Warp wrote:
> 
>   It seemed to compile and run without problems in this Sun Ultra 5 with
> Solaris 7.

Good. Especially if you prefer Emacs and nevertheless tried to
compile it. Thank you.

Let's try not to start a flame war. I'm just trying to keep it
fair to Vi(m).

>   However, I have never understood these vi editors. They are the most
> user-unfriendly editors I have ever seen.

They're newbie-unfriendly, not user-unfriendly (just like Unix).
Vim and I are good friends.  :-)

>   - When you start emacs and give it a file to edit, it opens the file and
> lets you edit it right away, as any text editor would do. That is, you can
> write text, delete text and so on, as it's usual with a text editor.

Same with Vi(m). You can delete text right away (with the d key),
change a part of it (with the c key) and even insert some new text
(with the i key)!

Granted, the fact that it doesn't start in insert mode is confusing
the first time. Vim can start (and stay) in insert mode though.
There's even a "evim" which starts in this mode (stands for easy Vim).

>   - If you have modified the text and try to exit (if you can figure out how
> to exit, which has been made incredibly difficult by default), it asks if
> you want to save the file before exiting and gives you the easy choice of
> pressing 'y' or 'n'.

So does Vim. Vim stands for Vi Improved, for a reason.

>   - If Emacs is run under X, it automatically opens an X window with enhanced
> capabilities (because it's not anymore restricted to what a terminal can do).

gvim (GUI Vim) comes along vim. You can also start Vim and type
the ":gui" command when you're bored of your xterm.

>   However, these vi editors are just incredibly user-unfriendly. You just
> CAN'T use them right away. It's completely impossible:

That's almost true. I was lost the first time. Though, in Vim, if
you start it without a file to edit (just "vim") the text on screen
tells you how to get help and how to exit.

Vim btw has one of the best documentations around (unlike Vi).

>   - When you start it and give it a file to edit, you can't edit it right
> away. Pressing characters only give beeps, pressing enter does nothing but
> move the cursor a line down. And there's absolutely no hint about how could
> you possibly modify the text.

It depends on the characters you type. Try dG (delete till end of file).
That said, yes, you need at least to know some basics. Vim has a tutor
that teaches by practice enough commands to get around in Vi(m). It also
has a very good (and new) User Manual.

>   - Of course exiting the whole editor has been made incredibly difficult,
> even more difficult than in Emacs. Also if you somehow have manage to modify
> the text and somehow discover how to exit, it just refuses to exit.

I don't think ":q" is harder than CTRL-C CTRL-X (is that right?).
And if you modified the file, the error message explains that you have
to type ":q!" to exit and lose your changes.

>   - When run under X, it doesn't start in X mode by default. At least in the
> X mode it's easier to exit (just close the window; it even asks in a
> user-friendly way if you want to save).

See above.

-- 
 Adrien Beau - adr### [at] freefr - http://adrien.beau.free.fr
Vi has two modes. One in which it beeps, one in which it doesn't.

Post a reply to this message