POV-Ray : Newsgroups : povray.binaries.images : QUESTION: Bump not showing? Server Time
5 Jul 2024 17:27:24 EDT (-0400)
  QUESTION: Bump not showing? (Message 22 to 31 of 91)  
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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 05:14:52
Message: <59770c0c$1@news.povray.org>
On 7/25/2017 9:44 AM, omniverse wrote:
> I like that description, and spaghetti.
>

I've learned my lessons the hard way.
And it is Tuesday, traditionally pasta night.

> I didn't get any errors after making sure all lines of SDL are commented, mostly
> the several
>
> //
> --------------------------------------------

/* That is why
I put my comments tile this. Even if it is only one line. */

Not that I do a lot of coding but I modify machine written SDL a lot.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: omniverse
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 05:15:00
Message: <web.59770bba9f453b979c5d6c810@news.povray.org>
Yoiks! Forgot to say what I was going to tell about before starting to write
that last reply.
I blame Stephen for making me lose my train of thought with that perfect
metaphor about finding errors.  LOL

Sooo... bump_size 0.1, apparently that's too much. I tried 0.01 instead and
think it looks better. I realized the scale in the normal statement being
MyRadius*2 is probably the equivalent of bump_size 4 even if starting with 0.01.

Don't want to go into all that here but I recall many discussions long ago about
attempts to keep things such as normal and media from scaling up or down with
object sizes after placing the texture. Or just to be aware of the possible
ramifications when scaling.

That aside, please be sure to read my previous reply about the other things.

Bob


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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 05:16:06
Message: <59770c56$1@news.povray.org>
On 7/25/2017 9:44 AM, omniverse wrote:
 > I like that description, and spaghetti.
 >

I've learned my lessons the hard way.
And it is Tuesday, traditionally pasta night.

 > I didn't get any errors after making sure all lines of SDL are 
commented, mostly
 > the several
 >
 > //
 > --------------------------------------------

/* That is why
I put my comments like this. Even if it is only one line. */

Not that I do a lot of coding but I modify machine written SDL a lot.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: Sven Littkowski
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 13:16:05
Message: <59777cd5@news.povray.org>
Hi, did you all see the latest code?

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From: Sven Littkowski
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 13:19:40
Message: <59777dac$1@news.povray.org>
On 25.07.2017 05:13, omniverse wrote:
> Yoiks! Forgot to say what I was going to tell about before starting to wr
ite
> that last reply.
> I blame Stephen for making me lose my train of thought with that perfect
> metaphor about finding errors.  LOL
> 
> Sooo... bump_size 0.1, apparently that's too much. I tried 0.01 instead a
nd
> think it looks better. I realized the scale in the normal statement being

> MyRadius*2 is probably the equivalent of bump_size 4 even if starting wit
h 0.01.
> 
> Don't want to go into all that here but I recall many discussions long ag
o about
> attempts to keep things such as normal and media from scaling up or down 
with
> object sizes after placing the texture. Or just to be aware of the possib
le
> ramifications when scaling.
> 
> That aside, please be sure to read my previous reply about the other thin
gs.
> 
> Bob
> 
Ho, can you publish here the entire scene code of your version of the
scene? That would help me better to see the differences and to understand.

I admit, another problem I have, is based on the English language. Yes,
i understand it well, I even live in an English-speaking country now.
But I am not natively English-speaking. Reading all that English here,
causes a concentration problem for me, and I am always missing a lot of
things, not capturing them somehow. That is why I want to ask you all
here, to be patient with me. :-)

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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 14:51:03
Message: <59779317$1@news.povray.org>
On 7/25/2017 6:19 PM, Sven Littkowski wrote:
> I admit, another problem I have, is based on the English language. Yes,
> i understand it well, I even live in an English-speaking country now.

Jamaican English is an ittsy bitsy bit different from Standard English. 
In case you hadn't noticed.

-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: omniverse
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 16:00:00
Message: <web.5977a2619f453b979c5d6c810@news.povray.org>
Sven Littkowski <I### [at] SvenLittkowskiname> wrote:
>
> Ho, can you publish here the entire scene code of your version of the
> scene? That would help me better to see the differences and to understand.

Hope this doesn't suffer in translation.  ;)
There's some dark splotches on the lower left side, maybe reflection? I didn't
check, wanted to go ahead and post this.

