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From: Darren New
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 12:00:45
Message: <4da71a2d$1@news.povray.org>
On 4/14/2011 8:16, clipka wrote:
> I know none of these, so like Darren I'd personally go for Tcl;

I only mentioned Tcl because on Windows at least it's trivial to wrap up the 
Tcl code into a no-install stand-alone .exe.  I don't know how OSX handles 
what Linux calls repositories, but installing the Tcl interpreter on modern 
Linux is pretty straightforward. (Pretty straightforward on Windows once you 
track it down, too, but that's an extra step people might not want to go for 
if they just want to try your code once.)

Does OSX have something like Yum to which people submit that stuff, or is it 
more like Windows where you have to track down where the software is?

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   "Coding without comments is like
    driving without turn signals."


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From: Warp
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 12:09:50
Message: <4da71c4e@news.povray.org>
Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
> Does OSX have something like Yum to which people submit that stuff, or is it 
> more like Windows where you have to track down where the software is?

  AFAIK there's no official repository/package manager, but there's a
third-party system that does exactly that: http://www.macports.org/

  It works in the same way as the command-line versions of linux package
managers.

-- 
                                                          - Warp


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From: Darren New
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 12:17:37
Message: <4da71e21@news.povray.org>
On 4/14/2011 9:09, Warp wrote:
>    AFAIK there's no official repository/package manager, but there's a
> third-party system that does exactly that: http://www.macports.org/

Oh, I've heard of that. I've seen books about XYZ that say something about 
getting the XYZ interpreter from macports, for example.

Cool, thanks for the info!

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   "Coding without comments is like
    driving without turn signals."


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From: nemesis
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 13:13:06
Message: <4da72b22@news.povray.org>
Warp escreveu:
> nemesis <nam### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>> I fail to see the advantage of going bonkers providing multiple versions of the
>> same script to support multiple "native" scrpting environments when there are
>> multiple far better offerings than the native stuff that are both a fast and
>> free download and also multiplatform.
> 
>   You fail to see the advantage? How about you take the script and just
> run it, without having to figure out what else you need to download and
> install before you can run it.

how about clicking on a link right next to the script download instead 
of "figuring it out"?

BTW, I wonder when will OS'es finally automatically download and install 
required interpreters based on file type.  You click on a script and if 
there's no interpreter, the OS informs you of the file type and required 
interpreter and if you want it to fetch, install and then execute the 
script.  Security risk?  Not like you don't have to provide an 
administrative password to install things...

I mean, it's not like python and company are completely unfamiliar to 
desktop OSes.  They've been around for so long, how come there's no 
standardized database of known scripting languages and it's file types...

-- 
a game sig: http://tinyurl.com/d3rxz9


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From: Darren New
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 14:11:11
Message: <4da738bf$1@news.povray.org>
On 4/14/2011 10:13, nemesis wrote:
> BTW, I wonder when will OS'es finally automatically download and install
> required interpreters based on file type.

When the people distributing the commercial OS can get an *official* version 
of an interpreter and want to support it. Windows already does this, but it 
almost always comes up with "I don't know which interpreter you want", 
because if people get Ruby from Windows, they'll expect MS to support it.

It's basically the problem with closed-source commercial software - you 
don't want to take on responsibilities you're not paid for (like supporting 
arbitrary interpreters you don't own) and you can't support them anyway if 
they're closed source.

 > You click on a script and if
> there's no interpreter, the OS informs you of the file type and required
> interpreter and if you want it to fetch, install and then execute the
> script. Security risk? Not like you don't have to provide an administrative
> password to install things...

Try this. Pick an extension for an interpreter you don't have installed 
under Windows. (Like, create a xyz.rb file.) Click on it. Watch the magic of 
exactly what you're asking for.

> I mean, it's not like python and company are completely unfamiliar to
> desktop OSes. They've been around for so long, how come there's no
> standardized database of known scripting languages and it's file types...

Because nobody paid Microsoft to add Python to the list?

Heck, linux people laugh at having a central registry to map file extensions 
to mime types. Java programs have all kinds of problems running with the 
wrong JVM. With that sort of attitude, you think they'll make a global list 
of the definitive versions of an interpreter?

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   "Coding without comments is like
    driving without turn signals."


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From: Darren New
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 14:48:02
Message: <4da74162$1@news.povray.org>
On 4/14/2011 10:13, nemesis wrote:
> BTW, I wonder when will OS'es finally automatically download and install
> required interpreters based on file type.

Actually, Windows does.  Create "xxx.pl" as a file, assuming you don't have 
Perl installed. Click on it. It brings up a web page that says "Hey, this 
looks like a Perl file. Do you want to go download the Perl development 
environment?"

I wonder how much MS charges for being listed, that so many interpreters are 
*not* listed there.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   "Coding without comments is like
    driving without turn signals."


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From: nemesis
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 16:08:34
Message: <4da75442@news.povray.org>
Darren New escreveu:
> On 4/14/2011 10:13, nemesis wrote:
>> BTW, I wonder when will OS'es finally automatically download and install
>> required interpreters based on file type.
> 
> Try this. Pick an extension for an interpreter you don't have installed 
> under Windows. (Like, create a xyz.rb file.) Click on it. Watch the 
> magic of exactly what you're asking for.

then I guess problem already solved for 90% of people out there, let 
alone technical people wanting to export and render a scene with povray.

-- 
a game sig: http://tinyurl.com/d3rxz9


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From: Jaime Vives Piqueres
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 16:54:12
Message: <4da75ef4$1@news.povray.org>

> ... without having to figure out what else you need to download and
> install before you can run it.

   Yes, that was my original concern, but I'm not very inclined to learn
JScript and Applescript, to not talk about unix shell script... :)

-- 
Jaime Vives Piqueres
		
La Persistencia de la Ignorancia
http://www.ignorancia.org


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From: Jaime Vives Piqueres
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 17:22:25
Message: <4da76591$1@news.povray.org>
El 14/04/11 17:57, Darren New escribió:
> Well, as nemesis says, my intention was to suggest a simple
> cross-platform scripting language (like Tcl or Python) for the
> script, *plus* do the up-front work of wrapping it in a native
> no-install executable for each of the major platforms if you care to
>  promote usage. Distribute both the short script and the "use this if
>  you don't want to install the scripting environment" version.

   My problem with the executable option was that my script needed
editing in *all cases*, for every scene.

   But now that the apparent "simple" option of distributing a script
showed to be too complex, I've decided to do a more proper
application... nothing fancy, just a little dialog window with a few
input controls and a big button.

   But most likely I will use Java, as it seems to fill all my
requirements and expectations... and also because a close friend is
willing to help me learning to use Netbeans.

-- 
Jaime Vives Piqueres
		
La Persistencia de la Ignorancia
http://www.ignorancia.org


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From: Jaime Vives Piqueres
Subject: Re: Scripting language for multiplatform distribution?
Date: 14 Apr 2011 17:26:58
Message: <4da766a2$1@news.povray.org>

> BTW, I wonder when will OS'es finally automatically download and
> install required interpreters based on file type.

  What I wonder is why doesn't exists a standard scripting language
available on all platforms by default...


-- 
Jaime Vives Piqueres
		
La Persistencia de la Ignorancia
http://www.ignorancia.org


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