Marc Schimmler <sch### [at] icauni-stuttgartde> wrote:
: if the povray users would place their homepages
: on povray.org and allowed some advertising.

  If this ever becomes true, I have an opinion about advertising:

  Advertising in web pages is OK, as long as it does NOT use:

  a) Animated gifs. They are extremely annoying and distracting and they
do not do any good for the page or the advertisement. It's a shame netscape
does not have an option to disable animated gifs. At least you can press ESC
to stop the gifs and I do that every time.

  b) Java scripts. Often java scripts are used to make something special
(like keeping the advertisement always fixed at the same place on the
browser window). This is usually also very annoying. Also usually, when
you have java scripts disabled (like I do), you get several lines of
garbage at the end of the page (very usual in geocities pages) which do not
do any good to the page or the advertisement.

  c) Java scripts that open a new window. This is the worst thing ever. It
should be banned from earth. There are many reasons why this is a very, very
bad idea:
  Firstly, at least I am very annoyed with pages which do something I don't
want them to do. They should confine themselves into the space I have
reserved to them and I consider very annoying if they start to invade my
desktop without my permission, wasting valuable desktop space with totally
useless advertisement windows.
  Secondly, if a page opens a new window with a java script, it will open
it EACH time you go to that page (I don't know if this is true for every
browser, but I have seen this). This means that if you are surfing using
the method go-to-subpage, return-to-main-page, go-to-subpage, and so on,
your desktop will be filled with more and more copies of the same window.
My friend tried this once. He just ignored the popping adveritsement window
thinking that it would open just once. Soon he noticed that it wasn't true.
He finally disabled java scripts as I recommended.
  Links that open a new browser window are also very annoying. And the bad
thing about them is that you can't disable them because they are not java
scripts.
  Links that work only when java scripts are enabled are a very stupid idea.

  d) Filling the page with tens of little advertisements is also a very
bad idea.
  I often try an URL and I end in a page which is completely full of stuff.
Little advertisements everywhere, etc. After searching I found a text among
them in a very little font that says that the URL can't be retrieved. That
absolutely does not give a very good image of that service provider.

  One static banner gif at the beginning of the page should be enough.
  Usually people automatically ignore them, though... But it's much better
than throwing stuff on people's faces.

-- 
main(i,_){for(_?--i,main(i+2,"FhhQHFIJD|FQTITFN]zRFHhhTBFHhhTBFysdB"[i]
):5;i&&_>1;printf("%s",_-70?_&1?"[]":" ":(_=0,"\n")),_/=2);} /*- Warp -*/

Post a reply to this message

Alan Kong wrote:
> 
> On Wed, 30 Jun 1999 16:54:51 +0200, Marc Schimmler
> <sch### [at] icauni-stuttgartde> wrote:
> 
> >During the last advertising of the IRTC CD-ROM by Chris Cason Greg M.
> >Johnson suggested a very good idea (my opinion). He asked if it would be
> >also helping povray.org if the povray users would place their homepages
> >on povray.org and allowed some advertising. Chris seemed to be
> >interested but no response came!
> 
>   Hi, Marc. Thanks for mentioning Chris' post. If I had web pages and had to
> pay my ISP for the space on their servers I'd rather pay the money for space
> on the POV-Ray server and help support it at the same time. It just makes
> sense!
> 
>   People shouldn't be surprised to learn that the system that hosts these
> newsgroups and povray.org wasn't donated to the POV-Team by some generous
> benefactor. Neither are the developer tools that the POV-Team uses to bring
> us our beloved POV-Ray. It just seems ironic that the POV-Team must spend
> its own money, sometimes hundreds of dollars, to bring us a *freeware*
> product. No one on the POV-Team is aiming to get rich. That's not why they
> are involved with POV-Ray. They would just like to be able to get closer to
> breaking even.
> 
>   If anyone else would be interested in purchasing web space why don't we
> let Chris know so that he can determine whether this is worth his time, in
> terms of the number of potential customers that frequent this newsgroup.
> Count me in.
> 
> --
> Alan
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> http://www.povray.org - Home of the Persistence of Vision Ray Tracer
> news.povray.org - where POV-Ray enthusiasts around the world can get
> together to exchange ideas, information, and experiences with others
> --------------------------------------------------------------------

Hi Alan!

I just cite the original post from Greg and Chris:

Greg:
"Since you have your own server, would you be able to set up personal
web pages and
sell (tactfully placed) ads? Would this enable more revenue to you, or
just be a
headache?"

Chris:
"Yes, we can do both. I'm unsure how much demand there would be for it.
What do
others think ?"


If we find a way to get a new HD and to improve the bandwidth while
earning enough money to pay the whole server operation it would be fine
I guess. The people that show up at povray are most of the time ideal
for graphics software ads (well educated and interested in the subject,
all ages). The main problem would be to get the starting money (selling
more IRTC CD-ROMs?) and to reduce the workload for Chris which I fear
spends a lot of time for us (thank you Chris!).
We might even start with some selected pages on the existing server that
could attract some ads that would allow to open the service to more
people. 
As I said it might be an idea and I would be interested to hear from
Chris.


All the Best,

Marc
--
Marc Schimmler

Post a reply to this message

I agree to all points especially to c)!
An option would be a framed window with a clear ads frame and a contents
frame.