#version 3.7;
/*
#include "kolors.inc"
#include "finish.inc"
#include "textures.inc"
*/
#declare MyRadiosity = on; // fast enough, but faster without

/*#declare MyBackground = "SL_Space_Scene_003"; // Wormhole /SL_Space_Scene_003
/ */

global_settings
{
 #if(MyRadiosity)
  radiosity
  {
   media on
   pretrace_start 0.08
   pretrace_end   0.02
   count 100
   error_bound 0.75
   recursion_limit 1
   normal on
  }
 #end
 subsurface        {}
 adc_bailout       0.0039
 ambient_light     rgb < 0.000, 0.000, 0.000 >
 assumed_gamma     1.000
 irid_wavelength   rgb < 0.250, 0.180, 0.140 >
 max_trace_level   5
 number_of_waves   10
 noise_generator   3
 charset           ascii
}

#declare LightDiameter =     10000.0;
#declare LightDistanceX =  -500000.0; // X = Left - Right
#declare LightDistanceY =  1000000.0; // Y = Up - Down
#declare LightDistanceZ =  -100000.0; // Z = Front - Back
#declare LightRotate =          36.0;
#declare MyLight =             0.125;

camera
{
 location < -000.0, 400.0/2, -500.0 > /* < -000.0, 400.0, -500.0 > */
 look_at < 0.0, -200.0, 0.0 >/2 /* < 0.0, -200.0, 0.0 > */
 right 1.77*x
}

//------------------------------------------------------------------

light_source
{
 < 2500.0, 2500.0, 500.0 > //< 2500.0, 2500.0, 5000.0 >
 rgb < 0.72265625, 0.8046875, 0.80859375 > *1.5 // bright!?
 area_light x*100,z*100,5,5 circular orient
 area_illumination
}
/*
light_source
{
 < -50.0, 50.0, 0.0 >
 rgb < 0.3, 0.4, 0.8 > *1.1
}
*/
/*
#declare MyLight = light_source
{
 < -1000.0, 1000.0, 1000.0 >
 rgb < 0.72265625, 0.8046875, 0.80859375 > *0.25
// spotlight
// point_at < 0.0, 25.0, 100.0 >
// falloff 100.0
// radius 10.0
// fade_distance 50.0
// fade_power 4
}

union
{
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 000.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 036.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 072.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 108.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 144.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 180.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 216.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 252.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 288.0, 0.0 > }
 object { MyLight rotate < 0.0, 324.0, 0.0 > }
 translate < -1000.0, 0000.0, -1000.0 >
}
*/

// simulate Earth below
plane {y,-9999 pigment {rgb <0.4,0.7,1>}}

//------------------------------

#declare MyRadius = 200.0;

//------------------------------

#declare PositiveBump = normal
{
 bump_map
 { // use your file name
 png "balloon2bump"
 map_type 0 interpolate 2 }
 translate -0.5
 rotate < 90.0, 0.0, 0.0 >
 scale MyRadius*2 // 200*2=400, multiply by bump_size
 bump_size 0.02 // this equates to 8 after scale
}

#declare NegativeBump = normal // invert surface normal
{
 bump_map
 { // use your file name
  png "balloon2bump"
  map_type 0 interpolate 2 }
 translate -0.5
 rotate < 90.0, 0.0, 0.0 >
 scale -MyRadius*2 // 200*2=400, multiply by bump_size
 bump_size 0.04 // this equates to 16 after scale
}

#declare MyOuterBalloonFinish = finish
{
 reflection   0.1 // I'm guessing here
 //crand        0.10 // grainy near shadows! Is it needed??
}

#declare MyInnerBalloonFinish = finish
{
 brilliance   1.50
 phong albedo 0.05
 metallic     0.00
 ambient      0.00
 emission     0.00
 reflection   0.50 // this much needed? or not?
}

#declare MyOuterBalloonTexture = texture
{
 pigment
 {
  image_map
  {
   png "balloon2bump"
   gamma 1
   map_type 0
   interpolate 2
   once
   transmit all 0.4 /* added to make partially transparent, change or remove? */
  }
  translate -0.5
  rotate < 90.0, 0.0, 0.0 >
  scale MyRadius*2
 }
 normal
 {
  gradient y
  normal_map
  { /* index number is based on balloon size, upper part height */
   [ 0.2625 PositiveBump] // top
   [ 0.2625 NegativeBump] // bottom
  }
  scale <1,1.5*MyRadius,1> // set to balloon height
 }
 finish { MyOuterBalloonFinish }
}

#declare MyInnerBalloonTexture = texture
{
 pigment { color rgb < 0.7686275,  0.7607843,  0.7333333 >
  transmit 0.4 /* added to make partially transparent, change or remove? */
 }
 normal
 {
  gradient y
  normal_map
  { /* set index values to 0.175 if torus scale <1,0.5,1>, same above */
   [ 0.2625 PositiveBump]
   [ 0.2625 NegativeBump]
  }
  scale <1,1.5*MyRadius,1>
 }
 finish { MyInnerBalloonFinish }
}

