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Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospam com> wrote:
> On Wed, 05 Oct 2011 22:48:02 -0400, Cousin Ricky wrote:
> > I don't consider it spam if the advertiser pays for the ad.
>
> So those "cheap meds" messages don't count as spam? The seller does pay
> someone to send the message, after all...
I meant if the advertiser pays for the medium on which its advertising. I.e.,
Invisible gets to use FB for "free" (on the surface) because that poorly
targeted singles ad paid for it. Paying someone to use a third party's
resources without the consent of or compensation to the third party doesn't
count.
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From: Darren New
Subject: Re: "If you didn't pay for it, you're being sold."
Date: 6 Oct 2011 21:54:07
Message: <4e8e5bbf$1@news.povray.org>
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On 10/6/2011 17:59, Cousin Ricky wrote:
> I meant if the advertiser pays for the medium on which its advertising. I.e.,
I would disagree with your definition of "spam". I propose that an
advertisement is "spam" if the combination of targeting and delivery medium
causes the effort/cost required to *not* respond to the ad to be larger than
the expected (as in, "expected value" statistical idea) benefit of the ad.
That is, when disposing of the unwanted spam costs you more than you gain by
getting the occasional ad you respond to, it's spam.
--
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
How come I never get only one kudo?
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From: Le Forgeron
Subject: Re: "If you didn't pay for it, you're being sold."
Date: 7 Oct 2011 03:54:26
Message: <4e8eb032$1@news.povray.org>
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Le 06/10/2011 19:58, Jim Henderson a écrit :
> Guns are kinda necessary. GPS? Useful, but if they don't have coverage
> for some reason, it's not a deal killer. After all, having a map also is
> useful, or having local knowledge of the area.
Point taken.
But you need to train all the men to read map. Some would fails. And the
one who succeed might engage in a big no-no: reflection.
Why waste resources to train the ground men, when all they need is to
trust the technology. Easier to replace separate parts.
Remember: CCCP soldiers always travelled as a pack of three. One that
could read, one that could write and one to keep watch of these two
dangerous intellectuals.
>
>> > The point isn't that the USMC wouldn't exist without GPS. It's that GPS
>> > is valuably enough for them to pay for it, even if it didn't benefit
>> > anyone else.
> That's not what you said, though, you said it *needs* GPS to exist. It
> doesn't need it, it's just a very useful tool so they know where they are
> without resorting to other methods.
The real interest of GPS is low flying cruise missiles (well, the one
you fire about 500 miles aways from the target, from your boat or
whatever, and that play hide & seek with defense radars.)
From satellite & planes photographic analysis (on background, from the
1950 cold war), you get a very detailled map of position & elevation.
But you need a GPS in the missile to actually be able to use the
relevant data.
(and military precision of GPS is not 30m... it's 0,30 m with adequate
receivers : you need to decypher the P part, and perform dual reception
on L1 & L2 bands to compensate the random ionospheric transmission.)
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On 07/10/2011 2:54 AM, Darren New wrote:
> On 10/6/2011 17:59, Cousin Ricky wrote:
>> I meant if the advertiser pays for the medium on which its
>> advertising. I.e.,
>
> I would disagree with your definition of "spam". I propose that an
> advertisement is "spam" if the combination of targeting and delivery
> medium causes the effort/cost required to *not* respond to the ad to be
> larger than the expected (as in, "expected value" statistical idea)
> benefit of the ad. That is, when disposing of the unwanted spam costs
> you more than you gain by getting the occasional ad you respond to, it's
> spam.
>
Since I don’t buy anything in response to targeted advertising. I would
say spam is all unsolicited mail, whether it is electronic, snail mail
or just pops through your letter box.
--
Regards
Stephen
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On 07/10/2011 8:54 AM, Le_Forgeron wrote:
> Remember: CCCP soldiers always travelled as a pack of three. One that
> could read, one that could write and one to keep watch of these two
> dangerous intellectuals.
LOL
And the third one had vision so good he could always see Siberia.
--
Regards
Stephen
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> >> On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 11:12:21 +0100, Invisible wrote:
> >>
> >>> The difference is, the US military *needs* GPS to exist
> >>
Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote:
> That's not what you said, though, you said it *needs* GPS to exist. It
> doesn't need it, it's just a very useful tool so they know where they are
> without resorting to other methods.
