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1) Yes, perhaps the best answer is a style sheet.
2) Yes, thanks for the reminder that frames are no-no for some users. The
navigation would be added at the end.
3) width, height: What is the consequence of leaving this out? I didn't
mean to forbid it, but what is the NEED?
4) <blockquote> is just my preference for having the page have a margin
and more readable. No harm to anyone, I believe, if you are missing a
</blockquote>
5) <p>Don't take this too literally as to where and when to post these.
6) Yes, alt tags are cool. I didn't mean to forbid them.
7) <head> </head> Yeah, this is good practice.
8) <h1> Well, this is often so big as to be distracting, and I was thinking
of using <h2> somewhere else or for navigation, etc.
Do I actually know _how_ to do a style sheet? Never read that chapter of
html for dummies.
I _do_ want:
a) an extremely rigid and consistent way of linking to your images and
embedded files (there could be tons of files uploaded).
b) generally a consistent look.
c) some keywords so that we can set up easier way for users to access tuts
(instead of inferring content from title).
d) an email address in there so I can keep the files and your "identity"
straight.
Mike Williams wrote:
> Wasn't it Greg M. Johnson who wrote:
> >I'm proposing the following required format for the 10Best Cd
> >collection.
> >It can be of any length with any number of include files or what have
> >you . But it should be one html zipped together with text files and
> >JPG's per "submission."
> >Each file should follow the following format for use of included html
> >code, included longer files, headings, and for reference to JPG's. I'll
> >make up a web page to explain this in greater detail. But any
> >objections to this so far?
>
> It looks severely bland. How about providing a pretty cascading style
> sheet, and we'll all link to it by putting a link to it, like
> <link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="pretty.css"></head>
> and perhaps having a background image or background colour that we'd all
> use.
>
> I notice that there's no navigation specified here. Are you planning on
> having all the navigation in a separate frame (and remembering that
> POVRay runs on some machines that don't have frame-capable browsers) or
> are you expecting the users to make extensive use of the BACK button?
>
> --
> Mike Williams
> Gentleman of Leisure
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On 7 Sep 2000 16:09:26 -0400, Ron Parker wrote:
>On Thu, 7 Sep 2000 20:13:32 +0200, Peter J. Holzer wrote:
>>
>>>The image that made this sphere is here:
>>><br>
>>><img src="gmjimage01.jpg">
>>
>>The alt tag is missing.
>
>As are the width and height tags.
They are optional, and not that important on a CD (but quite important
on the web, at least for netscape users). The alt tag is mandatory in
HTML, though you could argue that nobody will use to text browser to
view a CD full of images :-)
hp
--
_ | Peter J. Holzer | Nicht an Tueren mangelt es,
|_|_) | Sysadmin WSR | sondern an der Einrichtung (aka Content).
| | | hjp### [at] wsr acat | -- Ale### [at] univieacat
__/ | http://www.hjp.at/ | zum Thema Portale in at.linux
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"Greg M. Johnson" wrote:
> 1) Yes, perhaps the best answer is a style sheet.
> 2) Yes, thanks for the reminder that frames are no-no for some users. The
> navigation would be added at the end.
> 3) width, height: What is the consequence of leaving this out? I didn't
> mean to forbid it, but what is the NEED?
> 4) <blockquote> is just my preference for having the page have a margin
> and more readable. No harm to anyone, I believe, if you are missing a
> </blockquote>
> 5) <p>Don't take this too literally as to where and when to post these.
> 6) Yes, alt tags are cool. I didn't mean to forbid them.
> 7) <head> </head> Yeah, this is good practice.
> 8) <h1> Well, this is often so big as to be distracting, and I was thinking
> of using <h2> somewhere else or for navigation, etc.
>
> Do I actually know _how_ to do a style sheet? Never read that chapter of
> html for dummies.
1) Yes.
2) Yes. no frames, please. Or rather, make them optional. Javadoc output from
JDK 1.2+ is a good example to go with
3) The browser will need to wait for the asset to get loaded before it will lay
out the page.
4) BAD BAD EVIL HACK..
:-)
Very bad in some circumstances. Just asking for trouble.
