> Hi(gh)!
>
> On 16.04.2013 13:23, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>
>> That would be indeed challenging as a (large?) number of authors is not
>> active anymore and may have moved away,
>
> ....or even passed away - the oldest image files in my private
> collection date back to 1998! Who inherits the copyright if no explicit
> testamental provisions had been made? Depends on the country... I don't
> even know how the rules are in Germany...

IANAL, but the concept of copyright in the American sense does not exist 
in Germany. Instead, there is a set of author's rights ("Urheberrecht"), 
and the heirs do get to exercise and benefit from these until so-many 
years after the author's death (the duration depending on the type of 
work AFAIK), after which the work passes on into the public domain.

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On Wed, 17 Apr 2013 19:52:38 +0200, clipka wrote:

> Am 16.04.2013 18:21, schrieb Jörg 'Yadgar' Bleimann:
>> Hi(gh)!
>>
>> On 16.04.2013 13:23, Thomas de Groot wrote:
>>
>>> That would be indeed challenging as a (large?) number of authors is
>>> not active anymore and may have moved away,
>>
>> ....or even passed away - the oldest image files in my private
>> collection date back to 1998! Who inherits the copyright if no explicit
>> testamental provisions had been made? Depends on the country... I don't
>> even know how the rules are in Germany...
> 
> IANAL, but the concept of copyright in the American sense does not exist
> in Germany. Instead, there is a set of author's rights ("Urheberrecht"),
> and the heirs do get to exercise and benefit from these until so-many
> years after the author's death (the duration depending on the type of
> work AFAIK), after which the work passes on into the public domain.

That's pretty much the way it works in the US, too - copyright is for the 
author's life + 70 years IIRC, and the rights are given to the copyright 
holder or the rights assignee (in some cases the publication), and after 
that period lapses, the work passes into the public domain.

I'm not sure what's different between the German definition you gave and 
what I know of the US system (as a copyright holder).

Jim

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Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote:
> That's pretty much the way it works in the US, too - copyright is for the
> author's life + 70 years IIRC, and the rights are given to the copyright
> holder or the rights assignee (in some cases the publication), and after
> that period lapses, the work passes into the public domain.

From the publicity over Martin Luther King Jr's "I Have a Dream" speech, it
seems that the heirs inherit the copyright (for that 70 years).

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On Wed, 17 Apr 2013 15:04:15 -0400, Cousin Ricky wrote:

> Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote:
>> That's pretty much the way it works in the US, too - copyright is for
>> the author's life + 70 years IIRC, and the rights are given to the
>> copyright holder or the rights assignee (in some cases the
>> publication), and after that period lapses, the work passes into the
>> public domain.
> 
> From the publicity over Martin Luther King Jr's "I Have a Dream" speech,
> it seems that the heirs inherit the copyright (for that 70 years).

It depends on how the copyright is assigned.  I know from my own 
experience that copyright assignment is sometimes made to the publisher 
until the book is declared out of print, then it reverts to the author.

But Dr. King's speech was in 1963, so even 70 years from then would still 
be 2033 if he'd died at the speech.

So it doesn't even become an issue until 2038.

Jim

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scott <sco### [at] scottcom> wrote:
> Also I don't think any additional permission would be needed from
> authors simply to index the images in a different way. By uploading to
> p.b.i you are accepting that the images will be accessible by the public
> and sites like Google will index them.

Sounds reasonable, although IANAL.  How ever, it must be noted (and this is as
true of p.b.i as it is of The Google) that an implied permission to index a work
does not imply permission to /use/ it.  I wouldn't think that I should have to
point this out, but many people seem to be under the delusion that posting a
work to the Internet puts it in the public domain.

Posters have often given explicit permission to use images as wallpapers, for
example, but this would seem to fall under Fair Use or Fair Dealing in many
countries, anyway.

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Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote:
> But Dr. King's speech was in 1963, so even 70 years from then would still
> be 2033 if he'd died at the speech.
>
> So it doesn't even become an issue until 2038.

Actually, 2038 is when it /stops/ being an issue.  (Unless Congress extends the
term again.)

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Am 17.04.2013 20:49, schrieb Jim Henderson:

>> IANAL, but the concept of copyright in the American sense does not exist
>> in Germany. Instead, there is a set of author's rights ("Urheberrecht"),
>> and the heirs do get to exercise and benefit from these until so-many
>> years after the author's death (the duration depending on the type of
>> work AFAIK), after which the work passes on into the public domain.
>
> That's pretty much the way it works in the US, too - copyright is for the
> author's life + 70 years IIRC, and the rights are given to the copyright
> holder or the rights assignee (in some cases the publication), and after
> that period lapses, the work passes into the public domain.
>
> I'm not sure what's different between the German definition you gave and
> what I know of the US system (as a copyright holder).

One major difference is that German author's rights can't be sold or 
otherwise transferred to some other person or legal body.

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clipka <ano### [at] anonymousorg> wrote:
> Am 17.04.2013 20:49, schrieb Jim Henderson:
> > I'm not sure what's different between the German definition you gave and
> > what I know of the US system (as a copyright holder).
>
> One major difference is that German author's rights can't be sold or
> otherwise transferred to some other person or legal body.

Ooh, that would NEVER fly in the USA.

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On Wed, 17 Apr 2013 21:13:47 -0400, Cousin Ricky wrote:

> Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote:
>> But Dr. King's speech was in 1963, so even 70 years from then would
>> still be 2033 if he'd died at the speech.
>>
>> So it doesn't even become an issue until 2038.
> 
> Actually, 2038 is when it /stops/ being an issue.  (Unless Congress
> extends the term again.)

Well, it's when it stops being an issue for that particular speech.

But I wouldn't hold my breath on the term not being extended again.  The 
public domain in the US is essentially dead.

Jim

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On Thu, 18 Apr 2013 04:34:57 +0200, clipka wrote:

> Am 17.04.2013 20:49, schrieb Jim Henderson:
> 
>>> IANAL, but the concept of copyright in the American sense does not
>>> exist in Germany. Instead, there is a set of author's rights
>>> ("Urheberrecht"),
>>> and the heirs do get to exercise and benefit from these until so-many
>>> years after the author's death (the duration depending on the type of
>>> work AFAIK), after which the work passes on into the public domain.
>>
>> That's pretty much the way it works in the US, too - copyright is for
>> the author's life + 70 years IIRC, and the rights are given to the
>> copyright holder or the rights assignee (in some cases the
>> publication), and after that period lapses, the work passes into the
>> public domain.
>>
>> I'm not sure what's different between the German definition you gave
>> and what I know of the US system (as a copyright holder).
> 
> One major difference is that German author's rights can't be sold or
> otherwise transferred to some other person or legal body.

That's interesting, I didn't know that.

Jim

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