>> Actually, I was thinking... Our dance school really, really needs air
>> conditioning. Do you know what happens if you put 80 people in a room
>> with no windows and make them do strenuous exercise for 60 minutes? Let
>> me tell you: it gets *warm*, and most of all it gets *humid*. Not fun.
>>
>> I was thinking, we could have a dance marathon to raise money to install
>> a cooling system. Something like "you pay me X for every Y seconds of
>> dancing I manage to pull off without dropping dead". We have several
>> dances that severely tax all but the fittest dancers...
>>
>> ...yeah, I'm sure it'll never happen. Nice idea though. ;-)
>
> That works the wrong way. The worse your room is the less you can
> collect. A more logical scheme would be 'you pay me X for every dancer
> that drops dead within some fixed time'.

True. I was thinking it would have to be an outdoor event or something. 
(The school has a very large garden out back. You would need to make 
something to dance on though...)

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*

Post a reply to this message

On 21/09/2011 09:49 PM, andrel wrote:

> Correct me if I am wrong but I think relative grading is common in e.g.
> the US, Japan and Iran.

Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the US legendary for being populated 
by idiots?

(I don't have any factual evidence that this reputation is actually 
deserved, nor that it's related to the US applying relative grading...)

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*

Post a reply to this message

>>> Actually, an employer's primary concern may often be stuff that's not in
>>> the grades at all: Soft skills. Are you good at communicating with
>>> others? Are you good at motivating yourself/others? How do you perform
>>> under pressure? Are you good at cooperation (teamwork)? Are you good at
>>> competition (marketing strategies)?

>> I still think philosophy degrees are pointless. :-P
>
> But then again, I think you would not score high in any of the soft
> skills clipka mentioned ;)

Written communication? Well, I'm good enough that a random guy on the 
Internet paid me to write stuff for him.

Verbal communiation? Yeah, I'm OK, not great though.

Motivation? I have lots of that. Patience? Not so much...

Motivating others? Forget it.

Working under pressure? Pitiful.

Teamwork? I've never had the opportunity to be part of a team that 
wasn't dysfunctional.

Competition? Pitiful.

> Still, we all know there are jobs where you would excel.

Hmm, yes. Anything which doesn't involve talking to people, staying 
focused for more than five minutes, or dealing with deadlines.

Butterfly catcher? Daydream writer? Minion of the antichrist?

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*

Post a reply to this message

On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 22:09:48 +0100, Orchid XP v8 wrote:

> On 21/09/2011 02:01 PM, Mike Raiford wrote:
>> On 9/21/2011 3:16 AM, Invisible wrote:
>>
>>> No, that's "cooperation". "Competition" is where you disregard
>>> everybody else and beat them out of the way by any means possible so
>>> that you get what you want.
>>
>> But dealing with competition and exposing children to competition is a
>> way to apply being fair and just. What you describe as competition is
>> actually self-centeredness, and probably just plain antisocial. Being
>> competitive means doing your best, not to bring the other competitors
>> down.
> 
> Doing *your* best is about *yourself*. It has nothing to do with anybody
> else. It's something that everybody can strive towards, all on their
> own.

[...]

> Competition is fundamentally about "I want me to win, not you". It runs
> /against/ the idea of being fair and just.

One can compete against oneself as well.  Running around a track, trying 
to beat your own best time, for example.

> Then again, real life is unfortunately competitive from time to time,
> and children need to learn how to deal with that. (At least until we can
> find a way to eliminate it.)

Competition is itself not inherently bad.  Competition drives people to 
put out better and better products and services, for one thing.

There is such a thing as *healthy* competition.

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 22:17:43 +0100, Orchid XP v8 wrote:

> On 21/09/2011 09:49 PM, andrel wrote:
> 
>> Correct me if I am wrong but I think relative grading is common in e.g.
>> the US, Japan and Iran.
> 
> Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the US legendary for being populated
> by idiots?

*facepalm*

WHEN oh WHEN are you going to learn that making broad sweeping 
generalisations is NOT a good way to operate?

