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Thorsten Froehlich wrote:
> The word "midnight" is not ambiguous at all. It is well defined in
> every English dictionary.
The problem is that although midnight is defined as "the middle of the
night", or 12 o'clock, if you say "Tuesday at midnight", it is unclear
whether you mean the midnight at the beginning of Tuesday, or the midnight
at the end of Tuesday.
> Personally I am really disappointed that a few people here try to
> infer bad intentions by default and challenge even the most basic and
> common terms of every day life. IMHO this is not only inappropriate
> but also uncalled for.
Even in everyday life people get confused with dates and times when not
explained exactly. That is why the ISO-8601 standard exists and is used by
anyone who has anything important to do with date and time.
I'm sorry you feel it was uncalled for, but I was only just suggesting that
for next time it would be far simpler just to follow the standard rather
than getting arguments from people.
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In article <4174cc02@news.povray.org> , "scott" <sco### [at] spamcom> wrote:
>> The word "midnight" is not ambiguous at all. It is well defined in
>> every English dictionary.
>
> The problem is that although midnight is defined as "the middle of the
> night", or 12 o'clock, if you say "Tuesday at midnight", it is unclear
> whether you mean the midnight at the beginning of Tuesday, or the midnight
> at the end of Tuesday.
There is only one 12 o'clock in the evening, and it is the one that follows
the 11 o'clock in the evening. If you wish to discuss the philosophical
aspects of "midnight", please do so in p.off-topic and please do not attempt
to create ambiguity where there absolutely is none.
Thorsten
____________________________________________________
Thorsten Froehlich, Duisburg, Germany
e-mail: tho### [at] trfde
Visit POV-Ray on the web: http://mac.povray.org
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Thorsten Froehlich wrote:
> In article <4174cc02@news.povray.org> , "scott" <sco### [at] spamcom>
> wrote:
>
>>> The word "midnight" is not ambiguous at all. It is well defined in
>>> every English dictionary.
>>
>> The problem is that although midnight is defined as "the middle of
>> the night", or 12 o'clock, if you say "Tuesday at midnight", it is
>> unclear whether you mean the midnight at the beginning of Tuesday,
>> or the midnight at the end of Tuesday.
>
> There is only one 12 o'clock in the evening, and it is the one that
> follows the 11 o'clock in the evening. If you wish to discuss the
> philosophical aspects of "midnight", please do so in p.off-topic and
> please do not attempt to create ambiguity where there absolutely is
> none.
Calm down! I never said there was any ambiguity with the rules (although it
appears there was), I was only suggesting that you might use the correct
standard in future to be sure of avoiding any ambiguity.
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In article <4174ef6a@news.povray.org> , "scott" <sco### [at] spamcom> wrote:
> Calm down! I never said there was any ambiguity with the rules (although it
> appears there was), I was only suggesting that you might use the correct
> standard in future to be sure of avoiding any ambiguity.
Be honest to yourself: How many people do you think are able to read ISO
8601 times and dates correctly? More than who understand the word
"midnight"? BTW, these are rhetorical questions.
Thorsten
____________________________________________________
Thorsten Froehlich, Duisburg, Germany
e-mail: tho### [at] trfde
Visit POV-Ray on the web: http://mac.povray.org
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"Thorsten Froehlich" <tho### [at] trfde> wrote in message
news:4174f293@news.povray.org...
[deletions]
: Be honest to yourself: How many people do you think are able to read ISO
: 8601 times and dates correctly? More than who understand the word
: "midnight"? BTW, these are rhetorical questions.
What I find interesting is this from the standard itself:
===============================================
An example time is
23:59:59
which represents the time one second before midnight.
=Bob=
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On Mon, 18 Oct 2004 17:52:31 +0200, "Thorsten Froehlich"
<tho### [at] trfde> wrote:
>
>Personally I am really disappointed that a few people here try to infer bad
>intentions by default and challenge even the most basic and common terms of
>every day life. IMHO this is not only inappropriate but also uncalled for.
>
A contest with such a large prize tends to bring this out
in people. I'm just amazed it's not gotten even worse
than it has.
--
to all the companies who wait until a large user base becomes
dependant on their freeware, then shafting said happy campers with
mandatory payment for continued usage. I spit on your grave.
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Come'on now, ya gotta think it's pretty ironic that the
ISO standard has that exact verbiage...
: What I find interesting is this from the standard itself:
: ===============================================
: An example time is
: 23:59:59
: which represents the time one second before midnight.
: =Bob=
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Continued in off-topic.
(My last post is no longer here, so I think that was a hint.)
--
Jeremy
www.beantoad.com
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For what it's worth, I too had the same question about the deadline, and
certainly didn't want to make a costly mistake. I asked several people
about the exact meaning of "midnight October 15 2004, Australian Eastern
Standard Time" as stated in the rules -- and got conflicting responses from
them. So I looked at several dictionaries, which didn't help: one site
http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Midnight even says, "each day thus has two
midnights, one at the start and one at the end" in its definition of
"midnight"! I then contacted the competition organizers for clarification.
They replied that due to apparent confusion, the deadline had been
extended.
I like the suggestion of using the ISO 8601 standard and eliminating the
word "midnight".
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Perhaps it is not to you, but it is for some of us. I think it is sad to
infer that people have bad intentions instead of giving them the benefit
of the doubt and understand that there is an actual confusion.
The other day some friends and I were buying some online tickets for an
event that began at "midnight". We were not sure if we should buy them
for that day or the next one exactly because of this ambiguity in the
system.
We were not trying to exploit anything. We had an honest question and
didn't want to possibly waste our money because of this uncertainty.
Fernando
Thorsten Froehlich wrote:
> The word "midnight" is not ambiguous at all. It is well defined in every
> English dictionary.
>
> Personally I am really disappointed that a few people here try to infer bad
> intentions by default and challenge even the most basic and common terms of
> every day life. IMHO this is not only inappropriate but also uncalled for.
>
> Thorsten
>
> ____________________________________________________
> Thorsten Froehlich, Duisburg, Germany
> e-mail: tho### [at] trfde
>
> Visit POV-Ray on the web: http://mac.povray.org
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