Marc
-- 
Marc Schimmler

Post a reply to this message

Lance Birch wrote:
> 
> >I personally have my page on Xoom. They have already started to suck, now
> >that they have that stupid banner on the top of each page (which sometimes
> >ruins them completely). I would like to move to a place where I can have
> 
> OK, why don't you do what I do... just get rid of the banner :)
> 
> Here's how...
> 
> If your address is http://members.xoom.com/your-user-name-here/index.html
> then just retype it like this:
> http://members.xoom.com/_XOOM/your-user-name-here/index.html
> 
> What happens is that when someone goes to your site, the XOOM HTTP portal
> bot adds the extra frame in... by adding _XOOM/ to the address it cancels
> the bot's operation and bypasses it completely, thus getting rid of the bar.
> Note however that you MUST specify the file... e.g. you must point it
> directly to index.html the first time, otherwise it will add the banner on.
> 
> For example, my two addresses below are redirectors.  They actually point
> to:
> 
> The Zone - http://come.to/the.zone
> http://members.xoom.com/_XOOM/lancebirch/thezone/index.html
> 
> and
> 
> Colorblind - http://listen.to/colorblind
> http://members.xoom.com/_XOOM/lancebirch/colorblind/index.html
> 
> HAVE FUN!  :)
> 
> --
> Lance.
> 

Xoom is also on the list that have nearly identical terms like
Geocities. The funny thing is that all those not of the proper age to do
buisness of their own (Lance .. Tony?) can't sign the licence legally.
Only your parents can. :-) So don't be bothered. They would loose every
lawsuit.

Marc
-- 
Marc Schimmler

Post a reply to this message

>Xoom is also on the list that have nearly identical terms like
>Geocities. The funny thing is that all those not of the proper age to do
>buisness of their own (Lance .. Tony?) can't sign the licence legally.
>Only your parents can. :-) So don't be bothered. They would loose every
>lawsuit.
>
>Marc

Actually I do business under contract work and I am legally liable for my
copyrights now, I'm just not eligible for a registered business name.  :)

--
Lance.


---
For the latest 3D Studio MAX plug-ins, images and much more, go to:
The Zone - http://come.to/the.zone
For a totally different experience, visit my Chroma Key Website:
Colorblind - http://listen.to/colorblind

Post a reply to this message

Yeah, you've covered all my main gripes. The only thing more obtrusive than
pop-ups is inline music. Luckily I've seen very few ads using this.

Margus

Post a reply to this message

Marc Schimmler wrote:
> 
> With some horror I followed the news that Geocities and other "free" web
> space providers are going to "steal" the intellectual property of their
> users. I guess for many this is not a acceptable state (for me it would
> not).
> During the last advertising of the IRTC CD-ROM by Chris Cason Greg M.
> Johnson suggested a very good idea (my opinion). He asked if it would be
> also helping povray.org if the povray users would place their homepages
> on povray.org and allowed some advertising. Chris seemed to be
> interested but no response came!
> How about moving your Geocities homepage to povray.org and help to
> support it while denying Geocities and Tripod etc. to steal your work?
> I guess some advertisers from the graphics and software industry could
> be interested.
> Would this be OK for povray.org?
> Would this be OK for you?
> 
> Any response?
> Is this nonsense?
> 
> Marc
> --
> Marc Schimmler

I would do it immediately.

Remco

Post a reply to this message

TonyB wrote:
> 
> I personally have my page on Xoom. They have already started to suck, now
> that they have that stupid banner on the top of each page (which sometimes
> ruins them completely). I would like to move to a place where I can have
> 5-10MB of space, and put commercials up any way I want them, preferably on
> the bottom of my pages, in an elegant, discreet manner instead of pop-ups.

You might try FortuneCity, though I admit I don't know about their copyright
policy. The one thing I don't like there is the 1Mb file limit (which means you
can't upload files larger then 1Mb). 

Remco de Korte
http://www.xs4all.nl/~remcodek/vic.html

Post a reply to this message

I am open to the idea of doing this, provided it was worthwhile.

I own the domain 'raytrace.com' which I could use for hosting. i.e. you could
have 'yourname.raytrace.com', or 'www.raytrace.com/yourname', depending on the
type of server you want (a full virtual server like the former would cost
more). The pages would be physically located on the POV-Ray server.

But it's not worthwhile unless I get some idea of how many folks would pay for
this, how much they'd be willing to pay for setup, and how much per month
they'd pay.

We can't compete against the 'free' web sites, and wouldn't even be competitive
against most of the non-free ones, but at least in the process you'll get an
ad-free ad popup-free web site and help fund this system at the same time.

-- Chris

Post a reply to this message

POV-Ray Newsadmin <newsadmin@[remove]povray.org> wrote in message
news:377b85ac.16084843@news.povray.org...
> I am open to the idea of doing this, provided it was worthwhile.
>
> I own the domain 'raytrace.com' which I could use for hosting. i.e. you
could
> have 'yourname.raytrace.com', or 'www.raytrace.com/yourname', depending on
the
> type of server you want (a full virtual server like the former would cost
> more). The pages would be physically located on the POV-Ray server.
>
> But it's not worthwhile unless I get some idea of how many folks would pay
for
> this, how much they'd be willing to pay for setup, and how much per month
> they'd pay.

ISPs I have used, tripod premium first  and now icom.com,  say that the
payment is monthly, but you have to pay per year in advance, which I think
is fair, due to the nature of the service.   I pay an average of $10
monthly, besides the domain hosting.


> We can't compete against the 'free' web sites, and wouldn't even be
competitive
> against most of the non-free ones, but at least in the process you'll get
an
> ad-free ad popup-free web site and help fund this system at the same time.
>

That's true. It is also true that the name worths and worths a lot.  This
would be a big project, in view of the details.

-Who will be able to have a webpage there, and based on what?
-People involved in raytracing do not reach a million human beings.  On the
down side, we'll have to pay a little more.  On the good side, Hey, Not
everybody does raytracing!
-That concentration of raytracing works and utilities would bring many
unwanted advertisers willing to put their hands everywhere., that's
dangerous., But it is a good challenge, since POV is freeware.

Just two cents
Marjorie Graterol

Post a reply to this message