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 22:42:13 +0200, andrel wrote:

> On 21-9-2011 5:58, Jim Henderson wrote:
>> On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 00:27:48 +0200, andrel wrote:
>>
>>> Just a quick note: competitiveness is partly cultural. In some
>>> countries students compete with every other student and the percentage
>>> of students that pass is fixed. In other countries you pass if you
>>> meet a certain level.
>>
>> I think competitiveness is part of human nature.  Competition to find
>> the 'best' mate, for example - something that drives the race to
>> continue.
> 
> I do not remember to have competed with any other person for a mate. I
> mean, sure it is a competition, but an abstract one. Finding a mate is
> entering a multidimensional competition where you don't know on what
> quality you will be scored and the rules change unpredictably during the
> competition. And the same silliness applies to that mate. (I think we
> might be the only species where we have simultaneous sexual selection on
> both genders, though no doubt Gilles will know a counterexample).

I don't mean like a "gameshow" type of competition (though arguably those 
*do* exist).

But it is a competition, as you said.....

> Defending a system where your scores are compared to your fellow
> students (including your friends) and only a certain percentage pass, by
> referring to this sort of abstract competition is plain silly.

I wasn't defending the system, I was pointing out that competitiveness is 
a part of human nature, and provided one example.

> I think Andy said it better than me. The balance between encouraging
> competition or cooperation differs between countries and cultures.

Sure, it does vary from place to place, but competition is still there 
regardless of the culture or country.

The degree may well (and does) vary.

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 21:54:08 +0100, Orchid XP v8 wrote:

>>>> I think competitiveness is part of human nature.  Competition to find
>>>> the 'best' mate, for example - something that drives the race to
>>>> continue.
>>>>
>>> I would argue that it goes far beyond human nature....
>>
>> I wouldn't debate that.
> 
> More debatable is how much cooperative instincts extend beyond humans.

Not really, cooperative instincts extend well beyond humans, and can be 
seen in nature.  Cooperation is needed for reproduction in most species, 
for example.....

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 20:41:26 +0100, Stephen wrote:

> On 21/09/2011 7:54 PM, Jim Henderson wrote:
>>> http://tinyurl.com/3tdfdhy   :-P
>> :P indeed.;)
>>
>> When are you back out this way again?;)
> 
> I don't know.
> I've finished at Urenco/NEF. "My work there is done, Robin." I had a job
> set up in London with First Group/Greyhound Buses. But that fell through
> after the contract was signed. I've just had an interview with Tate &
> Lyle (also in London but the wrong side) that went well. I'm not
> inclined to wait for two hours at "Homeland Security"/Immigration for a
> while. Never can tell though.

I don't blame you.

Sorry to hear things are up in the air at the moment.  I had a lead on 
something a couple weeks ago, got some help getting the resume polished 
up, and then found out after applying that the final interviews were last 
Friday. :(

Got a very nice reference from an internal friend at a tech company for a 
lead tech writer position that's opened up there - a chance to do some 
management and work leading a team.  We may end up having to move to the 
Santa Clara area, but I *think* this position is one that would let us 
work from 'wherever' (one of the proposed team members is in Bangalore, 
so I don't think it matters much where I am on the west coast - it's 
still 11.5 hours' difference from there for half the year.

Jim

Post a reply to this message

On 22-9-2011 5:58, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 22:17:43 +0100, Orchid XP v8 wrote:
>
>> On 21/09/2011 09:49 PM, andrel wrote:
>>
>>> Correct me if I am wrong but I think relative grading is common in e.g.
>>> the US, Japan and Iran.
>>
>> Correct me if I am wrong, but isn't the US legendary for being populated
>> by idiots?
>
> *facepalm*
>
> WHEN oh WHEN are you going to learn that making broad sweeping
> generalisations is NOT a good way to operate?

I found this one rather funny.

In his defence: there was a sentence after that.

I am pretty sure that he knows that half of the regulars in this group 
are from the US. Just as that I am pretty sure that he knows that it is 
only half the US population that are idiots.


-- 
Apparently you can afford your own dictator for less than 10 cents per 
citizen per day.

Post a reply to this message

On 22-9-2011 6:00, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Sep 2011 22:42:13 +0200, andrel wrote:

>> Defending a system where your scores are compared to your fellow
>> students (including your friends) and only a certain percentage pass, by
>> referring to this sort of abstract competition is plain silly.
>
> I wasn't defending the system, I was pointing out that competitiveness is
> a part of human nature, and provided one example.

And I was just pointing out that it is a really bad example. Sort of 
like comparing apples and plants. Or more to the point, telling somebody 
that expresses surprise at the existence of apples that there is indeed 
a whole kingdom of plants. True, but not precisely to the points.

-- 
Apparently you can afford your own dictator for less than 10 cents per 
citizen per day.

Post a reply to this message