Warp wrote:
>   I thought, however, that the very last scene was a bit cheap of a trick

Funny enough, if you read the discussions and reviews and such, it becomes 
clear it's not nearly the cheap trick it seems in the theater.  Again, I 
can't say much more than that without spoilers.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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---------------------------------------------------------------------------
  SPOILER WARNING
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

  (It's not a huge spoiler, mind you, but personally I hate any kinds of
spoilers so much that I want to warn even about minor ones. And this is
about the very end of the movie, so if you haven't watched the movie,
please just skip reading this.)


Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
> Warp wrote:
> >   I thought, however, that the very last scene was a bit cheap of a trick

> Funny enough, if you read the discussions and reviews and such, it becomes 
> clear it's not nearly the cheap trick it seems in the theater.  Again, I 
> can't say much more than that without spoilers.

  With "cheap trick" I don't really mean that it was *bad* per se. I just
found the very final image of the movie leaving it undecided whether that
final scene was just a dream or reality (because the movie ends just before
it becomes clear) was rather "cheap", especially after the marvelously
complex plot of the entire rest of the movie.

  Oh, and by the way: Thanks for recommending this movie (without spoilers).
Without your post I would have never figured out to go to see precisely
this movie, and it was just marvelous.

  I succeeded in going to see this movie to the theater without knowing
*anything at all* about the movie. I didn't have even the slightest idea
what the movie was about. The *only* thing I had ever seen about the movie
before actually seeing it was one movie poster, and even that just in
passing, without scrutinizing it too much.

  That's how like it. And in this case the experience was superb.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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Warp wrote:
> found the very final image of the movie leaving it undecided whether that
> final scene was just a dream or reality

But it doesn't. That's the trick. The top doesn't tell you if Cobb is dreaming.

>   Oh, and by the way: Thanks for recommending this movie (without spoilers).
> Without your post I would have never figured out to go to see precisely
> this movie, and it was just marvelous.

No problem.  I'm glad you enjoyed it.  It was very non-Hollywood, wasn't it? :-)

>   That's how like it. And in this case the experience was superb.

Yah.

Here's another hint: Avoid the Tron:Legacy previews. They give away big 
chunks of plot, to the point that I can now, from watching one trailer, 
pretty much guess the plot of the whole movie, because they were stupid and 
put in the "Luke, I am your father" line in the trailer. Foo. :-)

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> writes:

> Warp wrote:
>> found the very final image of the movie leaving it undecided whether that
>> final scene was just a dream or reality
>
> But it doesn't. That's the trick. The top doesn't tell you if Cobb is dreaming.

It's not obvious that the director realized that.<G>

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Neeum Zawan wrote:
> Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> writes:
> 
>> Warp wrote:
>>> found the very final image of the movie leaving it undecided whether that
>>> final scene was just a dream or reality
>> But it doesn't. That's the trick. The top doesn't tell you if Cobb is dreaming.
> 
> It's not obvious that the director realized that.<G>

Hmmm. I would disagree, but I don't want to spoil things here.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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-------------------------------------------------------------
  SPOILERS. Please don't read if you haven't seen the movie.
-------------------------------------------------------------



Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
> Warp wrote:
> > found the very final image of the movie leaving it undecided whether that
> > final scene was just a dream or reality

> But it doesn't. That's the trick. The top doesn't tell you if Cobb is dreaming.

  Now that you mention that, and I think about it, it was not him who put
it in the safe. So it was probably not his totem. But what does it mean that
he has it and uses it? I think my head is starting to hurt... (figuratively
speaking.)

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------------
>   SPOILERS. Please don't read if you haven't seen the movie.
> -------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>   Now that you mention that, and I think about it, it was not him who put
> it in the safe. So it was probably not his totem. But what does it mean that
> he has it and uses it? I think my head is starting to hurt... (figuratively
> speaking.)

He says earlier that it's his wife's totem. But he has adopted it as his own
since her death.

What bugs me is why Fischer doesn't recognise everybody when he wakes up and
smell a rat...

Awesome movie tho. :)

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Bill Pragnell <bil### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> [-- text/plain, encoding 8bit, charset: iso-8859-1, 21 lines --]

> Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
> > -------------------------------------------------------------
> >   SPOILERS. Please don't read if you haven't seen the movie.
> > -------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >   Now that you mention that, and I think about it, it was not him who put
> > it in the safe. So it was probably not his totem. But what does it mean that
> > he has it and uses it? I think my head is starting to hurt... (figuratively
> > speaking.)

> He says earlier that it's his wife's totem. But he has adopted it as his own
> since her death.

> What bugs me is why Fischer doesn't recognise everybody when he wakes up and
> smell a rat...

  Well, at least in real life you remember a dream only if you wake up in
the middle of it. If you wake up between dreams you won't remember.

-- 
                                                          - Warp

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Warp wrote:
> -------------------------------------------------------------
>   SPOILERS. Please don't read if you haven't seen the movie.
> -------------------------------------------------------------

MORE SPOILERS!

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>   Now that you mention that, and I think about it, it was not him who put
> it in the safe. 

He did indeed put it in the safe. That action *was* the first inception he 
did, that caused Mal to believe she was dreaming even when she woke. It was 
Mal's totem in Mal's safe.

> So it was probably not his totem. 

Exactly. It was Mal's totem, not his.

My suspicion is that the top doesn't tell Cobb whether he's dreaming. It 
tells him whether Mal's 'ghost' is nearby. Which of course can only happen 
when he's dreaming.

If you watch it again and pay attention to the right places, you'd discover 
that Cobb wears a wedding ring whenever he's sleeping and does not wear a 
ring when he's awake, and there's always a shot of his hands close up near 
the beginning of a new scene.

He also tells other people what the totem means, and lets people touch it, 
so he's clearly breaking his own rules about the totems.

-- 
Darren New, San Diego CA, USA (PST)
    Quoth the raven:
        Need S'Mores!

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Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
> Bill Pragnell <bil### [at] hotmailcom> wrote:
> > [-- text/plain, encoding 8bit, charset: iso-8859-1, 21 lines --]
>
> > Warp <war### [at] tagpovrayorg> wrote:
> > > -------------------------------------------------------------
> > >   SPOILERS. Please don't read if you haven't seen the movie.
> > > -------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > >
>   Well, at least in real life you remember a dream only if you wake up in
> the middle of it. If you wake up between dreams you won't remember.

Hmm, I didn't know that. I bet they stated that fact somewhere in the dialogue,
too. Well, that's all my big questions answered!

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