On 5/8/2011 9:06, Jim Henderson wrote:
> On Sat, 07 May 2011 23:28:15 -0700, Darren New wrote:
>
>> On 5/7/2011 19:56, Jim Henderson wrote:
>>> or not (like buy cigarettes or alcohol), having your identity verified
>>
>> No, that's my point. You only have to prove how old you are, not who you
>> are.
>
> But one's age is one property of one's self.  If your identity can't be
> verified, then how does one know the information on this 'ID' is yours
> and not somebody elses?

That's why I said "in practice"...

> I don't think it's a matter of recording it or not.

If they don't record your name or address, then the ID isn't needed to do 
what you're doing. Just proof of age. They're using the card not to identify 
you, but to determine your age. They haven't identified you if 5 seconds 
after they look at your ID they don't remember your name, any more than 
they've already identified you by looking at your face.

 > To issue a state ID,
> you have to prove who you are - without that proof, the ID is meaningless
> and the state won't issue it.

Oh, well, sure. But you don't have to prove who you are to buy alcohol. You 
only have to prove how old you are. You don't have to prove who you are to 
drive - you only have to prove you have a driver license. In practice, 
nobody is going to issue a photo ID with only your age on it and not your 
name and address, but the *law* doesn't say you have to provide ID. But if a 
state issued ID with just your picture and your birthday, you could buy beer 
with that. And other IDs can be used instead. (I can imagine, for example, a 
grocery near a college taking college ID with a photo as proof of age to buy 
beer.)

Contrast with, say, immigration control, where you actually *do* have to 
prove who you are.  Or (getting back to the original point) countries where 
the police can ask you at any time to prove your identity.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
   "Coding without comments is like
    driving without turn signals."

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