On Wed, 07 Oct 2009 17:12:41 +0100, Invisible wrote:

>>> Well, I don't know. I'm not convinced that one slab of chicken breast
>>> tastes any different to another.
>> 
>> I think you just unwittingly proved Jeremy's point. :-)
>> 
>> I can believe there is a difference, but I've tasted the difference.
> 
> Well, I don't have a great sense of taste anyway, so...

I don't really either, if it comes to that.

>> That extra water?  Ice from when it's frozen, most likely.
> 
> Who said it was frozen?

Chances are it was frozen at some point along it's journey from the 
packaging plant to your local grocery store.

Jim

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On Wed, 07 Oct 2009 13:17:28 -0400, Jeremy \"UncleHoot\" Praay wrote:

> "Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message
> news:4accbce4$1@news.povray.org...
>> That extra water?  Ice from when it's frozen, most likely.
> 
> When chickens are processed in an industrial setup, they are
> mechanically eviscerated.  This leads to a large quantity of fecal
> matter ending up on the inside of the chicken.  So, to fix that, they
> are hosed and bathed in a chlorine bath for a few hours, where they also
> cool down with a whole bunch of other chickens.  As you can imagine, the
> carcasses at the bottom of the chill tank are probably pretty nasty. 
> When you smell a chicken from the store, there is an odd smell to it
> that's just not present on my chickens. I'm guessing it's the chlorine.

Probably, or a reaction with the chlorine.

> My processor eviscerates by hand, then drops them into the chill tank. 
> He doesn't get feces on the chicken to begin with.  If I had it my way,
> they would be air-chilled, but I can't get everything I want.  When I
> pick them up in the evening, they're all bagged and cold.

Where were you located again?  :-)

Jim

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"Gilles Tran" <gil### [at] agroparistechfr> wrote in message 
news:4accbcd9$1@news.povray.org...
> Organic livestock farming is indeed difficult. It's generally more work 
> and the resulting product is more expensive due to longer production 
> cycles. With true organic livestock, it is very hard to feed and treat 
> animals and get as much milk/eggs/meat as in non-organic farming. In 
> French supermarkets, prices for organic chicken are 2 to 3 times higher 
> than for "standard" chicken ("Label" and certified chickens are expensive 
> too, but less so). One solution is selling directly to customers: a 
> colleague of mine just quit his job to become an organic sheep farmer 
> (lamb meat). He advertises on local open markets and has a few dozens of 
> customers in a 30-km radius (IIRC) that he knows personally. Because there 
> is no middlemen his prices are actually attractive compared to 
> supermarkets. Of course this is for lamb and I don't know how it works in 
> poultry (and I hope he's got his business model well figured out...).
>

There is a provision in the law that allows us to sell chickens from our 
home in a similar way.  We really don't have a farm in the usual sense, just 
2.5 acres of land.  I use 1 acre for the chickens, which I put in a movable 
pen that gets dragged around the yard.  Suffice it to say that our grass in 
that part of the yard is very green.  :-)  When they get bigger, I often let 
them run around the yard in the evenings.  As a result, I believe our 
chickens are better than nearly all chickens that get the "organic" term 
stamped on them.  The only thing I do differently is that I don't feed them 
a certified organic feed.  But instead, they spend nearly their entire lives 
outdoors, eating grass and bugs, and whatever else they might want to 
sample.  That's where a "Label Rouge" type of designation would be nice.

We'd like to raise lamb, too.  From talking with friends, it only takes one 
season.  Buy them in the spring, and then they're ready in the fall. 
Unfortunately, I'd probably have to reduce the number of chickens we raise. 
We just don't have enough land for both at the same time.

Anyway, out of the 300 chickens we raised this year, we're keeping about 40 
for ourselves, many of which have already been eaten.  It works out such 
that I can raise my own chickens for free, by selling the rest.  It's not 
"profit" in the usual sense of the word, but it works for us.  It's a hobby 
that I enjoy, and my wife is enjoying it more and more as well.  I've 
estimated around 100 man-hours for this last 150 chicken batch.  That's 
probably a couple orders of magnitude higher than chickens raised in a 
conventional setting.

Mostly, I feel like I'm offering something to our community at a reasonable 
price.  If anyone balks at the price, I really don't care; they can buy 
their chicken from Walmart at the cheapest price possible.

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"Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message 
news:4acccd31$1@news.povray.org...
>
> Where were you located again?  :-)

Mid-Michigan, north of Lansing.  Saint Johns area, to be more precise.

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>> Where were you located again?  :-)
> 
> Mid-Michigan, north of Lansing.  Saint Johns area, to be more precise. 

Ooo, viral advertising. Clever...

-- 
http://blog.orphi.me.uk/
http://www.zazzle.com/MathematicalOrchid*

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On Wed, 07 Oct 2009 17:01:17 +0100, Invisible <voi### [at] devnull> wrote:

>Well, I don't know. I'm not convinced that one slab of chicken breast 
>tastes any different to another. Then again, if I cook a chicken breast, 
>I usually fry it and then dust it with pepper and paprika, so what do I 
>know?

A few years ago when I moved to an area of London that has a large
"Iranian/Iraqi" population. I started buying Halal meat including chicken. What
a difference in taste (just like the meat I remember from before battery
production) :D When you cook it you can see very little water that comes out of
the chicken. Unfortunately it is quite a poor area and the choice of meat cuts
is not very good but they are very tasty.


Well done Jeremy.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen

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On Wed, 07 Oct 2009 13:55:33 -0400, Jeremy \"UncleHoot\" Praay wrote:

> "Jim Henderson" <nos### [at] nospamcom> wrote in message
> news:4acccd31$1@news.povray.org...
>>
>> Where were you located again?  :-)
> 
> Mid-Michigan, north of Lansing.  Saint Johns area, to be more precise.

Not near enough, then, but in the same country.  If I happened to be in 
your area, I'd be interested in trying some of your chicken. :-)

Jim

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"Orchid XP v8" <voi### [at] devnull> wrote in message 
news:4accded1$1@news.povray.org...
>>> Where were you located again?  :-)
>>
>> Mid-Michigan, north of Lansing.  Saint Johns area, to be more precise.
>
> Ooo, viral advertising. Clever...
>

I don't foresee any problems with shipping meat overseas...  Do you?  ;-)

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Darren New wrote:
> It's especially apparent (to me) in the fruits and vegetables, all of 
> which taste essentially identical. Apples are cardboard here.
> 

And store bought tomatoes suck! I wont eat them raw.

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Congatulations on raising 300 birds!

We just raised 100. We don't sell the meat. We eat it :)
We sell eggs. Brown eggs.
Half of our birds end up as fried chicken.(we buy mixed hens & roosters)
I've been raising chickens off and on for 15 years. I don't let them 
run, where I live (the woods in Missouri) there are to many critters.
I have never had the chance to eat one of the hens after their laying
days are done, a racoon usaly gets them first.

A friend of mine had 40 or so Reds (I grow Bar Rocks)and she's tring to 
raise them free range style. She's down to 20.

You mention the finances of growing chickens. I never did make a big 
profit, even selling eggs for two years and counting what we would spend 
for the meat of the ones we butchered. This year we already spent over 
$600 and they are just started laying.(got 4 eggs)

  How much did you pay for your chicks? We paid $1.25 each. I'm 
seriously thinking of hatching my own. All I need is an incubator and 23 
days or so of electric. If you let a hen set on them then you have to be 
real brave and quick to get those chicks from that mother hen :O

Have Fun!

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