Maybe I'm mistaken but I happened to think about this and it occured
to me that someone was asking about using renders in a text book here
or somewhere quite a long while ago, half year give or take a few
months perhaps?  I would say I'm imagining it but I don't think so.

Bob

Gautam N. Lad <vnl### [at] mynacom> wrote in message
news:37eed7b2@news.povray.org...
> Hi,
> I bought a text-book for one of my college courses, and
lo-and-behold, one
> of my renderings (Grade One), was in the book.  I was so surprised
and
> happy,
> considering it was the only non-winning image among other IRTC
> winners/runner ups.
>
> The book is called: Computers:
> Tools for an Information Age 6th Edition by H.L. Capron
> ISBN: 0-201-61211-9
> http://www.prenhall.com/capron
>
> Problem is, I was never told that my image would be appearing in the
book.
> Is this somehow breaking one of the IRTC rules or violating my
copyrights?
> All the files
> included for the submission included a statement from  me regarding
> permission of image/file, usage.
> I have written on my homepage's gallery and in the IRTC files (.POV,
.TXT,
> etc.) that if
> you wish to use the image, you must first contact me to get my
permission.
>
> Some of the images included in the book are (from the IRTC):
>
> - Roger, Gary and Bob by Jeane-Marie Haerens and Fabien Mosen
> - Untitled (image of Ice Cream Cone) by Nathan O'Brien (
> - Gomusic by Gena Obukhov (not sure if this is from IRTC)
> - Toco Toucan by Ian and Ethel MacKay
> - Pocketwatch by Kevin Odhner
> - Untitled (bucket of Sea Shells) by Steve Gowers (Summer theme)
> - Untitled (ship image) by Nathan O'Brien (Elements theme)
> - Grade One by Gautam Lad
> - Untitled (plane image) by Ian Armstrong (Flight theme)
> - Admiral Watch by Adrian Baumann
> - Ode to Prianesi by Nathan O'Brien
>
> My question to these artists: Did you receive any notice from the
> publisher/author? If not,
> do you think they violated your copyrights by using the image
without your
> permission?
>
> Also, I don't plan on taking any legal action or anything; it's just
that
> I'd like to know (in advance)
> where my work is being used.
>
>
> Thanks!
> Bye!
>
> --
> Gautam N. Lad
> ICQ #: 7196672
>
>
>

Post a reply to this message

On the one hand, I would have been honored to make it to print.
On the other hand, is there a way to make it more clear the uses we would
allow of our artwork.

Suppose we both:
A) Affirm the "I agree with the standard IRTC copyright" agreement each time,
     AND
B) Put "Copyright Joe Raytracer. 1999 All rights reserved."

Thus, it would be quite difficult to sue IRTC given A), but any other user
would have to explain why they used our image containing B).

Gautam N. Lad wrote:

> Hi,
> I bought a text-book for one of my college courses, and lo-and-behold, one
> of my renderings (Grade One), was in the book.  I was so surprised and
> happy,
> considering it was the only non-winning image among other IRTC
> winners/runner ups.
>
> The book is called: Computers:
> Tools for an Information Age 6th Edition by H.L. Capron
> ISBN: 0-201-61211-9
> http://www.prenhall.com/capron
>
> Problem is, I was never told that my image would be appearing in the book.
> Is this somehow breaking one of the IRTC rules or violating my copyrights?
> All the files
> included for the submission included a statement from  me regarding
> permission of image/file, usage.
> I have written on my homepage's gallery and in the IRTC files (.POV, .TXT,
> etc.) that if
> you wish to use the image, you must first contact me to get my permission.
>
> Some of the images included in the book are (from the IRTC):
>
> - Roger, Gary and Bob by Jeane-Marie Haerens and Fabien Mosen
> - Untitled (image of Ice Cream Cone) by Nathan O'Brien (
> - Gomusic by Gena Obukhov (not sure if this is from IRTC)
> - Toco Toucan by Ian and Ethel MacKay
> - Pocketwatch by Kevin Odhner
> - Untitled (bucket of Sea Shells) by Steve Gowers (Summer theme)
> - Untitled (ship image) by Nathan O'Brien (Elements theme)
> - Grade One by Gautam Lad
> - Untitled (plane image) by Ian Armstrong (Flight theme)
> - Admiral Watch by Adrian Baumann
> - Ode to Prianesi by Nathan O'Brien
>
> My question to these artists: Did you receive any notice from the
> publisher/author? If not,
> do you think they violated your copyrights by using the image without your
> permission?
>
> Also, I don't plan on taking any legal action or anything; it's just that
> I'd like to know (in advance)
> where my work is being used.
>
> Thanks!
> Bye!
>
> --
> Gautam N. Lad
> ICQ #: 7196672

Post a reply to this message

>Of course, chances are they'll ignore you, in which case sueing in court
might
>not really be an option but nailing them to a virtual wall on the internet
(by
>all sorts of ways) is! I think they're are a lot of people who'll support
you
>then.


Count me in. I'll help all I can. =)

Post a reply to this message

> The problem is that it seems that some images comes from non-US people
> (Nathan O'Brien, myself,...), and while it is clear that they did
> something
> wrong, suing them from here is not an easy matter.

Are any of the images by people in the US?  I find it interesting that whenever
any of these things comes up, I'm not one of the artists being ripped off.

I don't think anyone should make excuses for this publisher.  What they did is
blatent copyright infringement.  There's no other way an artists can be ripped
off when it comes to still images, other than perhaps a billboard ad.  There
are standard fees in this industry for the use of images, and they should have
sought out the artists and made agreements to use the images and provide
compensation.  I know for magazines it used to be $50 for B&W images and $100
or so for color.  I would think books would have similiar fees.

