On 22-6-2013 19:53, Warp wrote:
> andrel <byt### [at] gmailcom> wrote:
>>> What I have found is that most people who have made the choice and avoid
>>> it as a matter of principle do not have all their facts straight. It's
>>> more akin to "knives are being used to kill people, therefore I never
>>> touch a knife and never will."
>
>> There was a large teetotaller movement in the first half of the last
>> century (and before) in the Netherlands and elsewhere. One of the
>> reasons given (e.g. by my father) was that many poor families were
>> starving because the men drank all the money. That is still a big
>> problem in many parts of the world.
>> My old boss was a teetotaller too. He lost many friends during the war
>> because of people telling too much under influence.
>
> In other words, "knives are being used to kill people, therefore I never
> touch a knife and never will."

No, simply, "I know what the consequences *can* be if I do. I do not 
want to do anything that might endanger any of my friends/family"
The problem with your point of view is that you totally fail to take 
into account that use of alcohol inhibits your ability to judge the 
situation. You assume that in every situation you can say "no I don't 
want another beer for reasons I am not going to tell you". Well, you 
can't, because it would offend your companion (and is highly suspicious 
in wartime) and because of having had those other beers before that. 
What you can say is "no, I don't drink". People get used to that and 
respect it if you give a reason, and even if you don't. In fact I seldom 
give a reason.
Note that my boss never tried to convert anybody to his point of view, 
he simply matter of fact explained why he didn't drink. Ok he did not 
serve alcohol at his parties. That was fine by me.

> It's a false dichotomy.

Nope, yours is an invalid metaphor. In fact you can even make a case 
that it should read "knives can be used to kill people, therefore I 
don't drink and I never will". I.e if you know you might be carrying a 
knife into a bar, because it is so useful for other reasons.

Perhaps if I could sing it like Niamh Parsons I might get the message 
across. [I know I probably should not have included the attachment, but 
I can't find a legal free source on the net. OTOH posts expire on this 
NG and it should not be indexed by bots. Yet, if anyone of you that is 
partial to some sentimentality sometimes, would buy this or 'the old 
simplicity' I would feel even a bit more sure that I prevented a record 
company to shoot in it's own foot].


-- 
Everytime the IT department forbids something that a researcher deems
necessary for her work there will be another hole in the firewall.

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