On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 16:29:05 +0200, Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmxde>
wrote:
> There still is a link on the povray site to
>
> https://secure.povray.org/products/posters/
>
> although it does not work any more.

Moreover entering above url I get 'The security certificate has expired or is
not yet valid' which is understable in freeware community thought a little bit
surprised when connected with dream of verisign man ;-)

ABX

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ABX wrote:
> 
> Moreover entering above url I get 'The security certificate has expired or is
> not yet valid' which is understable in freeware community thought a little bit
> surprised when connected with dream of verisign man ;-)

I get:

Sorry, this ordering page has been taken off-line.

Christoph

-- 
POV-Ray tutorials, include files, Sim-POV,
HCR-Edit and more: http://www.tu-bs.de/~y0013390/
Last updated 17 Jun. 2003 _____./\/^>_*_<^\/\.______

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On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 16:45:25 +0200, Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmxde>
wrote:
> > Moreover entering above url I get 'The security certificate has expired or is
> > not yet valid' which is understable in freeware community thought a little bit
> > surprised when connected with dream of verisign man ;-)
>
> I get:
>
> Sorry, this ordering page has been taken off-line.

You are talking about text in html syntax while I'm talking about establishing
secure communication between web browser and web server 'far' before downloading
page content.

ABX

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3F004931.2477E6E1@gmx.de...

> although it does not work any more.  I had already strongly considered
> buying one or two of them but i'm somewhat reluctant now if all but the
> usual low percentage goes to zazzle.

Yes, this deserves an explanation.
The plan was initially to have the poster printed and sold directly like the
keyrings and the IRTC CDs. The poster would have been printed in advance in
sufficient numbers to get a good price. However, after a few weeks of having
the order page online and failing to generate even the tiniest sparkle of
interest outside the POV-Ray/IRTC community and, more important, actual
orders, there were too many doubts about being able to cover the printing
costs, let alone turn up a profit for the server maintenance, so the
printing had to be cancelled.
Putting the poster up at Zazzle was a backup plan, less satisfying perhaps
as a 3rd party is getting most of the benefits. IMHO, this has fortunately
some advantages : there is now a larger range of products and possibly
people not knowing POV-Ray will be more inclined to buy from a "real" shop.
Also, Zazzle will feature the poster once in a while and it will probably
show up on the front page this week.

G.

--

**********************
http://www.oyonale.com
**********************
- Graphic experiments
- POV-Ray and Poser computer images
- Posters

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Gilles Tran wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
> Yes, this deserves an explanation.
> The plan was initially to have the poster printed and sold directly like the
> keyrings and the IRTC CDs. The poster would have been printed in advance in
> sufficient numbers to get a good price. However, after a few weeks of having
> the order page online and failing to generate even the tiniest sparkle of
> interest outside the POV-Ray/IRTC community and, more important, actual
> orders, there were too many doubts about being able to cover the printing
> costs, let alone turn up a profit for the server maintenance, so the
> printing had to be cancelled.

That's sad to hear.

I can't say much about the reason for the lack of orders for the poster
(apart from maybe the possibility to order was not displayed prominently
enough) but i think the whole thing should have been (or still be)
advertised more intensely.  You or the POV-Team should send notes to major
news-sites on the web as well as newspapers and Magazines with related
coverage.  People there of course also do their own research but it is not
exactly easy to find and to identify as an interesting news item.  The
problem is of course also that this is not actually a very new information
since the picture was generated more than a year ago but a lot of
newspapers and magazines i read from time to time have sections where this
would fit well.  And once coverage has started somewhere it is much more
likely to spread...

Christoph

-- 
POV-Ray tutorials, include files, Sim-POV,
HCR-Edit and more: http://www.tu-bs.de/~y0013390/
Last updated 17 Jun. 2003 _____./\/^>_*_<^\/\.______

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3F00602A.F334B0F3@gmx.de...

> I can't say much about the reason for the lack of orders for the poster
> (apart from maybe the possibility to order was not displayed prominently
> enough) but i think the whole thing should have been (or still be)
> advertised more intensely.

