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I've been experimenting with glass and have come across some problems.
Here is part of a scene that I created using Moray and sPatch. The
texture used for both the sphere and shot glass is Glass1 from the glass
material library that comes with Moray. Whereas the sphere is normal
looking, the shot glass has all those black inconsistencies. There are
walls covering all sides of the objects, so the black is not anything
reflected or refracted. When I take away the refraction of the shot
glass, the inconsistencies disappear. How do I get rid of those
inconsistencies?
(By the way, the shot glass was created from a lathe in sPatch then
exported to Moray)
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In article <3b8c20d9@news.povray.org>, use### [at] host com says...
> refraction of the shot glass, the inconsistencies disappear.
> How do I get rid of those inconsistencies?
Most certainly this is caused by a insufficient max_trace_level in
global_settings.
Lutz
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"Paragon" <use### [at] hostcom> wrote in message news:3b8c20d9@news.povray.org...
> I've been experimenting with glass and have come
> across some problems...
> ...the shot glass has all those
> black inconsistencies. There are walls covering all sides
> of the objects, so the black is not anything reflected or
> refracted.
First off, HTML posts are frowned upon by most people round here (yes,
even in the binaries groups)...
Now to answer your question - Whilst you are right the black bits aren't
reflections of anything in your scene, they are caused by reflection... try
removing the reflection from the glass material and the black bits should
disappear...
You see, what's happening is the combination of reflection and
refraction is causing 'total internal reflection' - where the rays POV is
calculating bounce around and around inside the glass without leaving - of
course POV won't do this forever - it only calculates upto a finite amount
of reflections and if it hasn't calculated a colour within that number it
just colors the pixel black.
Fortunately you can specify how many reflections POV calculates - I
don't know how you do it in Moray, but you can add the following to top of
your .pov file :
global_setting { max_trace_level <level> }
where <level> is the number of reflections you wish it to calculate -
now the only problem is you may find that you never get rid of the black
bits completely and the higher the value for max_trace_level you pick the
longer POV will spend rendering these parts of the scene...
--
Scott Hill.
Software Engineer.
E-Mail : sco### [at] innocentcom
Pandora's Box : http://www.pandora-software.com
*Everything in this message/post is purely IMHO and no-one-else's*
Post a reply to this message
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Thank you for the reply but it seems to have not done the trick. I tried
taking away the reflection from the glass material as well as increasing the
max_trace_level but I still get the black distortions (even with very high
max_trace_levels). I have attached the files for the scene if anybody
wishes to try their hand at it.
-Paragon
"Scott Hill" <nos### [at] nospamthanks> wrote in message
news:3b8c2695@news.povray.org...
> "Paragon" <use### [at] hostcom> wrote in message
news:3b8c20d9@news.povray.org...
> > I've been experimenting with glass and have come
> > across some problems...
> > ...the shot glass has all those
> > black inconsistencies. There are walls covering all sides
> > of the objects, so the black is not anything reflected or
> > refracted.
>
> First off, HTML posts are frowned upon by most people round here (yes,
> even in the binaries groups)...
>
> Now to answer your question - Whilst you are right the black bits
aren't
> reflections of anything in your scene, they are caused by reflection...
try
> removing the reflection from the glass material and the black bits should
> disappear...
> You see, what's happening is the combination of reflection and
> refraction is causing 'total internal reflection' - where the rays POV is
> calculating bounce around and around inside the glass without leaving - of
> course POV won't do this forever - it only calculates upto a finite amount
> of reflections and if it hasn't calculated a colour within that number it
> just colors the pixel black.
> Fortunately you can specify how many reflections POV calculates - I
> don't know how you do it in Moray, but you can add the following to top of
> your .pov file :
>
> global_setting { max_trace_level <level> }
>
> where <level> is the number of reflections you wish it to calculate -
> now the only problem is you may find that you never get rid of the black
> bits completely and the higher the value for max_trace_level you pick the
> longer POV will spend rendering these parts of the scene...
> --
> Scott Hill.
> Software Engineer.
> E-Mail : sco### [at] innocentcom
> Pandora's Box : http://www.pandora-software.com
>
> *Everything in this message/post is purely IMHO and no-one-else's*
>
>
>
Post a reply to this message
Attachments:
Download 'whiskey.zip' (6 KB)
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Thank you for the reply but it seems to have not done the trick. I tried
taking away the reflection from the glass material as well as increasing the
max_trace_level but I still get the black distortions (even with very high
max_trace_levels). I have attached the files for the scene if anybody
wishes to try their hand at it.
