On Mon, 10 Oct 2011 10:44:54 +0100, Invisible wrote:

>> A more appropriate comparison is latest against latest.
> 
> I don't know how big the latest version of Windows is. I've never
> installed it. More to the point, I don't know of anybody who's using it
> yet.

Windows 7.  You might have heard of it.

And I've got it installed in a VM, as I'd mentioned before.

>>> It's still frustrating that I have to download multiple GB of data for
>>> libraries that I'm not actually going to use, just because the package
>>> dependency system isn't a little more fine-grained.
>>
>> You don't know that you're not going to use them.
> 
> That's an absurd argument.
> 
> If the PC doesn't have a sound card then I know, for a fact, that I
> don't need the sound daemon. If there are no Windows machines on the
> network then I know, for a fact, that I don't need Samba. I could go on.

Are you never ever ever ever going to install a sound card?  Put your 
machine on a Windows network?

It's a weak argument, I'll concede; it's not an absurd argument.

An absurd argument is saying that RDP isn't encrypted when every piece of 
documentation about it says that it is. ;)

>> If you want something more specialized, you can do a custom
>> roll-your-own with SUSE Studio.  No need to download anything you don't
>> want, because you build the distribution on a remote system using a web
>> browser, test it, and then download it.
> 
> Now that's what I'm talking about... That sounds actually useful.

Indeed it is.

>>> Yes. Because spending a week trying to fix something it *totally* the
>>> same as just giving up and complaining about it. Oh, wait...
>>
>> You spent a week trying to fix something that had you asked a question
>> in an online forum, you probably could've gotten an answer for in a day
>> or two.
>>
>> And then you complained that you couldn't figure it out.
>>
>> Yeah, ultimately, you gave up without asking for help.  If you'd asked
>> for help, someone probably would've been able to help you.
> 
> 1. You're assuming that it's /possible/ to fix this.

I'm basing that assumption on years of experience in troubleshooting 
Linux systems.

You're giving up and assuming it's impossible to fix it, so why bother 
even asking for help?

*That's* absurd.

> 2. You're assuming that had I asked, somebody would have actually
> bothered to reply. And that their reply would have been helpful.

Again, based on decades of experience in online forums.  Is there a 
chance of a useless answer or no answer?  Sure.  But I guarantee you you 
won't get an answer IF YOU DON'T FUCKING ASK.

>> You don't need a super expert to explain it.  You need someone with
>> more knowledge than you have to explain it.  Plenty of normal everyday
>> non- technical end users manage to use it without problems.
> 
> As I say, I can get Linux to /work/ OK. Indeed, my dad still uses it on
> a daily basis. It's just that one or two things - like getting the
> package manager to install just the packages I actually need - are
> annoyingly fiddly.

If you asked for help in understanding it, you might just learn something.

Heaven forbid *that* should happen. ;)

Jim

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