Well, we sent messages and press releases to several web sites and forums
(computer graphics, magazines, slashdot etc.). We got at best a few nice
comments, but often it wasn't acknowledged at all. I sent it to a website
specialised in art in space, for instance, and got no reply... The folks at
DAZ3D (who made the kid model) didn't want to carry the story because they
thought that the "making of" was too critical of the model! After a couple
of weeks of trying to get this story getting known without much results I
personally called it quits. We certainly hoped it would snowball somehow but
that didn't happen.
I think now that while the rendering-in-space story makes sense for POV-Ray
users, it's too abstract for those who don't know about computer graphics so
the pic is just an image among many others ; for those who know CG (but
don't care about POV-Ray) the image itself isn't good enough to be noticed,


G.


--

**********************
http://www.oyonale.com
**********************
- Graphic experiments
- POV-Ray and Poser computer images
- Posters

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"ABX" <abx### [at] abxartpl> wrote in message
news:6pj0gvsmf4d8rcdnidud73ctdg8e0smmsm@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 16:45:25 +0200, Christoph Hormann
<chr### [at] gmxde>
> wrote:
> > > Moreover entering above url I get 'The security certificate has
expired or is
> > > not yet valid' which is understable in freeware community
thought a little bit
> > > surprised when connected with dream of verisign man ;-)
> >
> > I get:
> >
> > Sorry, this ordering page has been taken off-line.
>
> You are talking about text in html syntax while I'm talking about
establishing
> secure communication between web browser and web server 'far' before
downloading
> page content.

   I got it too. Weird, I've never seen that before.

    ~Steve~


>
> ABX

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Gilles Tran wrote:
> 
> Well, we sent messages and press releases to several web sites and forums
> (computer graphics, magazines, slashdot etc.). We got at best a few nice
> comments, but often it wasn't acknowledged at all. I sent it to a website
> specialised in art in space, for instance, and got no reply... The folks at
> DAZ3D (who made the kid model) didn't want to carry the story because they
> thought that the "making of" was too critical of the model! After a couple
> of weeks of trying to get this story getting known without much results I
> personally called it quits. We certainly hoped it would snowball somehow but
> that didn't happen.
> I think now that while the rendering-in-space story makes sense for POV-Ray
> users, it's too abstract for those who don't know about computer graphics so
> the pic is just an image among many others ; for those who know CG (but
> don't care about POV-Ray) the image itself isn't good enough to be noticed,


That's bad.  An area where i would have imagined a chance would be the
'use of open source software in space' but apart from other things i guess
POV-Ray is not popular enough in the OSS-Community.  

I could even imagine the picture is too artistic for a lot of people. 
Something more CGish could have earned more appreciation from people
interested in the computer/space exploration field.  I don't really agree
that the objective quality of the scene makes much of a point here but i
suppose the connection between the picture and the 'story' is too subtle
(which i consider as a very nice aspect) to be noticed at the first
glance, without reading the text.

Christoph

-- 
POV-Ray tutorials, include files, Sim-POV,
HCR-Edit and more: http://www.tu-bs.de/~y0013390/
Last updated 17 Jun. 2003 _____./\/^>_*_<^\/\.______

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"ABX" <abx### [at] abxartpl> wrote in message
news:6pj0gvsmf4d8rcdnidud73ctdg8e0smmsm@4ax.com...
> On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 16:45:25 +0200, Christoph Hormann <chr### [at] gmxde>
> wrote:
> > > Moreover entering above url I get 'The security certificate has expired or is
> > > not yet valid' which is understable in freeware community thought a little bit
> > > surprised when connected with dream of verisign man ;-)
> >
> > I get:
> >
> > Sorry, this ordering page has been taken off-line.
>
> You are talking about text in html syntax while I'm talking about establishing
> secure communication between web browser and web server 'far' before downloading
> page content.

Both of those issues were fixed within a few hours ; the ordering page now redirects
to zazzle, and a new security certificate was purchased (the old one expired a few
days ago).

-- Chris

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"Christoph Hormann" <chr### [at] gmxde> wrote in message
news:3F004931.2477E6E1@gmx.de...

> buying one or two of them but i'm somewhat reluctant now if all but the
> usual low percentage goes to zazzle.

Special Collection posters that are exclusive to zazzle get a slightly better deal,
plus if the purchase is made via our referral link we get a bit more as well. So if
you pass the URL onto anyone, please use this one

http://www.zazzle.com/link.asp?associate_id=238053896919430575&redirect=collection&collection_id=238318759821196030

or (as a shorter one that's functionally equivalent)

  http://www.povray.org/zazzlecollection/

rather than a direct link to the collection page.

-- Chris

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