-Paragon
"Scott Hill" <nos### [at] nospamthanks> wrote in message
news:3b8c2695@news.povray.org...
> "Paragon" <use### [at] hostcom> wrote in message
news:3b8c20d9@news.povray.org...
> > I've been experimenting with glass and have come
> > across some problems...
> > ...the shot glass has all those
> > black inconsistencies. There are walls covering all sides
> > of the objects, so the black is not anything reflected or
> > refracted.
>
> First off, HTML posts are frowned upon by most people round here (yes,
> even in the binaries groups)...
>
> Now to answer your question - Whilst you are right the black bits
aren't
> reflections of anything in your scene, they are caused by reflection...
try
> removing the reflection from the glass material and the black bits should
> disappear...
> You see, what's happening is the combination of reflection and
> refraction is causing 'total internal reflection' - where the rays POV is
> calculating bounce around and around inside the glass without leaving - of
> course POV won't do this forever - it only calculates upto a finite amount
> of reflections and if it hasn't calculated a colour within that number it
> just colors the pixel black.
> Fortunately you can specify how many reflections POV calculates - I
> don't know how you do it in Moray, but you can add the following to top of
> your .pov file :
>
> global_setting { max_trace_level <level> }
>
> where <level> is the number of reflections you wish it to calculate -
> now the only problem is you may find that you never get rid of the black
> bits completely and the higher the value for max_trace_level you pick the
> longer POV will spend rendering these parts of the scene...
> --
> Scott Hill.
> Software Engineer.
> E-Mail : sco### [at] innocentcom
> Pandora's Box : http://www.pandora-software.com
>
> *Everything in this message/post is purely IMHO and no-one-else's*
>
>
>
Post a reply to this message
Attachments:
Download 'whiskey.zip' (6 KB)
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Set the adc_bailout to 0.1 . If this is to big, try with a little bit smaller value.
Alberto.
> Paragon wrote:
>
> Thank you for the reply but it seems to have not done the trick. I tried
> taking away the reflection from the glass material as well as increasing the
> max_trace_level but I still get the black distortions (even with very high
> max_trace_levels). I have attached the files for the scene if anybody
> wishes to try their hand at it.
>
> -Paragon
>
> "Scott Hill" <nos### [at] nospamthanks> wrote in message
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Thanks, but I still get that darn black distortion. I found that setting
the diffuse level higher helps, but changes the look I want for the glass.
I guess I'll have to settle for that for now...
Paragon
"Alberto" <jac### [at] usbve> wrote in message news:3B8C6AD0.E3C920B0@usb.ve...
> Set the adc_bailout to 0.1 . If this is to big, try with a little bit
smaller value.
>
> Alberto.
>
> > Paragon wrote:
> >
> > Thank you for the reply but it seems to have not done the trick. I
tried
> > taking away the reflection from the glass material as well as increasing
the
> > max_trace_level but I still get the black distortions (even with very
high
> > max_trace_levels). I have attached the files for the scene if anybody
> > wishes to try their hand at it.
> >
> > -Paragon
> >
> > "Scott Hill" <nos### [at] nospamthanks> wrote in message
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>
> Thank you for the reply but it seems to have not done the trick. I tried
> taking away the reflection from the glass material as well as increasing the
> max_trace_level but I still get the black distortions (even with very high
> max_trace_levels). I have attached the files for the scene if anybody
> wishes to try their hand at it.
These are not "black distortions", only realistic reflections of the
empty space on the scene (thus black space). Surround all the scene with
walls and ceil and it will disappear...
--
Jaime Vives Piqueres
La Persistencia de la Ignorancia
http://www.ignorancia.org/
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"Jaime Vives Piqueres" <jai### [at] ignoranciaorg> wrote in message
news:3B8CA29C.DB03CAD8@ignorancia.org...
> >
> > Thank you for the reply but it seems to have not done the trick. I
tried
> > taking away the reflection from the glass material as well as increasing
the
> > max_trace_level but I still get the black distortions (even with very
high
> > max_trace_levels). I have attached the files for the scene if anybody
> > wishes to try their hand at it.