I understand why some people would feel honored to be published in a book, but
when you stop and think about what's really going on you can't help feel
robbed.  Would the author(s) of that book feel honored if you copied every page
into a word processor and started selling copies of the book yourself?  Imagine
what this world would be like if everyone gave the same amount of credit to the
work people do as so many do to the work an artist puts into his/her work.

I've never had to deal with this situation (yet), but if it happened to me I
would be making a huge stink about it.

-Mike

Post a reply to this message

> I bought a text-book for one of my college courses, and lo-and-behold, one
> of my renderings (Grade One), was in the book.  I was so surprised and
> happy,
> considering it was the only non-winning image among other IRTC
> winners/runner ups.
>  [ ... ]


Hmm, would make a good /. article!
Anybody?

                                                            - Marco


_________________________

 Marco Bonetti
 marco (at) urbanet (dot) ch

Post a reply to this message

Alan Kong wrote:
> 
>   I don't know what recourse you have but I would first contact the
> publisher by e-mail and save all e-correspondence. If they do not
> reply to e-mail then I would write a letter and send it by certified
> mail accompanied by a return receipt (if you are in the U.S.) to
> maintain a record of correspondence.

I would like to point out that Prentice-Hall probably has no idea that
the images are not the work of H. L. Capron; in the Land of the
Man-Eating Lawyers, knowingly publishing plagiarized work is not worth
the risk.

Regards,
John

Post a reply to this message

Bob Hughes wrote:
> 
> Both interesting and disturbing.  More so interesting to me though.
> Now I wish I had entered a lot of things into the IRTC ; )
> The fact there is a considerable number from a single source like a
> IRTC CD is odd in that it would (or should) have been obvious of the
> copyrights.

The author may have gotten the notion that the ostensibly educational
purpose of the book allows him to use other people's work without
paying for it.

Regards,
John
-- 
ICQ: 46085459

Post a reply to this message

Gautam N. Lad wrote in message <37eed7b2@news.povray.org>...
>Hi,
>I bought a text-book for one of my college courses, and lo-and-behold, one
>of my renderings (Grade One), was in the book.  I was so surprised and
>happy,
>considering it was the only non-winning image among other IRTC
>winners/runner ups.
>
>The book is called: Computers:
>Tools for an Information Age 6th Edition by H.L. Capron
>ISBN: 0-201-61211-9
>http://www.prenhall.com/capron
>
>Problem is, I was never told that my image would be appearing in the book.
>Is this somehow breaking one of the IRTC rules or violating my copyrights?
>All the files
>included for the submission included a statement from  me regarding
>permission of image/file, usage.
>I have written on my homepage's gallery and in the IRTC files (.POV, .TXT,
>etc.) that if
>you wish to use the image, you must first contact me to get my permission.
>
>Some of the images included in the book are (from the IRTC):
>
>- Roger, Gary and Bob by Jeane-Marie Haerens and Fabien Mosen
>- Untitled (image of Ice Cream Cone) by Nathan O'Brien (
>- Gomusic by Gena Obukhov (not sure if this is from IRTC)
>- Toco Toucan by Ian and Ethel MacKay
>- Pocketwatch by Kevin Odhner
>- Untitled (bucket of Sea Shells) by Steve Gowers (Summer theme)
>- Untitled (ship image) by Nathan O'Brien (Elements theme)
>- Grade One by Gautam Lad
>- Untitled (plane image) by Ian Armstrong (Flight theme)
>- Admiral Watch by Adrian Baumann
>- Ode to Prianesi by Nathan O'Brien
>
>My question to these artists: Did you receive any notice from the
>publisher/author? If not,
>do you think they violated your copyrights by using the image without your
>permission?
>
>Also, I don't plan on taking any legal action or anything; it's just that
>I'd like to know (in advance)
>where my work is being used.


After reading this thread, I checked my Computer Science textbook, and it
appears that POV-Ray is a very popular program for generating artwork for
these books.  However, the cover artwork in question in this case was
created by the author of the book, and no copyright violations are involved.

Mark

Post a reply to this message

Mark Wagner wrote:

> 
> After reading this thread, I checked my Computer Science textbook, and it
> appears that POV-Ray is a very popular program for generating artwork for
> these books.  However, the cover artwork in question in this case was
> created by the author of the book, and no copyright violations are involved.
> 
> Mark

Raises an interesting question. If someone uses "your" source code to
render an image on "their" computer is the image that is produced now
the property of the computer owner who produces the image ?

I know what you are going to say but I just say prove it :)

-- 
Ken Tyler
1100+ Povray, Graphics, 3D Rendering, and Raytracing Links:
http://home.pacbell.net/tylereng/index.html

Post a reply to this message

Ken wrote:
> Raises an interesting question. If someone uses "your" source code to
> render an image on "their" computer is the image that is produced now
> the property of the computer owner who produces the image ?

 That's a very special case, and I can't think of any comparison in the
art field.  At worse, you could always consider Pov code as
automatically
copyrighted, just like any programming code.
 If someone commercially uses 100% of your code, you'll be upset.
 If someone commercially uses 1% of your code, you'll probably don't
care.
 Where's the limit ?  Where between "learning from existing code and
reusing
bits of it" and "stealing someone else's code" ?
 
 Many IRTC participants (including myself) prevents the re-rendering
of their images by changing the sources in various ways : missing
objects,
different maps,...

Fabien.

Post a reply to this message