>
You're sending a missile. You put an AI in the missile to stop and ask the
local villagers where something is?
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On 07/10/2011 12:31 PM, gregjohn wrote:
> You're sending a missile. You put an AI in the missile to stop and ask the
> local villagers where something is?
Don't be silly. You just aim for the hut marked with a big red cross...
...oh, wait.
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From: Jim Henderson
Subject: Re: "If you didn't pay for it, you're being sold."
Date: 7 Oct 2011 14:52:38
Message: <4e8f4a76$1@news.povray.org>
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On Fri, 07 Oct 2011 07:31:44 -0400, gregjohn wrote:
>> >> On Thu, 06 Oct 2011 11:12:21 +0100, Invisible wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> The difference is, the US military *needs* GPS to exist
>> >>
>> >>
> Jim Henderson <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote:
>
>> That's not what you said, though, you said it *needs* GPS to exist. It
>> doesn't need it, it's just a very useful tool so they know where they
>> are without resorting to other methods.
>>
>>
> You're sending a missile. You put an AI in the missile to stop and ask
> the local villagers where something is?
Laser guided missiles.
Jim
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From: Jim Henderson
Subject: Re: "If you didn't pay for it, you're being sold."
Date: 7 Oct 2011 14:55:25
Message: <4e8f4b1d$1@news.povray.org>
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On Fri, 07 Oct 2011 09:54:25 +0200, Le_Forgeron wrote:
> Le 06/10/2011 19:58, Jim Henderson a écrit :
>> Guns are kinda necessary. GPS? Useful, but if they don't have
>> coverage for some reason, it's not a deal killer. After all, having a
>> map also is useful, or having local knowledge of the area.
>
> Point taken.
> But you need to train all the men to read map. Some would fails. And the
> one who succeed might engage in a big no-no: reflection.
>
> Why waste resources to train the ground men, when all they need is to
> trust the technology. Easier to replace separate parts.
Unless, of course, the technology fails. Not having a backup plan is
generally not a good idea.
> Remember: CCCP soldiers always travelled as a pack of three. One that
> could read, one that could write and one to keep watch of these two
> dangerous intellectuals.
LOL
> The real interest of GPS is low flying cruise missiles (well, the one
> you fire about 500 miles aways from the target, from your boat or
> whatever, and that play hide & seek with defense radars.)
Sure, there are technologies that do depend on it. I never said there
weren't.
> From satellite & planes photographic analysis (on background, from the
> 1950 cold war), you get a very detailled map of position & elevation.
> But you need a GPS in the missile to actually be able to use the
> relevant data.
Or you need another way of getting the missile to the target. Like a
laser-guided bomb, for example - no gps there, you just have to 'paint'
the target with a laser and the missile/bomb's guidance system homes in
on that.
> (and military precision of GPS is not 30m... it's 0,30 m with adequate
> receivers : you need to decypher the P part, and perform dual reception
> on L1 & L2 bands to compensate the random ionospheric transmission.)
In reading something about GPS recently, 20m is the threshold I'd read
about for military applications. Might've been in this thread, though.
Jim
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From: Jim Henderson
Subject: Re: "If you didn't pay for it, you're being sold."
Date: 7 Oct 2011 14:55:56
Message: <4e8f4b3c$1@news.povray.org>
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On Fri, 07 Oct 2011 09:19:03 +0100, Stephen wrote:
> On 07/10/2011 2:54 AM, Darren New wrote:
>> On 10/6/2011 17:59, Cousin Ricky wrote:
>>> I meant if the advertiser pays for the medium on which its
>>> advertising. I.e.,
>>
>> I would disagree with your definition of "spam". I propose that an
>> advertisement is "spam" if the combination of targeting and delivery
>> medium causes the effort/cost required to *not* respond to the ad to be
>> larger than the expected (as in, "expected value" statistical idea)
>> benefit of the ad. That is, when disposing of the unwanted spam costs
>> you more than you gain by getting the occasional ad you respond to,
>> it's spam.
>>
> Since I don’t buy anything in response to targeted advertising. I would
> say spam is all unsolicited mail, whether it is electronic, snail mail
> or just pops through your letter box.
I would agree. I define it as "advertising I didn't ask for".
Jim
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