
> 
>  In my opinion, postwork is a
> crutch if you're doing something with it that could
> just as well be done inside the renderer with a little
> effort...

I agreed with you on that, but then one problem with Poser and most 
(all?) other programs that rely on meshes is that you can't do without 
post processing. Unless you have a machine like the ones they use as ILM, 
with lots of memory for a 'monolithic' mesh, you always end up with edges 
on objects that have sharp and obvious lines, where they should be a 
curve. You can't hide them. You can make them nearly invisible if 
'really' careful, but some with still be there. The only ones you don't 
see them in is when someone used Photoshop and blended them out. Until 
you find a way to correct this basic flaw in meshes inside the engine 
itself, or you avoid meshes completely, it it virtually 100% certain that 
some post processing will have to be done.

My main complaint about post though is the simple fact that it really 
only shows what they could do in post. You can never be sure what or how 
much they changed the final result, and they could just as easily done a 
really excellent job of dropping a well lit model on top of a photo. Mind 
you most I see that do this are very bad at it, but done right it the 
difference can be impossible to tell apart from a 'real' scene. Some 
magazines even show you how to fake the whole bloody thing using 'only' 
PhotoShop. I want to see the flaws or, failing that, a definitive 
declaration that they never so much as touched a photo program or other 
post effects. That impresses me.

-- 
void main () {

    call functional_code()
  else
    call crash_windows();
}

Post a reply to this message

On Sat,  6 Sep 2003 11:00:28 EDT, "POVeddie" <nomail@nomail> wrote:
> Does anyone know why POV-Ray is not represented at
> http://www.renderosity.com ?

for pesimists: we are periphery of market
for optimists: we are elite of market

for pesimists: it can't be good because it's free
for optimists: it is so good because it's free

for pesimists: it's for text oriented nerds
for optimists: it's for advanced math oriented experimentators

for pesimists: community shoots everybody with no help
for optimists: own community, good resources and almost online help

ABX

Post a reply to this message