//------------------------------

#declare UpperBalloonShape = torus
/* Balloon Radius: 175 m /Launcher Radius: 10 m */
{
 95.0, 105.0
 scale < 1.0, 0.75, 1.0 >
 /* if 0.5*y, use normal_map 0.175 not 0.2625 (0.175*1.5, 0.5*1.5=0.75) */
} /* I changed that to get tall fat appearance, not required
but must change everything back again if not used this way */

#declare LowerBalloonShape = difference
{
 sphere { < 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 >, MyRadius }
 cylinder { < 0.0, 0.0, 0.0 >, < 0.0, /*175.001*/MyRadius+0.001, 0.0 >,
MyRadius+0.001 }
 scale < 1.0, 1.5, 1.0 >
}

#declare MyBalloonHullOutside = merge // union causes artefacts??
{
 object { UpperBalloonShape }
 object { LowerBalloonShape }
 texture { MyOuterBalloonTexture }
}

#declare MyBalloonHull = difference
{
 object { MyBalloonHullOutside }
 object
 {
  MyBalloonHullOutside
  scale 0.99999 // causing artefacts??
  texture { MyInnerBalloonTexture }
 }
 cylinder  // Launcher Openings
 {
  < 0.0, -((MyRadius*1.5)+0.001), 0.0 >, < 0.0, (MyRadius+0.001), 0.0 >, 3.5
  texture { MyInnerBalloonTexture }
 }
// plane {z,0} // only to see inside
}

#declare Launcher = difference
{
 union
 {
  #declare MyLength = 10.0;
  #declare MyHeight = 0.0;
  #declare MyTop = 35.0;
  cylinder {
   < 0.0, -((MyRadius*1.5)+30.0), 0.0 >,
   < 0.0, MyTop, 0.0 >, 3.5 }
  box { < MyLength, -MyHeight, -0.1 >, < -MyLength, MyTop, 0.1 >
   rotate <0.0, 000.0, 0.0 > }
  box { < MyLength, -MyHeight, -0.1 >, < -MyLength, MyTop, 0.1 >
   rotate <0.0, 045.0, 0.0 > }
  box { < MyLength, -MyHeight, -0.1 >, < -MyLength, MyTop, 0.1 >
   rotate <0.0, 090.0, 0.0 > }
  box { < MyLength, -MyHeight, -0.1 >, < -MyLength, MyTop, 0.1 >
   rotate <0.0, 135.0, 0.0 > }
  box { < MyLength, -MyHeight, -0.1 >, < -MyLength, MyTop, 0.1 >
   rotate <0.0, 180.0, 0.0 > }
  box { < MyLength, -MyHeight, -0.1 >, < -MyLength, MyTop, 0.1 >
   rotate <0.0, 225.0, 0.0 > }
  box { < MyLength, -MyHeight, -0.1 >, < -MyLength, MyTop, 0.1 >
   rotate <0.0, 270.0, 0.0 > }
  box { < MyLength, -MyHeight, -0.1 >, < -MyLength, MyTop, 0.1 >
   rotate <0.0, 315.0, 0.0 > }
 }
 cylinder {
  < 0.0, -((MyRadius*1.5)+30.001), 0.0 >,
  < 0.0, MyTop+0.001, 0.0 >, 3.3 }
 pigment { color rgb 1.0 }
}

#declare DoublePositionLight = union
{
 union
 {
  cylinder { < 0.0, 0.0,  2.5 > < 10.0, 0.0,  2.5 > 0.20 }
  cylinder { < 0.0, 0.0, -2.5 > < 10.0, 0.0, -2.5 > 0.20 }
  pigment { color rgb < 0.05, 0.05, 0.05 > }
  finish { MyOuterBalloonFinish }
 }
 union
 {
  sphere { < 10.0, 0.0, 2.5 > 0.35 }
  sphere { < 10.0, 0.0, -2.5 > 0.35 }
  pigment { color rgbf < 1.0, 0.0, 0.0, 0.5 > }
  finish { ambient rgb < 0.3, 0.1, 0.1 > }
 }
 union
 {
  light_source
  {
   < 10.0, 0.0, 2.5 >
   rgb < 0.7, 0.0, 0.0 > *10.0
   fade_distance 50.0
   fade_power 4
  }
  light_source
  {
   < 10.0, 0.0, -2.5 >
   rgb < 0.7, 0.0, 0.0 > *1.0
   fade_distance 50.0
   fade_power 4
  }
 }
}

