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Neeum Zawan schrieb:
> Of course, this whole minimized icon relies on the fact that I have
> no icons on my desktop. Which brings me to the next question:
>
> Why do people have icons on their desktop? I guess if you want to
> have access to some file *really* fast, it's convenient. However, if I
> go down that road, the whole desktop is full inside of one month. I've
> been doing fine with an iconless desktop for all these years now.
Simple reason: Tradition. It was the first concept how to replace the
Windows 3.1 program manager.
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> I saw a demo of a drag-and-drop idea I've been lusting after ever since.
What I really miss in Windows which was the norm on the Acorn GUI was to be
able to drag-n-drop to *save* a file from an application. Quite often I
find myself having the explorer window open of some folder deep on our
network drive and I want to save my document in there. On the Acorn you
could just click save and drag the file icon to the explorer window, but on
Windows you have to navigate in the save dialog to the folder, copy&paste
the path name into the save box, or save to the desktop and then move it in
explorer.
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>> Also, which moron decided that clicking something twice on the task
>> bar should minimize it? I never *ever* want this to happen!
>
> Actually, it's not clicking twice hat triggers this - it's clicking on
> an item that has the focus.
Well, yeah, that's what I meant.
You have a row of items, and if you happen to click the one that's
already current, Windows busts a gut trying to minimise it...
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scott wrote:
> What I really miss in Windows which was the norm on the Acorn GUI was to
> be able to drag-n-drop to *save* a file from an application. Quite
> often I find myself having the explorer window open of some folder deep
> on our network drive and I want to save my document in there. On the
> Acorn you could just click save and drag the file icon to the explorer
> window, but on Windows you have to navigate in the save dialog to the
> folder, copy&paste the path name into the save box, or save to the
> desktop and then move it in explorer.
Mmm, that would, in fact, be rather useful...
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"scott" <sco### [at] scott com> wrote:
> > I saw a demo of a drag-and-drop idea I've been lusting after ever since.
>
> What I really miss in Windows which was the norm on the Acorn GUI was to be
> able to drag-n-drop to *save* a file from an application. Quite often I
> find myself having the explorer window open of some folder deep on our
> network drive and I want to save my document in there. On the Acorn you
> could just click save and drag the file icon to the explorer window, but on
> Windows you have to navigate in the save dialog to the folder, copy&paste
> the path name into the save box, or save to the desktop and then move it in
> explorer.
You could even 'save' the file in this manner into another open application. For
example, a graph program would save a standard vector-graphics file, but if you
wanted to use the graph directly you'd just 'save' it staight into your
document processor window and it would be inserted at the caret.
In fact, RISCOS's drag-and-drop was standardized and integrated to a degree I've
not seen in any OS GUI since. Any file could be dropped into any filer
window or any application window, or onto the taskbar or the application icon
(obviously it was up to the application to deal with it sensibly - but 99% of
them did). And this was 20 years ago. :)
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> You could even 'save' the file in this manner into another open
> application. For
> example, a graph program would save a standard vector-graphics file, but
> if you
> wanted to use the graph directly you'd just 'save' it staight into your
> document processor window and it would be inserted at the caret.
Today it seems that Copy&Paste between applications has replaced this. I
use Ctrl-C Ctrl-V the whole time for moving things between applications.
> In fact, RISCOS's drag-and-drop was standardized and integrated to a
> degree I've
> not seen in any OS GUI since. Any file could be dropped into any filer
> window or any application window, or onto the taskbar or the application
> icon
> (obviously it was up to the application to deal with it sensibly - but 99%
> of
> them did). And this was 20 years ago. :)
Yeh it's a shame, there were some good ideas there.
Other things that were nice:
Using Right Mouse Button to select an item from the menu left the menu open
after doing the command. This was really useful when you wanted to select
several menu items in succession, especially if they were nested menus.
When you dragged a scroll-bar the pointer was locked to move only in the
direction of the scroll bar, this meant you couldn't "slip" off the edge the
scroll bar and lose the grip.
A window that had gained focus didn't automatically become the top-most
window. This was really useful if you are trying to type something into a
document while looking at something else. Today I find myself fiddling
about with resizing and moving windows unnecessarily so I can type while
seeing some other window.
I'm sure there are other things, I'm going to get my old A3010 from my
parents attic at xmas to see if it will fire up. I hope it does, there's
120MB of retro greatness on it :-D
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Bill Pragnell wrote:
> You could even 'save' the file in this manner into another open application. For
> example, a graph program would save a standard vector-graphics file, but if you
> wanted to use the graph directly you'd just 'save' it staight into your
> document processor window and it would be inserted at the caret.
Well, you can copy and paste data in this way under Windows. E.g., open
Excel, select a chart, copy, switch to Word, paste the chart.
You will say "that's because Excel and Word are the same product - MS
Office". But, weirdly, our specialist mass spectrometer control software
has the exact same feature. And the pasted images show up even if you
open the Word document on a PC that lacks the mass spec software...
> In fact, RISCOS's drag-and-drop was standardized and integrated to a degree I've
> not seen in any OS GUI since. Any file could be dropped into any filer
> window or any application window, or onto the taskbar or the application icon
> (obviously it was up to the application to deal with it sensibly - but 99% of
> them did). And this was 20 years ago. :)
Ah, the glory days of computing... :-)
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scott wrote:
> A window that had gained focus didn't automatically become the top-most
> window. This was really useful.
...isn't that what I said in the first place? ;-)
> I'm sure there are other things, I'm going to get my old A3010 from my
> parents attic at xmas to see if it will fire up. I hope it does,
> there's 120MB of retro greatness on it :-D
Heh. Yeah. I need to retire my A1200 at some point - it's taking up too
much space, and I hardly ever turn it on. Trouble is, all my synthesizer
patches are stored on it, and I haven't yet found a PC program that will
capture MIDI SysEx messages...
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Warp wrote:
> What really irritates me is Windows Explorer in this regard. For example,
> if I select a directory from the folder view on the left, and the directory
> contents then open on the right, if I try to scroll the file listing, it
> just scrolls the folder view on the left. And the other way around.
I would have sworn I wrote the exact same thing myself a little earlier
in this thread... ;-)
Annoying, isn't it?
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"scott" <sco### [at] scott com> wrote:
> > You could even 'save' the file in this manner into another open
> > application. For
> > example, a graph program would save a standard vector-graphics file, but
> > if you
> > wanted to use the graph directly you'd just 'save' it staight into your
> > document processor window and it would be inserted at the caret.
>
> Today it seems that Copy&Paste between applications has replaced this. I
> use Ctrl-C Ctrl-V the whole time for moving things between applications.
True. In fact, a system clipboard was something RISCOS lacked, although there
was plenty of freeware that implemented it.
> Using Right Mouse Button to select an item from the menu left the menu open
> after doing the command. This was really useful when you wanted to select
> several menu items in succession, especially if they were nested menus.
Yep, I hardly ever left-clicked on anything! That extra mouse button was
incredibly useful.
Also: opening a directory viewer with right-double-click would close the parent
directory viewer (obviously not applicable to current filer browsers!)
Similarly, right-click closing a directory viewer would open the parent.
Incredibly useful for quickly navigating directory trees.
> When you dragged a scroll-bar the pointer was locked to move only in the
> direction of the scroll bar, this meant you couldn't "slip" off the edge the
> scroll bar and lose the grip.
One of my favourites was the right-button scroll-bar dragging - if you had both
horizontal and vertical scrollbars in that window you would then be scrolling
both of them at once - 'panning' in fact.
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