>
>
> These are not "black distortions", only realistic reflections of the
> empty space on the scene (thus black space). Surround all the scene with
> walls and ceil and it will disappear...
No, it is already. Said so somewhere else but this dual thread thing has
confused me as to where exactly.
But that is what it looks a lot like anyway, if not any lack of
max_trace_level.
If I could find that scene file to see if maybe the CSG has two textures, a
combined refractive one and non-refractive perhaps, then maybe it could be
figured out. Just guessing though.
Bob H.
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After playing with the scene for a bit I think I may have found somewhat of
an answer.
Some of the black came from the black background (you do have walls but not
on all sides, try "background {color <1,1,1>}". Some of the black are
artifacts from not having max_trace_level high enough (I used 100 *ulp* to
make sure there weren't any left but you can get away with lower). After
changing these any black that's left appear to come from the glass texture
itself. You have filter set to 0.7 so eventually, after moving through the
glass enough, the light fades to black. Try setting the filter value in your
glass texture higher (plus the other fixes mentioned) and the black should
eventually disappear (at least I was able to get it to). Unless you want
your glass to appear like that. As a side note, you may also want to try use
light fading in your glass to achieve the look you want for your glass. Good
luck
-tgq
Image 1 - no changes
Image 2 - change "background {color <1,1,1>}"
Image 3 - change "max_trace_level 100"
Image 4 - change "color rgbf <1.0, 1.0, 1.0, 0.9>" in Glass2
Bonus:
Image 5 - add "fade_distance 3 fade_power 1" to interior of Glass2
"Paragon" <use### [at] hostcom> wrote in message news:3b8c449c@news.povray.org...
> Thank you for the reply but it seems to have not done the trick. I tried
> taking away the reflection from the glass material as well as increasing
the
> max_trace_level but I still get the black distortions (even with very high
> max_trace_levels). I have attached the files for the scene if anybody
> wishes to try their hand at it.
>
> -Paragon
>
> "Scott Hill" <nos### [at] nospamthanks> wrote in message
> news:3b8c2695@news.povray.org...
> > "Paragon" <use### [at] hostcom> wrote in message
> news:3b8c20d9@news.povray.org...
> > > I've been experimenting with glass and have come
> > > across some problems...
> > > ...the shot glass has all
those
> > > black inconsistencies. There are walls covering all sides
> > > of the objects, so the black is not anything reflected or
> > > refracted.
> >
> > First off, HTML posts are frowned upon by most people round here
(yes,
> > even in the binaries groups)...
> >
> > Now to answer your question - Whilst you are right the black bits
> aren't
> > reflections of anything in your scene, they are caused by reflection...
> try
> > removing the reflection from the glass material and the black bits
should
> > disappear...
> > You see, what's happening is the combination of reflection and
> > refraction is causing 'total internal reflection' - where the rays POV
is
> > calculating bounce around and around inside the glass without leaving -
of
> > course POV won't do this forever - it only calculates upto a finite
amount
> > of reflections and if it hasn't calculated a colour within that number
it
> > just colors the pixel black.
> > Fortunately you can specify how many reflections POV calculates - I
> > don't know how you do it in Moray, but you can add the following to top
of
> > your .pov file :
> >
> > global_setting { max_trace_level <level> }
> >
> > where <level> is the number of reflections you wish it to
calculate -
> > now the only problem is you may find that you never get rid of the black
> > bits completely and the higher the value for max_trace_level you pick
the
> > longer POV will spend rendering these parts of the scene...
> > --
> > Scott Hill.
> > Software Engineer.
> > E-Mail : sco### [at] innocentcom
> > Pandora's Box : http://www.pandora-software.com
> >
> > *Everything in this message/post is purely IMHO and no-one-else's*
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
Post a reply to this message
Attachments:
Download 'whiskey1.jpg' (7 KB)
Download 'whiskey2.jpg' (6 KB)
Download 'whiskey3.jpg' (6 KB)
Download 'whiskey4.jpg' (7 KB)
Download 'whiskey5.jpg' (6 KB)
Preview of image 'whiskey1.jpg'
Preview of image 'whiskey2.jpg'
Preview of image 'whiskey3.jpg'
Preview of image 'whiskey4.jpg'
Preview of image 'whiskey5.jpg'
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