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Chambers wrote:
> I hope they *do*! At least, I think we should do away with paper
> currency.
Why? So that you can be an Enemy Combatant and completely dicked over
by the government without even the slightest chance of being able to
hire a lawyer after?
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?
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Darren New wrote:
> Depends how much you make, too, I guess. I'm pretty conservative with
> savings.
I'm having trouble parsing that...<G>
--
Aibohphobia: Fear of palindromes.
/\ /\ /\ /
/ \/ \ u e e n / \/ a w a z
>>>>>>mue### [at] nawaz org<<<<<<
anl
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Darren New wrote:
> Chambers wrote:
>> I hope they *do*! At least, I think we should do away with paper
>> currency.
>
> Why? So that you can be an Enemy Combatant and completely dicked over
> by the government without even the slightest chance of being able to
> hire a lawyer after?
>
No, because paper money is filthy. Have you any idea the sheer number
of germs that are transmitted with paper money? Coins are much cleaner.
Besides, one of the purposes of government is to protect property. If
they were really as malicious as you're afraid of them being, the
revolution would come.
...Chambers
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Chambers wrote:
> No, because paper money is filthy.
Well, there is that. That's why I wash my hands after handling it.
> Besides, one of the purposes of government is to protect property.
Only some governments.
> If
> they were really as malicious as you're afraid of them being, the
> revolution would come.
Sure, just like Zimbabwe, right? Or (Godwin forbid) the victims of the
Holocaust who were clearly defended by the uprising of the majority of
the people involved at the time. (I.e., history suggests you're wrong.)
You only get the revolution if enough people with power are actually
getting screwed over. If you keep it down to maybe 5% of the population,
or keep it up to 95% of the population, you don't really get a very good
revolution.
But if you want to, say, shut up anyone who suggests that the government
could be improved by getting rid of the people currently in charge,
being able to take all their money away as well as track everyone who
ever gives them any money at all, well that's certainly a bonus.
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?
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Darren New wrote:
> But if you want to, say, shut up anyone who suggests that the government
> could be improved by getting rid of the people currently in charge,
> being able to take all their money away as well as track everyone who
> ever gives them any money at all, well that's certainly a bonus.
Money is an imaginary concept anyway. Do you really think that you
physically have all the money in your bank account? It already exists
solely in the form of a number in a computer somewhere (well, ok, a
number in *several* computers, thanks to redundancy :) ), so what's the
difference between the 1% of your net worth you carry with you being
cash versus some form of electronic payment?
...Chambers
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Chambers wrote:
> Money is an imaginary concept anyway.
No it's not. It's only fiat money that's imaginary.
> Do you really think that you
> physically have all the money in your bank account?
No. Indeed, I don't even have the "money" that's in my wallet in the
terms of green pieces of paper.
> so what's the
> difference between the 1% of your net worth you carry with you being
> cash versus some form of electronic payment?
That I can actually have as much of my net worth I want in the form of
anonymous untraceable bits of paper I can use to buy stuff with?
Say you're the wife of an abusive police officer. Wouldn't it be nice to
be able to hire a cab and buy a bus ticket without your abusive
homicidal husband being able to ask the bank where it is you're hiding?
--
Darren New / San Diego, CA, USA (PST)
Ever notice how people in a zombie movie never already know how to
kill zombies? Ask 100 random people in America how to kill someone
who has reanimated from the dead in a secret viral weapons lab,
and how many do you think already know you need a head-shot?
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Chambers wrote:
> number in *several* computers, thanks to redundancy :) ), so what's the
> difference between the 1% of your net worth you carry with you being
> cash versus some form of electronic payment?
>
The differences are several I think.
There is not what amounts to a tax on commerce going straight into
financial institution coffers, if two people use cash as an interface.
There is with electronic, and if all money were electronic this would
amount to a tax from the 'bank' on all existing commerce. Further,
there would be little cost to adding tax apon tax apon tax. Tax money
for everybody with influence. Whoopee if you're one of them.
But if you are of the underclass, the demi-monde. You bear the burden.
Also, if you have little access to the establishment, if you are 'other'
and deemed undesireable, and cannot access the official mediums for
money exchange, without cash the sanctions against you would be even
more severe. With the availability of currency, those forced to inhabit
this shadow world could carry %100 of their 'net worth' as cash.
With solely electronic money, the ability for those in power to monitor
people is enhanced tremendously as was already mentioned, and along with
such control comes the ability to sanction others.
Now, there will always be a blackmarket and barter will always be used
to circumvent this because such a homogeous world as is implicit in the
vision of a cashless world can never exist.
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St. wrote:
> "Mueen Nawaz" <m.n### [at] ieeeorg> wrote in message
> news:489b20cd$1@news.povray.org...
>
>> I now try to use the CC for online-only transactions. There was a long
>> while where I just kept it at home. I try to pay whatever I can in cash
>> now. Not to save money, but I got wary of various companies knowing my
>> shopping habits.
>
>
> That's exactly what I do. I hope they never get rid of cash, to me, it's
> the most important thing in life, (as far as paying something goes). I
> wouldn't feel safe if there wasn't any hard cash to use.
>
>> Paranoia, as Sabrina said.
>
> Yes, that's it.
>
> ~Steve~
>
>
I hope neither of you are using those 'customer benefit' cards that
everyone hands out. Or, at the least, carry 8 of them for the same store
with different invalid addresses under fake names.
And I wonder why my key chain gets heavy . . .
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Darren New wrote:
> Phil Cook wrote:
>> Same thing with the majority of utility bills - the invoice comes
>> through and the payment drawn a few days later.
>
> While handy, it hasn't been available in the USA long enough for me to
> trust it to work reliably. :-) It only took them about 5 or 10 years
> before direct deposit failed to suck. No way am I letting them take it
> *out* without my interaction.
>
I have to agree. Besides, I find it much simpler to know that you always
have to manage that withdrawal of money at a certain time, rather then
remembering to do it the one time you charge too much. And the late fees
on a credit card are normally much kinder then the overdraft fees from
the bank.
The only time I've seen automated utility payment done right, was when
it automatically billed a credit card. Cash back bonus, ding the utility
company for the service fee, and have that extra month to pay it.
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On Sat, 09 Aug 2008 14:21:25 -0700, Darren New <dne### [at] sanrrcom> wrote:
>
>Say you're the wife of an abusive police officer. Wouldn't it be nice to
>be able to hire a cab and buy a bus ticket without your abusive
>homicidal husband being able to ask the bank where it is you're hiding?
There is also "skimming" to take into account.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skimming_%28credit_card_fraud%29#Skimming
Cash is anonymous and safe to use. Also it is quicker to get the transaction
through a till if the shop is using a dial up connection.
--
Regards
Stephen
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