I want to model a specific flower: a red "Gerberer"
(that's the german term, don't know if its called
like that in english). Want I need is some
reference photos, some suggestions on how
to model (probably Mesh) and adjust the lighting
of the flower (the pedals, if thats how the "wings" of
the flower is called, look more like scattering
transparency, how do that with mesh?).

Anyone got experience with tracing flowers in POV?


--
Tim Nikias
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights/index.html

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> like that in english). Want I need is some
> reference photos, some suggestions on how

tried google?

> to model (probably Mesh) and adjust the lighting

my best experiences with my fern model was modelling as a mesh. it is easy
to save and load in a file and renders very fast.

> of the flower (the pedals, if thats how the "wings" of
> the flower is called, look more like scattering
> transparency, how do that with mesh?).

i had the same problem on my fern. i discussed this in the p.a-u and got
some very useful hints although i finally decided not to use the scattering
thing since my PC is simply to slow for it. (old Pentium 200MHz).

The soultion was : use media in an (closed!) mesh. you could give an
interior to each triangle (although the you can't use a mesh object anymore
but single triangles). But the thing has to be CLOSED with a hollow
interior.

you could also give an interior on the mesh object. use scattering media
with some filtering and a very high density. the only problem left is: plant
leaves blur the light shining through wich can't be simulated by media. the
solution i found was to use a very wrinkled normal pattern (like bumps in a
very small scale) and give a very high IOR on the interior. this results is
a acceptable "blur". at least for objects not too close to the leaf.

> Anyone got experience with tracing flowers in POV?

yes :-)
look in p.b.i for the fern thread....

BTW: the fern was created by my set of macros which should be able to be
used for modelling many different plants. due to the lack of time it is not
even at beta stage and the only plant realised up to today is the fern (to
80%)

regards
SY

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I did look at the various fern threads, but IMHO I
don't think that the flower's pedals are near
the leaves of a fern. Conceptually, you're right,
scattering media and the like, mesh etc, but a
pedal looks totally different, I think. Also the
approach on attaching pedals to the stem
would be (on the modelling side) somewhat
different than ferns.

And I'll look at google, thanks.

Thanks for your reply!


--
Tim Nikias
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights/index.html

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Tim Nikias <tim### [at] gmxde> wrote in message
news:3C90D136.BE74358E@gmx.de...
> I want to model a specific flower: a red "Gerberer"

I found a couple pics on google. The english name would certainly provide
more, but I don't know it.

>
> Anyone got experience with tracing flowers in POV?
>

I do not have experience, but I can tell you how I would model the flower. I
am going to assume that you want to model a very detailed flower.

I would first make a 4 splines to represent the sides, top, and bottom curve
of each petal. I would then adjust the control points on each spline until I
got the shape that I wanted for these curves.

I would then make a 3 dimensional mesh using points on the four splines to
build the spline, putting at least 10 columns of vertices along the top of
each petal.

I would then find the normal of each vertex and translate the vertices along
these normals by an amount represented by a sin value. This value should be
scaled down along the edges of the petal and will give the ridges in the
petals.

My next step would be to put all of this into a macro which would change the
control points of the splines very slightly each time a petal is created so
that all will be unique.

As far as the center, I would have to see if a union of tiny objects would
be faster and close enough in quality to an isosurface distorted by a map.

Hope this helps.
 -Shay

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And this is exactly what I meant with my plant toolkit I used to model the
fern.

> I would first make a 4 splines to represent the sides, top, and bottom
curve

Similar to that you somply define an array of points defining your outline.

> I would then make a 3 dimensional mesh using points on the four splines to

Is done automatically

> I would then find the normal of each vertex and translate the vertices
along

Is done automatically, additionally it is smoothed

> scaled down along the edges of the petal and will give the ridges in the
> petals.

Winkles can be added in any frequency and amplitude including normal
interpolation and exaggregation

Additionally:

.) macros to define flexible stems (small ones for leaves, large ones for a
stem)
.) automatic alignment of the leaf-outline-mesh along it's stem
.) automatic transofmrations and flexible parameters with default values
.) saving the mesh in a file
.) adjusting textures ALONG the leaf regardless of its 3D orientations and
windings, ripples.....

and more to come.

regards
SY

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> would be (on the modelling side) somewhat
> different than ferns.

it doesn't have to do a thing with ferns. You got me wrong.
see my answer to Shay!

regards
SY

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news:3c90ec78@news.povray.org...

> <snip> my plant toolkit
> <snip> Is done automatically
> <snip> Is done automatically, additionally it is smoothed
> <snip> Winkles can be added in any frequency and amplitude including
normal
> interpolation and exaggregation
> Additionally: <snip>

> and more to come.
>

WOW!!!

 -Shay

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> WOW!!!

*g*

it sounds more enthusiastic than it really is. I just defined a generic
interface, built some macros using this interface with a clear result
interface and solved some problems which usually appear in tasks like this.
the result is a flexible set of tools one can use to build plant-meshes.
One disadvantage, tough: it is an open mesh. so no media can be used
easily.... but since I will be (propably) the only user... who cares:? *g*


regards
SY

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I can't give you hints on modelling, but I spent a little time browsing
through some seed catalogs.  They list a "gerbera," which looks identical to
the images I Googled for "gerberer"!

Hope that helps!

- Kevin R.

"Tim Nikias" <tim### [at] gmxde> wrote in message
news:3C90D136.BE74358E@gmx.de...
> I want to model a specific flower: a red "Gerberer"
> (that's the german term, don't know if its called
> like that in english). Want I need is some
> reference photos, some suggestions on how
> to model (probably Mesh) and adjust the lighting
> of the flower (the pedals, if thats how the "wings" of
> the flower is called, look more like scattering
> transparency, how do that with mesh?).
>
> Anyone got experience with tracing flowers in POV?
>
>
> --
> Tim Nikias
> Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights/index.html
>
>

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"Kevin R." wrote:

> I can't give you hints on modelling, but I spent a little time browsing
> through some seed catalogs.  They list a "gerbera," which looks identical to
> the images I Googled for "gerberer"!
>
> Hope that helps!

Well, it does help, though sadly I've found that out as well.
Thanks for your help nontheless.

Anyways, I think I'll buy some "gerbera"/"gerberer" flowers
next week or so (when I've got enough time to study them,
and when I'm more or less prepared for the modelling).

Sadly, when I looked today, there were no red ones to
be bought anywhere, so I'll probably use a different color
and use the photograph I actually did find as reference.

--
Tim Nikias
Homepage: http://www.digitaltwilight.de/no_lights/index.html

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