5) <P>...</P> should be used. Since HTML 2.0 the P tag changed from a marker to
a container.
6) Oooooh. yes. Alt please.
7) Yes.
8) BBZZZZZZZZZZZTTTTTT!!! wrong answer again!
:-)
Seriously, mark up what you mean. How it looks changes on almost all systems.
Just remember WYSIWYG is not WYSIWOG.
"what you see is what you get" is not "what you see is what _others_ get"
That's the tricky thing on HTML.
best advice: read stuff at the WDG
http://www.htmlhelp.org/
Send me email for the stylesheet help, etc.
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Wasn't it Greg M. Johnson who wrote:
>Do I actually know _how_ to do a style sheet? Never read that chapter of
>html for dummies.
It doesn't need to be very complicated. Something like this might be a
start:-
BODY { font-family: Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;
margin-left: 50px;
margin-right: 50px;
}
H3 { font-family: Tahoma,"Ariel Black",sans-serif;
color: #FF2222;
background-color: #FFFF00;
text-align: center;
}
A { font-weight: bold }
CODE { color: #0000AA;
font-size: 12pt;
}
If you save that as "pretty.css" and replace the <blockquote> in your
original example with something like:-
<link rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" href="pretty.css">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#BBFFBB">
I suggest putting the margin settings into the BODY style, so that you
don't pick up any unwanted side effects that come with BLOCKQUOTE (e.g.
some browsers use italics for blockquotes).
The syntax of the css file should be reasonably obvious to somebody who
is used to handling POV script. A statement like
H3 { color: #FF2222; }
applies the specified text colour to everything within <h3> - </h3>
tags.
Distances can be specified in various units such as pixels (px), points
(pt), picas (pc), millimetres (mm), inches (in), or a percentage of what
the size would otherwise have been (%).
The FONT-FAMILY parameter has the special property that a series of
fonts can be specified. If the first font family is present in the
target environment, then that's what is used. If that font family is not
present, then the next one is used, etc. There are five magic "generic"
font names (serif, sans-serif, cursive, fantasy, monospace) that will
always be available, so it's a good idea to have one of those magic
words at the end of the parameter list.
It's also possible to define your own classes. Suppose we wanted any
glossary information in the tutorials to be distinctive, we could define
our own class of paragraph, and add
P.GLOSSARY { border: 2px solid; /* draw a box round it */
background-color: #44FF44;
}
to the style sheet, and place all the glossary text within
<p class="glossary"> - </p> tags.
--
Mike Williams
Gentleman of Leisure
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From: Warp
Subject: Re: Proposed tutorial format (hope this is in plain text).
Date: 9 Sep 2000 15:57:05
Message: <39ba9611@news.povray.org>
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Peter J. Holzer <hjp### [at] sikituwsracat> wrote:
: The alt tag is mandatory in
: HTML, though you could argue that nobody will use to text browser to
: view a CD full of images :-)
The alt-tag doesn't only work for formatting better in text browsers,
but it can only be used for a kind-of tooltip (at least in the most recent
versions of graphical browsers, I think).
It should be noted that it's not just enough to add alt-tags, it has to
be done well (specially when making a page for text browsers).
For example if you make this:
This <img src="image.jpg" alt="Povray image"> is a Povray image.
you'll get this when watching it with a text browser:
This Povray image is a Povray image.
The correct way of doing it would be something like this:
This <a href="image.jpg"><img src="image.jpg" alt="[IMAGE]" border=0></a>
is a Povray image.
Also the correct alt-tag for non-essential decorations (which do not
contribute to the text) is: alt=""
--
main(i,_){for(_?--i,main(i+2,"FhhQHFIJD|FQTITFN]zRFHhhTBFHhhTBFysdB"[i]
):_;i&&_>1;printf("%s",_-70?_&1?"[]":" ":(_=0,"\n")),_/=2);} /*- Warp -*/
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Warp wrote:
> The correct way of doing it would be something like this:
>
> This <a href="image.jpg"><img src="image.jpg" alt="[IMAGE]" border=0></a>
> is a Povray image.
I'd have to say that it could probably be done a little better. Perhaps
something like:
This <a href="image.jpg"><img src="image.jpg" alt="[Rendering of a Sunset]"
border=0></a>
is a Povray image.
