Just a thought:

The IRTC has a way for just about anyone to post comments on a particular 
image (though perhaps they have to be registered).  I (and many others) have 
generally found such comments to be helpful.  I think it would be nice to 
add that feature to the POVCOMP entries, but I have no idea how much trouble 
that would be.

Thanks.

-- 
Jeremy
www.beantoad.com

> The IRTC has a way for just about anyone to post comments on a particular
> image (though perhaps they have to be registered).  I (and many others)
have
> generally found such comments to be helpful.  I think it would be nice to
> add that feature to the POVCOMP entries, but I have no idea how much
trouble
> that would be.


I've thought of the same thing. Even if there were no way to add it to the
website, it would be nice if we could set up some sort of way of commenting;
maybe through the POV-Ray wiki, or maybe even a big newsgroup thread with
one sub-thread per image. Of course, if it were on the website it would get
a lot more attention.

 - Slime
 [ http://www.slimeland.com/ ]

Jeremy M. Praay wrote:
> Just a thought:
> 
> The IRTC has a way for just about anyone to post comments on a particular 
> image (though perhaps they have to be registered).  I (and many others) have 
> generally found such comments to be helpful.  I think it would be nice to 
> add that feature to the POVCOMP entries, but I have no idea how much trouble 
> that would be.
> 
> Thanks.
> 

My expectation is that it will garner the usual "great image!" "dude, 
your image rocks!" sort of thing.

I remember when I think it was Renderdog that spearheaded an attempt to 
talk about images during the "technology" round, that I picked up on. 
It was a very exhausting exercise.

Which, btw, thanks to the judges for making comments on the images. 
Even if brief, and technical in nature, it is still a difficult thing to 
do for more than a handful of images, and I, for one, appreciated the 
effort that was made.

I don't know Jeremy, this group seems as appropriate a place as any. 
Maybe start a thread "What image has meaning for you and why?"

421bb142$1@news.povray.org...

> Which, btw, thanks to the judges for making comments on the images. Even 
> if brief, and technical in nature, it is still a difficult thing to do for 
> more than a handful of images, and I, for one, appreciated the effort that 
> was made.

To be fair, I'm not too happy with the comments (starting with mine). Some 
people feel that they are too negative and indeed they are, which is both 
unavoidable (only positive comments wouldn't make much sense) and not very 
nice for the artists. A diplomatic touch is necessary when writing comments, 
but after penning a few dozens of them the varnish wears off...

> I don't know Jeremy, this group seems as appropriate a place as any. Maybe 
> start a thread "What image has meaning for you and why?"

Allowing comments could be interesting, but I'm not sure that there will be 
much interest now that the competition is over, at least not enough to 
warrant further development of the interface for the time being. 
Registration should be mandatory to avoid spam, and in any case the comments 
would have to be moderated so it's not straightforward. I don't want some 
idiot to be able add "this pic sucks" under every image and have this 
indexed in Google before anyone sees it. I guess that the system should be 
built to accept public comments from the very start for this to work without 
too much trouble.

However, I'm all for starting threads here about the images, such as the one 
you suggest.

G.

Gilles Tran wrote:

> To be fair, I'm not too happy with the comments (starting with mine). Some 
> people feel that they are too negative and indeed they are, which is both 
> unavoidable (only positive comments wouldn't make much sense) and not very 
> nice for the artists. A diplomatic touch is necessary when writing comments, 
> but after penning a few dozens of them the varnish wears off...

Part of the problem is that the comments can be read, one after another, 
all of a piece.  It is when read in that way that they can appear 
unremittingly negative.  For the individual artist, reading just the 
comments for his/her entry, it may not be so bad.  I think the artist 
really does want to know the negatives.  You may not agree, and it may 
make you angry, but you still want to know.  It is nicer to have it 
delivered with a spoonful of sugar though.

I thought the commentors did try to leave the safe ground of technical 
concerns from time to time, which was a relief, and there was often a 
good natured, coach-like tone.  Certainly these efforts started to flag 
but again, I find it entirely understandable.  I rarely make comments in 
the IRTC.  But I think it is fun and even necessary to write some 
"appreciation" from time to time.

> However, I'm all for starting threads here about the images, such as the one 
> you suggest.
> 

My point is to keep it oblique and open ended and let the chips fall. 
Any attempt to be comprehensive will be deadly.

"Gilles Tran" <gitran_nospam_@wanadoo.fr> wrote in message 
news:421cfad9$1@news.povray.org...
>
> To be fair, I'm not too happy with the comments (starting with mine). Some 
> people feel that they are too negative and indeed they are, which is both 
> unavoidable (only positive comments wouldn't make much sense) and not very 
> nice for the artists. A diplomatic touch is necessary when writing 
> comments, but after penning a few dozens of them the varnish wears off...

My first reaction was that they were rather negative, but later I realized 
that the intent was to be helpful.  Nevertheless, it occurred to me that 
since these images were meant to showcase POV-Ray's features, I'm not sure 
how such comments would be viewed by an outsider.

More detailed comments would have been nice, but obviously, that's a bit 
much to ask.  I think each of us would have liked several paragraphs from 
each of the judges, but, well, let's get real.  ;-)

>
> Allowing comments could be interesting, but I'm not sure that there will 
> be much interest now that the competition is over, at least not enough to 
> warrant further development of the interface for the time being. 
> Registration should be mandatory to avoid spam, and in any case the 
> comments would have to be moderated so it's not straightforward. I don't 
> want some idiot to be able add "this pic sucks" under every image and have 
> this indexed in Google before anyone sees it. I guess that the system 
> should be built to accept public comments from the very start for this to 
> work without too much trouble.

You're probably right.  I was just over at Photo.net recently, and I was 
reading all of the comments.  It made me think about this.  As Jim said, 
there is always a lot of "Great pic, d00d!" comments, that don't mean a 
whole lot, and there are always art critics who know nothing about art.  But 
taken as a whole, I think the comments are relevant.  I don't know how many 
viewers we have at POVCOMP, but I would guess it's nowhere near Photo.net's 
viewership (though we all wish that weren't so).  And as you suggest, there 
would probably be less enthusiasm for posting comments at this point.  If we 
have another such competition, I hope that we have some way of allowing 
comments, even if they are only made by the participants.

>
> However, I'm all for starting threads here about the images, such as the 
> one you suggest.
>

I don't disagree with that idea, but I also think if falls short of a 
broader comment-system.  Not everyone who participated (or viewed) the 
POVCOMP entries posts in this newsgroup.  And it's sometimes good to get 
"outside" opinions, too.  It can sometimes be a "breath of fresh air".

I appreciate the work that was done by everyone involved.  I'm just stating 
my opinions, as usual.

-- 
Jeremy
www.beantoad.com