#declare PositionLights = union
{
 #declare MyDistance = MyRadius-0.1;
 object { DoublePositionLight translate < MyDistance, 0.0, 0.0 >
  rotate < 0.0, 000.0, 0.0 > }
 object { DoublePositionLight translate < MyDistance, 0.0, 0.0 >
  rotate < 0.0, 045.0, 0.0 > }
 object { DoublePositionLight translate < MyDistance, 0.0, 0.0 >
  rotate < 0.0, 090.0, 0.0 > }
 object { DoublePositionLight translate < MyDistance, 0.0, 0.0 >
  rotate < 0.0, 135.0, 0.0 > }
 object { DoublePositionLight translate < MyDistance, 0.0, 0.0 >
  rotate < 0.0, 180.0, 0.0 > }
 object { DoublePositionLight translate < MyDistance, 0.0, 0.0 >
  rotate < 0.0, 225.0, 0.0 > }
 object { DoublePositionLight translate < MyDistance, 0.0, 0.0 >
  rotate < 0.0, 270.0, 0.0 > }
 object { DoublePositionLight translate < MyDistance, 0.0, 0.0 >
  rotate < 0.0, 315.0, 0.0 > }
}

union
{
 object { MyBalloonHull }
 object { Launcher }
// object { PositionLights } // slow, fast if commented out
}

background { rgb < 0.02392157,  0.03490196,  0.04627451 > }


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From: Sven Littkowski
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 18:54:18
Message: <5977cc1a$1@news.povray.org>
On 25.07.2017 14:51, Stephen wrote:
> On 7/25/2017 6:19 PM, Sven Littkowski wrote:
>> I admit, another problem I have, is based on the English language. Yes,
>> i understand it well, I even live in an English-speaking country now.
> 
> Jamaican English is an ittsy bitsy bit different from Standard English.
> In case you hadn't noticed.
> 
But how different is German to English? :-)

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From: Stephen
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 19:16:03
Message: <5977d133$1@news.povray.org>
On 7/25/2017 11:54 PM, Sven Littkowski wrote:
> On 25.07.2017 14:51, Stephen wrote:
>> On 7/25/2017 6:19 PM, Sven Littkowski wrote:
>>> I admit, another problem I have, is based on the English language. Yes,
>>> i understand it well, I even live in an English-speaking country now.
>>
>> Jamaican English is an ittsy bitsy bit different from Standard English.
>> In case you hadn't noticed.
>>
> But how different is German to English? :-)


How long have you lived there?
And English is a Germanic language.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_language

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Englische_Sprache



-- 

Regards
     Stephen


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From: Sven Littkowski
Subject: Re: QUESTION: Bump not showing?
Date: 25 Jul 2017 19:31:21
Message: <5977d4c9$1@news.povray.org>
On 25.07.2017 01:06, clipka wrote:
> Am 25.07.2017 um 01:41 schrieb Sven Littkowski:
>> Thanks a lot for your assistance, so far. But I admit, I am now irritate
d.
>>
>> Did you see the bump image I posted inside the other group (GENERAL)
>> with the same topic? Someone there told me to reduce the image size,
>> make it 16bit, and increase the contrast between dark and bright areas
>> there. I did that all. Still - no success.
> 
> I'm not sure what you are doing there. With the new bump map and using
> the scene from your original post, the attached image is what I get
> (after repairing broken comments and replacing the image_map with a
> plain white pigment).
> 
> That looks like bumps to me. (Excessively strong ones, actually; try
> `bump_size 10` or lower.)
> 
> 
> You still have some residual issues:
> 
> - Contrary to my recommendation, you apparently did not re-generate the
> image with higher contrast and bit depth, but rather just converted the
> old image and blurred it a bit. This still leaves you with artefacts
> from the original color banding.
> 
> - You are using `gamma 1.8` in a bump map. This indicates to me that
> /something/ regarding gamma is not quite right: Either you didn't
> understand what you were doing, or your bump map uses a poor encoding
> scheme that gives you more precision in black areas than it does in
> white areas. (To tell which of the two is the case, I'd have to know
> more about how you created the bump map in the first place.)
> 
> - Your radiosity block does not contain a `normal on` statement. As a
> consequence, if you turn on radiosity, you will not see any bumps in
> areas that are lit only indirectly.
> 
It seems, with my graphic program I can work only with one layer, if it
comes to 16bit. Cannot create any additional layers when in 16bit, and I
would need, in order to crate a similar pattern.

I use Photoshop v7.0. That is the reason, why I could not create the
image you suggested (and I agree on).   :-(

Will create a new bump image, but it will be again 8bit. But I create it
as a smaller version. Hoping for the best.

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