On 8/4/2011 9:57, Warp wrote:
> Darren New<dne### [at] sanrrcom>  wrote:
>> On 8/4/2011 9:22, Warp wrote:
>>>     Can you do it in a text terminal through ssh?
>
>> Why the hell would I do that?
>
>    Ah, the magic words. The always trusty answer when you can't do something.
>
>    A simple "no" would have sufficed, you know.

No, I'm serious. Why would I want to do that? Why wouldn't I just access the 
file remotely, instead of accessing the program remotely.

I can access it through an encrypted WIMP link (either VNC over ssh, or 
RDP), and I can access it through an encrypted file system link, so the 
ability to access it over a VDU just doesn't come into play, really.

Asking "can you access this powerful visual editor thru a serial port" is a 
silly question that shows just how little advantage the editor has over 
others. If I wanted to edit a spread sheet and generate HTML from it, I 
wouldn't feel the need to use a VT100 to do it. I'd copy the file locally, 
make the changes, and copy the changes back. Or I'd host the file remotely 
and I'd run the software locally. Or I'd use an encrypted channel to access 
the software remotely if that's the only place it was installed. I don't 
find using VT100 escape codes to edit spreadsheets in modern times a 
credible reason for calling an editor powerful any more than I'd say "hey, 
can your handset work on a crossbar-5 switch that doesn't support 
touchtone?" a credible reason for picking a particular phone over others.

Hence the "wtf" kind of response. :-)  I'd say the same thing if you said 
"yes, but can your text editor then serve up those pages like a web server?" 
While the answer for emacs is "yes", the answer for any normal person would 
be "why wouldn't I use a web server for that?"

>    The video might have asked that question, not me. I was just giving an
> example of why emacs has been traditionally deemed as a very powerful text
> editor in the unix world.

OK. You said "it's things like this", then pointed out a video showing off 
the customizability of emacs. VIM can do the same thing. TECO can do the 
same thing. PMate can do the same thing. Word can do the same thing (even 
without being customized). (And yes, all of those editors ran on all the 
popular OSes of their day except Word, and most were free.) Lots and lots of 
editors can be customized these days.

If you want to argue over editors that can run in a VT100 emulator (and, 
honestly, probably not on an actual VT100), then sure, there's a niche 
market for that.

But any computer beefy enough to run Emacs is going to be beefy enough to 
run a windowing system that lets you use an editor that's easier to use.

>    Are you sure you don't mean "my spreadsheet software, embedded in my
> word processor, can do that" instead of "my text editor can do that"?
> Not exactly the same thing.

Are you sure you don't mean "me elisp interpreter, embedded in my text 
editor, can do that"?

If I didn't have the ability to embed spreadsheets in Word automatically, 
then yes, I'd write a VBA or .NET macro to do that. Probably with a lot less 
code than it took to do it in elisp, given that tables are already built 
into Word. :-)

Embedding one program inside another has been around since Win3.1. It's a 
fundamental building block of the system. That's why Office is sold as a 
group. Excluding that (and its benefits) would be as nonsensical as asking 
if emacs can run without a file system underlying it.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   How come I never get only one kudo?

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