Which would give:
This [Rendering of a Sunset] is a Povray image.
I find the 'alt="IMAGE"' a fairly poor solution, especially as many browsers
using them would indicate that it was an image anyway.
> Also the correct alt-tag for non-essential decorations (which do not
> contribute to the text) is: alt=""
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On 9 Sep 2000 15:57:05 -0400, Warp wrote:
>Peter J. Holzer <hjp### [at] sikituwsracat> wrote:
>: The alt tag is mandatory in
>: HTML, though you could argue that nobody will use to text browser to
>: view a CD full of images :-)
>
> The alt-tag doesn't only work for formatting better in text browsers,
>but it can only be used for a kind-of tooltip (at least in the most recent
>versions of graphical browsers, I think).
Yes. Some graphical browsers (Netscape >= 4.0, maybe IE) show the alt
text in a tool tip. I find this behaviour seriously annoying.
> The correct way of doing it would be something like this:
>
>
>This <a href="image.jpg"><img src="image.jpg" alt="[IMAGE]" border=0></a>
>is a Povray image.
Are there any text browsers which need the extra link? After all the URL
is already embedded in the <img> tag and it is up to the browser to
enable the user to identify, retrieve and possibly display the image.
Lynx and w3m both do this.
Also "[IMAGE]" isn't very descriptive, as somebody alse noted already.
> Also the correct alt-tag for non-essential decorations (which do not
>contribute to the text) is: alt=""
Right.
hp
--
_ | Peter J. Holzer | Nicht an Tueren mangelt es,
|_|_) | Sysadmin WSR | sondern an der Einrichtung (aka Content).
| | | hjp### [at] wsracat | -- Ale### [at] univieacat
__/ | http://www.hjp.at/ | zum Thema Portale in at.linux
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From: Warp
Subject: Re: Proposed tutorial format (hope this is in plain text).
Date: 11 Sep 2000 08:45:36
Message: <39bcd3f0@news.povray.org>
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Peter J. Holzer <hjp### [at] sikituwsracat> wrote:
: Are there any text browsers which need the extra link?
Unfortunately lynx needs it (I haven't tested the latest version, though).
Other text borwsers, such as w3m don't need it.
: Also "[IMAGE]" isn't very descriptive, as somebody alse noted already.
You are right (and he). The idea was that if you need some kind of "anchor"
that shows where the image is, it should be different from the surrounding
text.
Exception: If the image itself is text that should be among the regular
text (the image could be some weird font, a logo or whatever) then the
alt-tag should be regular text as well.
Eg:
This <img src="latexlogo.gif" alt="LaTeX"> tutorial is great.
--
main(i,_){for(_?--i,main(i+2,"FhhQHFIJD|FQTITFN]zRFHhhTBFHhhTBFysdB"[i]
):_;i&&_>1;printf("%s",_-70?_&1?"[]":" ":(_=0,"\n")),_/=2);} /*- Warp -*/
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On 11 Sep 2000 08:45:36 -0400, Warp wrote:
>Peter J. Holzer <hjp### [at] sikituwsracat> wrote:
>: Are there any text browsers which need the extra link?
>
> Unfortunately lynx needs it (I haven't tested the latest version, though).
You can toggle "show inline images as links" with "*". Don't know if
this is a new feature.
hp
--
_ | Peter J. Holzer | Nicht an Tueren mangelt es,
|_|_) | Sysadmin WSR | sondern an der Einrichtung (aka Content).
| | | hjp### [at] wsracat | -- Ale### [at] univieacat
__/ | http://www.hjp.at/ | zum Thema Portale in at.linux
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"Peter J. Holzer" wrote:
> On 11 Sep 2000 08:45:36 -0400, Warp wrote:
> >Peter J. Holzer <hjp### [at] sikituwsracat> wrote:
> >: Are there any text browsers which need the extra link?
> >
> > Unfortunately lynx needs it (I haven't tested the latest version, though).
>
> You can toggle "show inline images as links" with "*". Don't know if
> this is a new feature.
>
> hp
It's been in there for a few years. It was around back before the Asian economy
collapsed.
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